What He Said

[Guest Elizabeth K]

http://my.barackobama.com/Marriage

I've always believed that gay and lesbian Americans should be treated fairly and equally. I was reluctant to use the term marriage because of the very powerful traditions it evokes. And I thought civil union laws that conferred legal rights upon gay and lesbian couples were a solution.

But over the course of several years I've talked to friends and family about this. I've thought about members of my staff in long-term, committed, same-sex relationships who are raising kids together. Through our efforts to end the "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy, I've gotten to know some of the gay and lesbian troops who are serving our country with honor and distinction.

What I've come to realize is that for loving, same-sex couples, the denial of marriage equality means that, in their eyes and the eyes of their children, they are still considered less than full citizens.

Even at my own dinner table, when I look at Sasha and Malia, who have friends whose parents are same-sex couples, I know it wouldn't dawn on them that their friends' parents should be treated differently.

So I decided it was time to affirm my personal belief that same-sex couples should be allowed to marry.

I respect the beliefs of others, and the right of religious institutions to act in accordance with their own doctrines. But I believe that in the eyes of the law, all Americans should be treated equally. And where states enact same-sex marriage, no federal act should invalidate them.

Thank you,

Barack

[Svenna]

Thank you for sharing...

Svenna

[Guest LizMarie]

I think the key phrase here (politically) is "where states enact same-sex marriage, no federal act should invalidate them" as that does not commit him to any federal policy other than non-interference at the state level. It also allows him to "respect" the decisions of states that reject gay marriage. In actual political terms, it's a very weaselly worded statement, about what I've come to expect from Obama, particularly after his deliberate refusal to prosecute fraud on Wall Street that has literally cost the US trillions of dollars. (That's the budget deficit since he took office - bailing out his "bros" on Wall Street, like criminals such as Corzine.)

Barry's a stinking weasel and Mittens is worse. This election truly is the "lesser of two evils" in an election. If he was going to be bold, he'd mandate equal treatment under the law for all federal employees yet his administration has argued that one recent same-sex benefits decision only applies to that one couple and no one else!

Barry is a two faced liar and this is just a bid for votes. And it's not won my vote at all when I look at the statement.

[Guest JohnV]

A very powerful and moving message.

[Guest KimberlyF]

"I respect the beliefs of others, and the right of religious institutions to act in accordance with their own doctrines. But I believe that in the eyes of the law, all Americans should be treated equally. And where states enact same-sex marriage, no federal act should invalidate them."

So, states have to adopt same-sex marriage acts and THEN the Feds will respect their right to same sex marriage. Just like yesterday morning prior to the announcement.

All Americans SHOULD be treated equally but he's just not gonna do much for NC at this point in time. This too may evolve. Prob depends on poll numbers. That's how most moral people make moral decisions.

[Guest Guest_SL]

You have to look a person in the eyes or shake their hand or just chat with them to see there's no difference where it counts. I've shopped in the Village where often partners will work or own the same shop and the conversations are so everyday, work, weather, food. Never anything about orientation, proclivities, anything other than what could be expected from any other sales person, unless it's a bit more friendly, a bit more humorous tone. Sure, I've known some militant gay folks and they have an agenda that's just as counter productive as the people who set them apart. I merely disconnect. Walk away.

My dear friend, the only person I've come out to, and her wife lead as a normal a life and anyone and it's easy to see from their photos they're perfectly matched. They do have some really amazing friends who are full of life and pretty much ready to party at a moments notice but just good healthy throw down parties. I envy them but they've struggled for years and have finally gained acceptance all around. How can anyone think less of them? Why should anyone?

It'll take time.

SL

[Kyla666]

I really don't think it should be up to each state, I mean really? So... why not have it up to each state on Women's right? or Other races rights...

What if Mississippi done a Black BAN ... "No black people may be married in/around Mississippi... Everyone would go Crazy over this. And the same should be for Same sex . "some times the things i read and see make me not want to live in this world"

[Carolyn Marie]

The only way things will change dramatically is if the Supreme Court rules California's Prop 8 unconsitutional this summer, and the decision is written in such a way that it applies to all states.

The chances of that happening, IMO, are very, very slim.

HUG

Carolyn Marie

[Guest KimberlyF]

I really don't think it should be up to each state, I mean really? So... why not have it up to each state on Women's right? or Other races rights...

What if Mississippi done a Black BAN ... "No black people may be married in/around Mississippi... Everyone would go Crazy over this. And the same should be for Same sex . "some times the things i read and see make me not want to live in this world"

Slavery was made illegal by the 13th ammendment and women got the right to vote by the 19th. These were ratified by at least 3/4ths of the states to become Federal law. That would require 38 states at the moment.

[KathrynJulia]

Or we could wait 15 to 20 years and watch the change ocurr. Society is changing on the view of same sex marriage. People are looking at it and seeing the wrong in the bans. Many of you have never seen signs for Blacks to the back of the bus or this fountain for whites only or a sign posted in a taverns window No black person, Queers or livestock served in this establishment. I have. Some of us remember when Dr King was assasinated and the riots afterward as angry and very hurt black Americans took to the streets to express their rage. That was 35 to 45 years ago. Put a stinking sign like that up in a tavern window today and this lily white woman will look for a way to burn the place to the ground myself. Hate exists. It will always exist. We remove hate and ignorance one person at a time. My home state of Missouri passed a constitutional amendment two years ago banning same sex marriage. We'll change someday, We'll remove this crappy law and become civilized we may even stop hating people for their sexuality, even here in Missouri. Peace. Katheryn

Edited May 11, 2012 by Carolyn Marie
racial slur replaced

[Bulldog1948]

Or we could wait 15 to 20 years and watch the change ocurr. Society is changing on the view of same sex marriage. People are looking at it and seeing the wrong in the bans. Many of you have never seen signs for Blacks to the back of the bus or this fountain for whites only or a sign posted in a taverns window No black person, Queers or livestock served in this establishment. I have. Some of us remember when Dr King was assasinated and the riots afterward as angry and very hurt black Americans took to the streets to express their rage. That was 35 to 45 years ago. Put a stinking sign like that up in a tavern window today and this lily white woman will look for a way to burn the place to the ground myself. Hate exists. It will always exist. We remove hate and ignorance one person at a time. My home state of Missouri passed a constitutional amendment two years ago banning same sex marriage. We'll change someday, We'll remove this crappy law and become civilized we may even stop hating people for their sexuality, even here in Missouri. Peace. Katheryn

Katheryn,

You are so right in what you've said. We and some others here, are in that age range where we can remember it all happening in the 50s and 60s. From the Back of the bus, to no service, Vietnam, King and both Kennedy assinations, the horrible race riots, the Democratic Convention riots. And to all of you youngsters here, This era of 1955-1970 wa filled with racial hatreds,violence,murders,discriminations, just a horrible time frame in American history. And, what we older folks lived through is not accurately portrayed in todays history books. Plus, the anti-war demostrations and bombings. Man, you had to live through it to try and understand that America went through a huge internal eruption back then.

Mike

[Sally]

We all want changes, especially if it concerns us directly and we want them now - politics does not work that way, everything must be discussed, argued, torn apart, reassembled to vaguely resemble its former self and then finally moved from committees to the Congress where the House Bill and the Senate Bill seldom resemble each other at all.

So if each bill passes a compromise bill must be made to appease both houses of Congress and then sent to the President for his (or by that time possibly her - you were expecting something right away) signature.

Why should states determine this for themselves and not nationally?

Ever been to a wedding?

I have been to over 200 as a guest, musician or photographer so I have heard this part a lot, the Minister, Priest, Rabbi or Justice of the Peace always says, "By the power vested in me by the State of (name of state goes here)", never, "By the power vested in me by the United States Government." - sort of makes the case for states self determination in this area.

Love ya,

Sally

[RoxannaBell]

The only thing I would change about his statement is all PEOPLE should be treated equally, not just all Americans. I think anyone who has a problem with what he said is just going to have a problem with him no matter what he says. I, myself, have yet to hear that man say anything I did not agree with. To take a stand on this in an election year is brave (as Ellen DeGeneres said on her show recently). Change takes time.

[Guest LizMarie]

Some others are starting to read Barry's statement in exactly the same way that I did - as a cynical yet meaningless jumble of words intended to solely solicit campaign contributions from the GLBT community without any commitment to actually do anything.

http://stonezone.com/

Check out Roger Stone's "OBAMA'S GAY MARRIAGE HEAD FAKE" article at the above web site. He pretty much calls Obama on the carpet. Heck, even penis Cheney went further than this in supporting gay marriage and that was clear back in 2004.

[Guest KimberlyF]

I, myself, have yet to hear that man say anything I did not agree with.

These are some of his major public positions on this one issue. Are you aware of all of them and do you support them?

1996: “I favor legalizing same-sex marriages” was an answer included on a signed questionnaire to a Chicago gay community newspaper when Mr. Obama was running for the Illinois state Senate.

 2004: As a U.S. Senate candidate, “Marriage is between a man and a woman.” In the same interview, Mr. Obama said he wanted to ensure gays and lesbians have “the rights of citizenship” but noted, “I don’t think marriage is a civil right.”

 2008: Running for president, again says marriage should be limited to unions between a man and a woman. “For me as a Christian, it’s also a sacred union… God’s in the mix,” he says in an interview with the Rev. Rick Warren, a leading evangelical minister.

2010: After signing the repeal DADT, Mr. Obama tells reporters that “my feelings are constantly evolving” on gay marriage.

2011: “I’m still working on it,” Mr. Obama tells ABC News when asked if he would change his mind .

2012: “I think same-sex couples should be able to get married,” Mr. Obama tells an interviewer for ABC.

His actions seem pretty political to me.

[KathrynJulia]

I'd like to appologize for the word I used in my earlier post that Carolyn removed, It was not meant as a slur, only illustrative of the time and place and it shows the ignorance of only 40 years ago. I saw those signs. I find them offensive and sickening. I had so many wonderful black friends in the Army who I would not have hesitated for a second to risk my life for. I've had multiple employees who worked for me when my wife and I managed apartments who were black and gay. And the two black ladies that I worked shoulder to shoulder with in a tiny little lab became two very close friends of mine. I have no patience with bigotry and predjudice. Gerladine and Sandra grew up with prejudice and they were leery of this big white dude in their midst. We had to change, they as much as I, but we did change because we talked to one another and we showed we cared about one another and they told me what it was like for them growing up around white rednecks. When predjudiced white doctors ignored one of these little black ladies and instead wanted to talk to only me, they didn't like it when I ignored them. Told them to talk to Sandra or Geraldine politely or get out of our lab.

Same sex marriage is still treated to ignorance and bigotry and slurs that are just as hurtful as racial predjudice was. We defeat it by changing one person at a time. We do it because it's the right thing to do. We use Dr Kings example by changing attitudes peacefully. Not violently. It may take a generation or two, but it's going to change. Katheryn

[RoxannaBell]

I, myself, have yet to hear that man say anything I did not agree with.

These are some of his major public positions on this one issue. Are you aware of all of them and do you support them?

1996: "I favor legalizing same-sex marriages" was an answer included on a signed questionnaire to a Chicago gay community newspaper when Mr. Obama was running for the Illinois state Senate.

2004: As a U.S. Senate candidate, "Marriage is between a man and a woman." In the same interview, Mr. Obama said he wanted to ensure gays and lesbians have "the rights of citizenship" but noted, "I don't think marriage is a civil right."

2008: Running for president, again says marriage should be limited to unions between a man and a woman. "For me as a Christian, it's also a sacred union… God's in the mix," he says in an interview with the Rev. Rick Warren, a leading evangelical minister.

2010: After signing the repeal DADT, Mr. Obama tells reporters that "my feelings are constantly evolving" on gay marriage.

2011: "I'm still working on it," Mr. Obama tells ABC News when asked if he would change his mind .

2012: "I think same-sex couples should be able to get married," Mr. Obama tells an interviewer for ABC.

His actions seem pretty political to me.

Uh... people are allowed to change their minds. In reading what you quoted him as saying in different years, without actually taking the time to verify it, I'd say it was clear that's what happened. And hey, in an election year, isn't the whole point to get as many votes as possible? That doesn't mean he's lying to get votes, but it IS the point of running for office.

[Guest KimberlyF]

I, myself, have yet to hear that man say anything I did not agree with.

These are some of his major public positions on this one issue. Are you aware of all of them and do you support them?

1996: "I favor legalizing same-sex marriages" was an answer included on a signed questionnaire to a Chicago gay community newspaper when Mr. Obama was running for the Illinois state Senate.

2004: As a U.S. Senate candidate, "Marriage is between a man and a woman." In the same interview, Mr. Obama said he wanted to ensure gays and lesbians have "the rights of citizenship" but noted, "I don't think marriage is a civil right."

2008: Running for president, again says marriage should be limited to unions between a man and a woman. "For me as a Christian, it's also a sacred union… God's in the mix," he says in an interview with the Rev. Rick Warren, a leading evangelical minister.

2010: After signing the repeal DADT, Mr. Obama tells reporters that "my feelings are constantly evolving" on gay marriage.

2011: "I'm still working on it," Mr. Obama tells ABC News when asked if he would change his mind .

2012: "I think same-sex couples should be able to get married," Mr. Obama tells an interviewer for ABC.

His actions seem pretty political to me.

Uh... people are allowed to change their minds. In reading what you quoted him as saying in different years, without actually taking the time to verify it, I'd say it was clear that's what happened. And hey, in an election year, isn't the whole point to get as many votes as possible? That doesn't mean he's lying to get votes, but it IS the point of running for office.

Intereating. I think I said he was acting political which is the same you kinda said-getting as many votes as possible-I never used the word lying. You brought that to the convo

He's gone 360. I think some are hoping he doesn't change his mind another 180.

In your first post you made two statements that jump off the page:

"I think anyone who has a problem with what he said is just going to have a problem with him no matter what he says."

"

"I, myself, have yet to hear that man say anything I did not agree with. "

Given the quotes I listed that he's made (you can check them all) do you still think with him now getting back to a place he was at in '96, people have no right to be skeptical of him as you stated in your post?

You never said if you agreed with all of those quotes as you've stated in your second statement now that I've made them clear.

[Guest Elizabeth K]

I, myself, have yet to hear that man say anything I did not agree with.

These are some of his major public positions on this one issue. Are you aware of all of them and do you support them?

1996: "I favor legalizing same-sex marriages" was an answer included on a signed questionnaire to a Chicago gay community newspaper when Mr. Obama was running for the Illinois state Senate.

2004: As a U.S. Senate candidate, "Marriage is between a man and a woman." In the same interview, Mr. Obama said he wanted to ensure gays and lesbians have "the rights of citizenship" but noted, "I don't think marriage is a civil right."

2008: Running for president, again says marriage should be limited to unions between a man and a woman. "For me as a Christian, it's also a sacred union… God's in the mix," he says in an interview with the Rev. Rick Warren, a leading evangelical minister.

2010: After signing the repeal DADT, Mr. Obama tells reporters that "my feelings are constantly evolving" on gay marriage.

2011: "I'm still working on it," Mr. Obama tells ABC News when asked if he would change his mind .

2012: "I think same-sex couples should be able to get married," Mr. Obama tells an interviewer for ABC.

His actions seem pretty political to me.

I agree, these are all political statements - and he IS a politician and running for reelection. How can we expect anything else.

The background on all this and I am no expert - seems to be that President Obama had reconciled in his mind a need for recognition of 'civil unions' substituting for same-sex 'marriages,' This is a legal instrument and a bit different from standard government sanctioned marriage unions. A lot of confusion there. He himself said in this recent backing of 'same-sex marriage' that these civil unions would be essentially relegating same-sex couples to a lesser degree of citizenship. He therefore, in my opinion, was able to rise to the point where he feels ALL Americans should have the same rights, therefore supports same-sex marriages as being the same as the bigender marriages..

In our society - again my opinion - sometimes the argument is that marriage is 'sacred.' This implies that it is sanctioned by GOD. This brings in the Church or Synagog (Et al) into the formula, and it by default requires that those who KNOW GOD's WILL can then judge if the marriage is 'sacred' or not. Same sex marriage is usually "just not what GOD wants," say those who oppose it.

So we have millions of marriages that are performed in a civil ceremony outside the church or synagog. The last I heard, these are still 100% legal. And if people are married in a religious ceremony, and never obtained a civil marriage license (or forget to turn it in) then they are NOT married, not in the eyes of the law. What does that tell you?

So when you hear objections to same-sex marriage, it is objections against a CIVIL matter, not a religious matter.

I always say, if you don't like same-sex marriages, don't marry a gay person.

But again? Obama's stand? Win or lose, right or wrong? He made history as the first American President actively in office to ever support same-sex marriage.

Lizzy

[Guest Janice Lynn]

If Obama means what he says he would need to oppose any attempt

to overrule North Carolina's recent passage of a law against same-sex

marriage.

That's a bit unsettling if Obama is a man of his word.

For me it seems his recent statement is consistent with election year

politics. He has left himself an easy out.

[Guest Donna Jean]

.

It seems that at election time we must decide if we want to get hit upside the head with a brick or a 2x4....

It's not easy......

There is a lot to factor in....

I've voted on ever federal, state and local election since 1968......

I will continue to do so........

Arguing politics is like arguing about beer.....

"Taste Great!"

"Less Filling!"

Dee Jay

[Guest Micha]

The political process, inefficient and frustrating as hell.

The idea that the fed should respect each state's "right" to ignore the civil rights of minorities is absurd. Obama's rhetoric is not unlike any other politician or media talking head, and when he's supposedly "on our side," it's that much more irritating.

[RoxannaBell]

Kimberly,

I have already said that I agree with whatever I have actually heard (with my own ears) Obama say. The old quotes you list, well... gee, I would hate for anyone to judge me on things I said before I became old and wise. Life is about learning and growing and becoming better people. I would give the President the same opportunity for growth that I'd give anyone else. And like Lizzy pointed out, the man made history by being the first American President actively in office to ever support same-sex marriage. He also made history by being the first black President of this country. I'd call that change. I'd call it admirable. I'd call it an accomplishment (or 2) to be damn proud of. Like I said before, anyone who really has a problem with him just has a problem with him. That is MY opinion. If your opinion is different, that's okay. If you are here to pick fights, then you are barking up the wrong tree. And, honestly, your posts (at least in this thread) come off just that way.

[Guest Maria_B]

In the thick of things I can see how Australia has it good in a lot of ways. But to choose between Red Head Redemption or Alone in the Abbott is still a rather... Unfulfilling task, and it's both a right and RESPONSIBILITY to vote over here XD. Fines if you don't .

Personally, I prefer our choices over Ready to Romney II and Obama-man (That one is Bomber-man).

TO THE TOPIC:

I think it's more amazing, really, that he says all this while being proclaimed a Devout Christian. Not because those two don't mold, because personal belief says they easily can, but because other people see someone supporting equal marriage and still believe they are a Devout Christian.

That my friends is change a'plenty ^_~

[Guest KimberlyF]

Kimberly,

I have already said that I agree with whatever I have actually heard (with my own ears) Obama say. The old quotes you list, well... gee, I would hate for anyone to judge me on things I said before I became old and wise. Life is about learning and growing and becoming better people. I would give the President the same opportunity for growth that I'd give anyone else. And like Lizzy pointed out, the man made history by being the first American President actively in office to ever support same-sex marriage. He also made history by being the first black President of this country. I'd call that change. I'd call it admirable. I'd call it an accomplishment (or 2) to be damn proud of. Like I said before, anyone who really has a problem with him just has a problem with him. That is MY opinion. If your opinion is different, that's okay. If you are here to pick fights, then you are barking up the wrong tree. And, honestly, your posts (at least in this thread) come off just that way.

Once again, I'm here to pick a fight, but you can speak in absolutes and state "Like I said before, anyone who really has a problem with him just has a problem with him. That is MY opinion." and not see the inflammatory nature of that statement? What I did in my next few posts is try to show why I am underwhelmed with his words and this position specifically.

This topic shouldnt be on the general board but on the political.

Have a nice day. We'll just look at this issue differently.