Near 6 Months -- When nerves reconnect--

[VickySGV]

I am a week from being 6 months post op, and for the last few days I have been re-experiencing some nerve action that is driving me kind of nutty. As it was in the first few weeks, nerves are giving sensations that tell me something is in a different place than I know it is. At the minute its my clitoris and surrounding nerves, which, while not numb exactly, have not been sensitive in an erotic way, but that seems to be changing!! Until now, the prostate area has made dilation pleasant, but the new nerve action is nearly an exquisite pain at the minute and says I have something several inches from where its been sutured in. No specifics on the anatomy though!! This is G rated remember!!

I was warned that it might take this long or a bit longer to have everything fully come together, so let that be a lesson to me, and to others that our healing does take time but will get there.

[Guest Billie De]

Answered that question... Was wondering if there was/would be any Phantom feelings of the missing appendage.

[Guest Maria_B]

Oh what unpleasant pleasantries you must grant your nerves Give them time, they're simply... uncultured at the moment.

[Guest Jenn348]

Interesting. Would I be correct in assuming that you are having phantom sensations of something that was once there?

There was an interesting study conducted where they tested the hypothesis that MTFs would have a lower incidence of phantom sensations than people who were operated on in this fashion for other reasons, such as cancer. http://chip.ucsd.edu/pdf/occurence_phantom_genitalia.pdf

[VickySGV]

While others may have "phantom" member pain the same as amputee's have, what I am gettiing is nerve sensations from tissue that was fully used in my vulvar and vaginal construction. The sensation though is telling my mind, that tthis was from penile shaft tissue <used in the labia> and it feels like it is in the old position about an inch OUTSIDE the of my labia, when in fact it is inside the lips of the labia. A piece of the glans that was used for my clitoris is still telling me it is in the location it was when I was wooden!!

My thinking mind is saying "Oh, thats your labia minora or clitoris" when I process the feeling, but its first action is to tell me its where my engorged penis used to be. More of a dissociation rather than phantom, because as I say the tissue with the nerves is still there, it just moved down the block to a new address but did not leave a forwarding order for one part of my brain.

"He moved from 213 Main St to her place at 415 Main Street. " "When you gonna get the signal delivered right??" It is not actually painful now, just surprising, and when it keeps up for a bit its a tad nerve wracking.

[Drea]

There was an interesting study conducted where they tested the hypothesis that MTFs would have a lower incidence of phantom sensations than people who were operated on in this fashion for other reasons, such as cancer. http://chip.ucsd.edu/pdf/occurence_phantom_genitalia.pdf

A small point. The referenced document was a hypothesis. It is not a study. They say the hypothesis is being tested and provide some anecdotal information suggesting there may be some merit. I note the distinction since I have seen claims in news reports and even opinion pieces referred under the guise of "studies show"

I think the "nerves reconnect" thing is a bit of supposition. Something claimed to be associated with the zaps. The likelihood of a nerve having been broken getting re-connected, seems improbably. Certainly there is nerve trauma and some recovery over time from the trauma. Too a degree however I think some of the recovery of feeling is more an adjustment to the reduced number of active nerves feeling normal and recognizing what seemed like light sensations as normal.

[Guest Jenn348]

There was an interesting study conducted where they tested the hypothesis that MTFs would have a lower incidence of phantom sensations than people who were operated on in this fashion for other reasons, such as cancer. http://chip.ucsd.edu/pdf/occurence_phantom_genitalia.pdf

A small point. The referenced document was a hypothesis. It is not a study. They say the hypothesis is being tested and provide some anecdotal information suggesting there may be some merit. I note the distinction since I have seen claims in news reports and even opinion pieces referred under the guise of "studies show"

I think the "nerves reconnect" thing is a bit of supposition. Something claimed to be associated with the zaps. The likelihood of a nerve having been broken getting re-connected, seems improbably. Certainly there is nerve trauma and some recovery over time from the trauma. Too a degree however I think some of the recovery of feeling is more an adjustment to the reduced number of active nerves feeling normal and recognizing what seemed like light sensations as normal.

Read the full document. They start with hypothesis and then do a meta-study to gather data, then provide the results.

[Drea]

There was an interesting study conducted where they tested the hypothesis that MTFs would have a lower incidence of phantom sensations than people who were operated on in this fashion for other reasons, such as cancer. http://chip.ucsd.edu/pdf/occurence_phantom_genitalia.pdf

A small point. The referenced document was a hypothesis. It is not a study. They say the hypothesis is being tested and provide some anecdotal information suggesting there may be some merit. I note the distinction since I have seen claims in news reports and even opinion pieces referred under the guise of "studies show"

I think the "nerves reconnect" thing is a bit of supposition. Something claimed to be associated with the zaps. The likelihood of a nerve having been broken getting re-connected, seems improbably. Certainly there is nerve trauma and some recovery over time from the trauma. Too a degree however I think some of the recovery of feeling is more an adjustment to the reduced number of active nerves feeling normal and recognizing what seemed like light sensations as normal.

Read the full document. They start with hypothesis and then do a meta-study to gather data, then provide the results.

I did, it is "provisional data" from a "few dozen" participants. There is no control group referenced as comparison. It isn't a study.

[Paula ult]

For the first 5-6 months or so the zapps or sparkers especially the big ones, were kinda disruptive, i would have to stop what i was doing until they subsided.

Paula

[Guest Billie De]

I hope this question doesn't go over the rating threshold.

You really SPARKed my Curiosity now.

Now since all the Parts have been reused do you feel like you have any muscle control there. Similar to Keagles.. I was told to practice/exercise that area as time gets closer to my surgery to help control bladder/ureatha function along with sensation for a future partner. Does it feel like your swelling when getting aroused or are the blood vessels that control that part completely removed. I have heard that different surgeons have different techniques and since I am planning on using Bowers myself I am very interested in your recover progress.

[VickySGV]

Neither anal or urethral sphincters are affected by the surgery I had, since both are out of the surgical field. I would have to call Dr. Bowers office myself to specifically check on where my erectile tissue really went (maybe in the pathology tray). During dilation, I do not really experience "engorgement" per se. Dilation for me is not a truly erotic event, even though it does "abuse " all the parts as far as sensation goes. As far as muscle issues go, I can manipulate them quite well, and either tighten on the dilator, or can roll the muscle contraction a bit and force it out of the neo-vagina. (I learned that one from an accidental sneeze at about 3 weeks post op). One of the arts to dilating is to relax those muscles on the pelvic floor to allow comfortable insertion.

Dr. Suporn in Thailand uses absolutely as much of the erectile engorgment tissue as he can, and it sometime is his downfall and a need for revision in some patients. Dr. Bowers and her staff are great for information, even if you do not have a confirmed surgery date. General good health and weight condiions will do you far more good than any special type of exercise, but incorporate whatever exercise into a regimen that you want, just do not overdo the exercise and put yourself in the hospital.

[Guest LizMarie]

I've experienced other nerve damage (due to CNS sarcoid when younger and then chemo from cancer several years ago as well) and nerves "reconnecting" does occur. In fact, while in the army, the then chief neurologist at Walter Reed made a video using me as a subject to demonstrate side effects of nerves reconnecting, such as when I blink, one side of my mouth twitches ever so slightly, or when I eat spicy foods, my forehead becomes very moist (linkage to taste buds).

Drea is correct in my experience in that physically severed nerves rarely reconnect. Instead where alternate routes exist, the body begins to try to use those, hence the side effects I described above. My oncologist told me that nerves can very rarely reconnect but the more frequent situation is rerouting and relearning what sensations mean when delivered over new routes.

[VickySGV]

I'll take the results I am getting however they come, the exact physiology does not matter to me. The results are making my life generally pleasant, but adventurous for sure.

My real point in making this post was not to begin a science lesson or debate, but was to let people on the Pre Op end be aware that healing does take quite a bit of time (hence 6 month report) and whatever the mechanics involved, the new vulvar and vaginal areas will go through changes.

I have read people who make claims of immediate total sensation changes after surgery, with sensitivity that could detect a 0.02 seismic event on the other side of the Atlantic Rift, and read others who are horrified and nearly in tears that they have a slow time getting the desired sensations to occur, and fret to the point of becoming depressed and sick because they did not come out of the surgery ready to orgasm up to sub-orbital heights.

It is not terribly relevant to know that end A and end B of a nerve that got nicked during surgery searched high and low for each other, shook hands and got plugged into each other and make love on the spot. It makes no difference to me if that did not really happen. If one of the nerves on my scrotal skin that was kept in tact and healthy has decided to give regular news reports on what is happening to it neighboring tissue areas, that is great too and gives me the feeling that makes me happy.

The big point is that nerve connections in my brain are finally having fun and know that life is good and right as it should be as it should be. I am sorry for making a misleading title, if indeed I did, and also I am happy that the real science has been introduced for those that enjoy it, it was just not my major point. In 5 days, I will be Six months post, nine days after my 4th hormone birthday. I love it.

[Guest LizMarie]

My apologies, Vicky! I certainly didn't intend to detract from your message!

And I want to say thank you. Many, many people simply move on after SRS and I do not begrudge them that but you, and others who have remained available are an invaluable resource for those of us much earlier on a similar road. Thank you.

[VickySGV]

Liz -- I often try to be humorus, but sometimes my humor is a bit dry, and people miss it for what it is. That is my bad. I know people who have had terrible nerve damage from Guillain-Barre Syndrome, and have watched their painfilled lives for the time it takes to recover from it. The human nervous system is indeed something to marvel at, so far mine is doing whatever it does.

[Drea]

Does it feel like your swelling when getting aroused or are the blood vessels that control that part completely removed. I have heard that different surgeons have different techniques and since I am planning on using Bowers myself I am very interested in your recover progress.

Some of the erectile tissue is generally retained as a portion of the clitoral area.

It is not uncommon after SRS, from the tauma in the area and I suppose further contributed by being off hormones for the weeks leading up to surgery, for the new postie to get that "swelling" feeling at seemingly random times even if they no longer had such function prior to SRS.

Eventually that tends to normalize and "swelling" in the clitoral area would only be associated with arousal states. I suppose however that since such functioning is not altered, just the amount of erectile tissue and skin over it changed, if one no longer had the ability to get any degree or "swelling" due to hormones pre-SRS they probably won't experience it afterwards.

[Guest LizMarie]

Thank you for the further clarification, Drea! Learning the details of these things is very helpful.

[Guest NatashaJade]

My .02

Strangely, I never had any zaps or sparks. Perhaps it has something to do with Brassard's technique. I did have the experience of remapping for the first few months, but that subsided. When I get aroused, I feel a swelling akin to being construct, but different in how it comes about and subsides (obviously my surgeon left some erectile tissue in place).

As the other ladies who have gone through this have said, this is an interesting and often fun process of discovery. What I've found is that what is gone is mostly forgotten and what is there now feels as it should. I will not say any more in this G rated forum...

In any case, if you're curious, ask. I'm sure most of us here would be happy to tell you how we experience or have experienced our newer physiology.

xoxo

[Drea]

Strangely, I never had any zaps or sparks. Perhaps it has something to do with Brassard's technique. I did have the experience of remapping for the first few months, but that subsided.

Well far as I can tell it is only supposition that zaps are nerves reconnecting....a convenient explanation. That doesn't mean nerves don't reconnect. Obviously you have equivalent happening without the zaps.

[Guest N. Jane]

I had surgery last fall and experienced "zaps" during healing. In talking to other women who had the same surgery, it is very common. Some of the zaps feel like electric shocks and are so strong and startling as to cause one to jump!

After SRS (39.5 years ago) I didn't experience any phantom sensations but was very aware that things were closer to where they should be. It was like my brain/body mapping had been screwed up before and after surgery it was closer. Even after all these years, I am still aware of the differences. I did have to re-learn some muscle control - my biggest problem with surgery was learning how to urinate again - I couldn't figure out which muscle to relax LOL!

Most things seem to come naturally. I do swell (noticeably!) and get wet when aroused but it took YEARS to develop a G-spot (which works quite well thank you LOL!).

[Charlize]

Vicki, I want to thank you for your post. While my health and circumstances may keep me from SRS i enjoyed your explanation. I got a good giggle with the address change. Hopefully the post man will find you again soon.

Hugs,

Charlie