Female to Male FTM Transsexual Transman Forums > I feel like I cant compete against cismen in some

[Guest Jay Smooth]

Never said fighting was good at all, And you misunderstood what I was saying, And no i dont believe this is how I will be treated im just saying im not blamming me for anything again you just misunderstood ehat I was saying

[Guest Ebany]

Jay,

the whole time I was growing up, my favorite 'hobby' was beating the crap out of the males at school. It was the surest way to make me feel better. My sister is 5'2" 95 lbs and can kick the crap out of men 3 times her size... she's done it. being smaller does NOT mean you can't protect yourself. If you're worried about being physically assaulted, take some self defense classes. join a martial arts class. You may think that nobody that's not black can understand what it's like to be part of a minority... but try growing up the only non-Christian at your school until well into high school (and then for only a semester before back to the only one) try growing up with an obvious native heritage in an anti-native community. try growing up in a house without any affection and being raised by someone who told you at the age of 7 that you're a burden and you ruined their life; that spent any money not on bills on alcohol.

I'm not advocating violence by the way. personally, I think you should turn the little illegitimate children over to the police for prosecution. what I am saying is: MOST OF US came from crap. LIFE is HARD. if you can't put the bad crap in perspective, you're never going to be happy. the ONLY one that can make you happy is you. SUCK IT UP and use it for your college admittance essay. overcoming adversity is a great topic to use. Nothing that happens while you're in high school matters. Shove it aside and plan for the rest of your life. Set yourself up for a GREAT life. Focus on your education so you can get a great job in a field you'll love. Everything else will flow into place if you set yourself on the path to follow your dreams.

-Danny

[Guest Jay Smooth]

Im not gonna argue about who has it worse because i have been told some pretty rude things by my mother and father and their is a big difference when it comes to christianity in the African American world look it up, This is why lgb have a hard time getting accepted and know the T and agsin my counselor who is not black said it, And going to church with that in a black church, im not always gonna have happy days gender dysphoria always bothers me at some point

[Guest Ebany]

Jay,

I feel I should apologize. I was having a bad night and was rather irritable. You are always so negative. If you only ever look at what you can't do or the obstacles in your path then you won't ever be happy. Yeah, I had a rough childhood; a lot of us here did. I choose not to dwell on what I had no control over. Just try looking on the bright side once in a while. We'll continue to support you when you're feeling dysphoric. You can have a great life if you just take the time to concentrate on your education for now. relationships and jobs can wait until you graduate from college/trade school. College/trade school will provide you with the ability to get a job that'll let you transition as fully as you want to. Keep your chin up, it gets better.

-Danny

[Charlize]

Jay, my shoes walk a different path but in many ways it has been the same. I had a hard time as a kid in school and always had to man up as much as i could to avoid being a punching bag. I think that the thrusting out of the chest and always to push down others rides in the need to feel better about ourselves whether related to our status as a male or about other aspects of our lives. I'm sorry you feel and have been forced into what i was. Being myself to any extent was just not possible in the 50's and 60's. by the 70's there were very small spots of light but before then anyone one like us was a target for everybody. A GLBT movement did not exist. Things are getting better but in different communities things are more or less accepting. Many move later in life for that reason. it does get better with time both for us as individuals and it seems for the entire community as more of us find acceptance and honesty in our worlds.

Hugs,

Charlie

[Guest Jay Smooth]

Im listening to you guys

[JJ]

Jay those of us who are talking to you are trying to help. And while I cannot of course know what it is to live in your world and be African American I just don't buy that all African American's face less acceptance than all others or that hate and rejection is any worse coming from an African-American church than any other. I agree that statistically you face less acceptance but there are huge variations. Have you looked at where I live? It is usually cited as the most conservative area of the country socially and I live in one of the most conservative areas in that state. I am the only trans person ever to have come out in this county. There are more churches than businesses with the largest being the Southern Baptist-definitely not friendly to trans by doctrine-and locally they are considered liberal.

I have successfully transitioned here because I worked very hard to keep my attitude positive. If I had seen myself as a victim I would have become one. If I had felt sorry for myself and had a chip on my shoulder I may well not have been able to live here-or even survived. In the 9 years I have lived here I know of more than one person seen as undesirable who met with an unfortunate accident.

And I can give you more reasons than you would believe for me to be a victim. I saw someone decapitated when I was 5 and was in an accident with a fatality i saw also at 5 followed by sitting in the lap of the only person who loved and accepted me when she was killed in a wreck when I was 8. It was bad enough that I had screaming flashbacks for 20 years. I was also raped at 6 and regularly beaten till I was bruised and sometimes bleeding by my towns leading citizen grandparent. He was such a nice guy everyone thought it had to be because I was such an awful child. On top of being trans-though I didn't know the word. The day I "became a woman" is seared in my memory even all these decades later. I could go on and on. Life has not beem esay and I was proud to have survived before I knew the word transman.

But while I am a survivor I am not a victim. It took a long time and I paid dearly for that knowledge and would like to spare you the price. We all have bad in our lives and we can all find excuses to feel we have it bad. Being trans is bad. No question but how does focusing on that and not on what can be good, on making life the best you can. make it better instead? Are you putting as much effort into your studies as feeling bad about your life so you will be prepared to make a good and positive life for yourself in a less negative environment? Are you trying to make yourself a good person others respect? Not for size or gender but for inner strength and the courage of their convictions?

When you respect yourself and see yourself as a strong person facing and overcoming challenges then other people will too even if they do not agree with what you do or are. People will accept a lot from someone they like and look for excuses to reject someone they don't. And no one likes a victim. Pity sometimes, unless they see them as prey instead, but like? Just not the way humans of any race are made.

It feels like when you say I can't understand that you were not actually listening to what I said but dismissing me on the basis of stereotypes you have in your head. Please think about the implications of that kind of reaction and thinking. We have as a culture and a society done some horrific things to each other on just that basis and we all lost. We will be better people and the world a better place when we learn to look at individuals and hear past the prejudices that stereotyping causes in all who do it.

Johnny

[Guest MrAwesome]

I actually find it a little bit personally insulting to say that a transman is a weaker vessel, or that we can't understand what you're going through because we're not black. Or that it's wrong to be bisexual or gay and using your religion as an excuse to back up such silly notions. I've always expected from myself what anyone would expect of other boys - and I lived up to that. Even Pre-T. It's self-defeating to say "I can't do it because I was born X", and that's saying that no other transmen can do it either. And using your race and religion as an excuse? I mean that's what's at the very core of Racism, Sexism, etc etc, focusing on how all of us are different instead of how we're all the same. If there's to ever be any real progress in our society we need to stop focusing on our differences and focus on what makes us alike. We're all human beings. Some of us fall in love - and that can be with a man or a woman or an intersexed person or a transgender. It doesn't matter, as long as you love that person that's what should be important. There are people in a heterosexual relationship who go around cheating on their partners, and there's homosexual couples who've been faithfully dedicated to their partners for years. Some of us are black, white, asian, etc etc. It doesn't matter any more than it matters what color eyes or hair you have.

[Guest Jay Smooth]

No I said woman are the weaker vessle and its true,And yes the bible says that being gay is wrong as well as having sex before marriage or cheating ect ect...... And you missed my point i said in the African American community its worse when it comes to lgbt black people are harder on christianity

[Guest LuceKeagan]

I hate to say this Jay but by the standards you are talking about your "vessel" (vessel being body) is female. And by the standards you are quoting (the bible) your body will always be weaker, even if you change it with hormones. Just because the bible says something doesn't make it true.

Frankly I'm insulted by this and surely you disagree as well?

Sex before marriage? I feel pretty comfortable guessing over 70% of the youth/teen in your church are probably guilty of that. Infidelity? I won't even touch that subject because it is a touchy subject for most religions. The bible also says things about stoning people and other questionable things. Just because the bible says something doesn't make it so in the modern world. The bible also says to love thy neighbor. It doesn't say "love thy neighbor unless....or only if...."

Also remember not all African American communities are the same. The one here certainly is not like you have described, and I feel comfortable making that statement. And this is Texas for crying out loud, the south. In fact I asked a couple of guys from different cultures at the local LGBTQ college group I belong to what their thoughts were on this. Most of them noted very little difference in rate of acceptance or not by their families and racial communities...unless religion was involved, and even then the only times it made a huge impact was with the family, not the whole -local- community. Actually the ones that have the biggest troubles it seems from the information gathered were those of Asian and Hispanic descent.

Another thing that was noted is that it is getting easier with younger generations. The younger, more educated generations are much more accepting than those of some of our brothers and sisters here on Laura's.

So really if you give yourself a chance to build a good future foundation and shed as much self doubt as you can your future looks bright. You'll get a future that the LGBTQ community has been fighting for long before I was even born and much more. It may not be great now but compared to how it was even just 5 years ago it is getting better. The last two years even has seen some really big changes for the LGBTQ community.

Oh and by the way for anyone who was wondering, quoted directly from a Merriam-Webster dictionary:

sex·ism noun \ˈsek-ˌsi-zəm\

Definition of SEXISM

1: prejudice or discrimination based on sex; especially : discrimination against women

2: behavior, conditions, or attitudes that foster stereotypes of social roles based on sex

sex·ist adjective or noun

It's very similar to a problem we all have which is transphobia. And that is the main reason I find posts containing sexist comments and stereotypes to be very damaging and completely unnecessary. If one were to go through this thread and replace the word woman or women with transman or transwoman or even transgendered person it would sadly mirror many hate posts on other forums and that just makes me a little sick and very sad. It hurts to see that in a community like Laura's Playground. But I agree it is something that does need discussed if we ever stand a chance of helping change the views of others about gender and gender roles as well as sex based stereotypes.

Jay can you please reply with something other than race comments, sexism, or religion? Because when you reply with those kind of comments it makes me feel like you aren't even reading any replies the rest of us are posting to try and help you and understand.

[Guest Jay Smooth]

Yes I know their are plenty of people who have sex before marriage im not judging you, Yes it said he who is without sin cast the first stone im not casting one im just saying what the bible said, Yes the bible says women are the weaker vessle, Know as far as being trans I when I get on T ill alot more muscle mass, And you seem to not get thats the reason that I cant get on T in the first place because my family is very religious and if you had support or is not in my situation then how are you gonna help me the only thing you csn do is encourage me thats it because the only thing you get is that being trans is hard unless you have experienced discriminatipn from your own family and parents

[Guest Christian_the_FTM]

........ you think we have all been encouraged???

Are you so self absorbed to realize that other people aren't accepted either.

I was raised that you had to be just so. You had to dress, talk, and act just so.

I have a perfection issue now that keeps me locked in the closet...

I tried to come out once and my mom used my mental illness against me...

But then again she is very close minded and its for the best.

I have self harmed because I am not good enough, I am not perfect.

I will never be good enough, and I will never be encouraged...

Have you ever been pushed away and told off because you wanted a hug and since it was in public it wasn't acceptable behavior?

Ever have to listen about every single person's faults your parents have seen?

And told what you are doing wrong more often then not?

This is my reality, and has been since I was very little.

So don't you dare say we don't know discrimination. Everyone has a story.

I wish you would read 'A Child Called It' if you think your life is horrible.

[Guest Dragonseeker]

I sure wish I was by my family. It's been almost 2 years and it's still the elephant in the living room. My mom has told me my extended family will never accept me, and my dad said I have the mentality of a 12 year old in some parts of my brain due to heavy medication that was given to me due to a heart defect I was born with so I "don't really know what I am yet." (I'm almost 20. I think I know what gender I am). Everything is blamed on my heart issue, it happens so much it's basically a cop out so the real issues are ignored. My sister said I'd be dead to her if I transitioned also. The only one who supports me in my family is my brother which is great but it'd be nice if my parents and sister did too. You're not the only one who can't get T cause of parents (heck, my mom keeps telling me I can never go on it cause of my heart, and while that may be true I'd rather hear it from my cardiologist first.) And you're not the only one who's going through a rough patch with their family. If I had to guess, I'd guess a large portion of the people on here have gone through some similar issues as you when it comes to acceptance. Like Christian said, a lot of us have been discriminated against in our lives, so stop with the pity party and the religious and racial excuses and make the best out of the situation you're in. You'll come out of it a lot stronger and it will make you feel extra accomplished knowing you beat the hard times.

-Jake

[Guest Ebany]

The bible absolutely does not say that you can't be gay. If you had of actually read the passage I sent you earlier, it was an example of a gay (or at least bi) couple. It's so blatantly worded that not even the king James version (written as a response to king James' advisors disliking the fact that their king was gay and was known to give expensive presents to his lovers) could scrub it out. The bible says a lot of things that can be interpreted in many ways. Some of the things that need no interpretation: stone a disobedient child, own slaves, don't work on Sabbath, don't eat most of the crap you probably do, don't wear mixed fabric clothing (wool, cotton...) stay away from women while they're menstruating.... and the list continues.

Second, as a non-Christian I find "the bible says" excuses offensive and irrelevant especially since it's normally coming from someone who's never actually read it or if they have it's so far out of their comprehension level that they might as well be reading random words. You want to talk about non-acceptance and discrimination? try walking around most anywhere in this country as a minority religion. I was threatened with expulsion in high school simply because of my religion. I've lost out on jobs, simply because of my religion. I've also lost out on jobs because I'm trans. I've been told most of my life that I can't do something because I'm a 'girl' and let me tell you: the only thing you can or can't do based solely on the fact that you come with a penis/vagina is in the child baring department.

Not all women are weak even without steroids. Not all men are tough. Stop paying attention to all the damn stereotypes around you. you are not a stereotype. If that's your goal in life, you're never going to be happy. You can't really be a stereotype. You need to just be yourself.

And please lose the sexist comments at the very least. I'll count it in the win category if we can save the world from another sexist, bigoted man, that's that the last thing our country needs another of.

-Danny

No apologies this time. I've read through it and even if it's harsh, you need to hear it. maybe it'll actually sink in this time.

Edited July 13, 2013 by 4 Charlie
T+C 8 no shouting with capitals.

[Guest Jay Smooth]

Yes is does state thats being gay is an abomination know i have no problem, And the discrimination I have gotten is about the same if not worse, Being told your going to hell constantly being told that you can get the hell out and go stay with your dad being laughed at , But im not here to see who has it worse and again if your not christian you wont understand if you have not lived the life then you wont ever get it, Especially as a black kid it seems you guys arent listsening look it up, And im not sexist if your a female and you provoke a male and he hits you its over and trust ive seen it happen, And again im not gone sit up here and talk about who has it worse because one day your parents will one day probaly accept you and i know for a fact my mom wont maybe my dad thats the type of crap that happebs when your christian because when i told my mom thats the first thing she went to was the bible

[Guest Dragonseeker]

Jay,

As a Christian myself I will tell you that I've lost track of how many times I've been told I'm going to Hell. Not by my family thankfully, but by "best friends" whom I no longer talk to. (One still sends me bible verses to this day.) Ive also been told that by an old youth minister of mine, not only if I don't "change my ways" I'm going to Hell, but also that "God made me a girl and I shouldn't ruin his plan." Also several others who I don't even know well have condemned me to Hell. You're not the only Christian on this site who's having it rough. If I tell my grandma about me, she'll prolly get a massive migraine and go to bed and pray for my soul, and my extended family will prolly want nothing to do with me. You don't know our families so you cant say they'll eventually accept us. I'm not saying I have it worse, cause I don't know that, I'm trying to show you that we all have our struggles due to religion, but that doesn't stop us. I've made it as far as I can right now in my transition cause I decided to not wallow in self pity and actually do something, no matter what my parents said. As far as race, I'm not black myself and I don't know any black trans people, but I know some black gay people and they don't talk about how rough they have it cause they're black. They live their life as they want to just like everyone else and while it may be harder, they don't go around complaining about how bad they have it.

You don't know what everyone here has been through, so don't act like you're the only one who goes through stuff, and don't say that we'll eventually be accepted and you won't because like I said, you don't know that.

-Jake

[Guest Jay Smooth]

I never said Im the only one who goes through stuff I already said im not here to argue about who has it worse yes I know everbody goes through things, And my mom and grandma flipped when my sister said she liked girls but know she wants a husband

[Guest ~Brenda~]

Well for an example i remember when i was still in school I stayed after school for talent show rehearsals and and me and this guy were in the auditorium and for no reason he walks up and was like you wanna be a a <African American male> then fight me like a <African American male> and he pushed me down and i felt like i couldnt do anything because im weak compared to him and their were no teachers around,Not just in that situation but if i were to get with a really beautiful girl and someone tried to hit on her but in a disrespectful way knowing I was with her I wouldnt be able to do anything or if he put his hands on me then what i feel like i wouldnt be able to protect her, And thats also comman with stud lesbiand which means a black masculine lesbian, I feel like its more comman amongst African Americans though, But dont just say kick him in the testicles because thats what women do when they have no choice and no guys do that, I just feel like im the weaker vessle

Hi Jay,

If you are being bullied in school, you should talk to a teacher or the principal. Bullying is never acceptable and you should not be made to feel inferior. That is what bullies want you to feel.

In my opinion, I don't think race plays a part in young males wanting to fight. I have seen this behavior in young men regardless of race or background. Kicking someone in the genitals should only be employed as a last resort. Both males and females have used this tactic when needed.

I hope you don't get hurt and remember bullying is a serious problem that is being addressed by the school system.

I used to be bullied when I was younger because I was smaller and weaker than the other guys. At that time, the school system simply looked the other way. I was constantly victimized by bullies. I am glad to see that school systems now have a 0 tolerance level for bullying. Bullying was not even recognized by the school systems 40 years ago.

Love

Brenda

[Guest Ebany]

Yes is does state thats being gay is an abomination know i have no problem, And the discrimination I have gotten is about the same if not worse, Being told your going to hell constantly being told that you can get the hell out and go stay with your dad being laughed at , But im not here to see who has it worse and again if your not christian you wont understand if you have not lived the life then you wont ever get it, Especially as a black kid it seems you guys arent listsening look it up, And im not sexist if your a female and you provoke a male and he hits you its over and trust ive seen it happen, And again im not gone sit up here and talk about who has it worse because one day your parents will one day probaly accept you and i know for a fact my mom wont maybe my dad thats the type of crap that happebs when your christian because when i told my mom thats the first thing she went to was the bible

My father's side of the family is Mormon, my mother's is Seventh Day Adventist with a sprinkling of Jehovah's Witness thrown in and my in-laws are all Southern Baptist. I've been condemned to hell since before I could drive. I do know the passage you're referring to about 'abomination'; however, so are wearing mixed fabrics and menstruating women. It simply means that doing/eating certain things makes you ritually unclean. It is the exact same thing if you don't keep kosher... Which knowing exactly what that entails, I can virtually guarantee that you don't. (and the passage is most likely, given the context of the surrounding verses and time period in which it was written, referring not so much to a homosexual relationship as to the bedding of temple priests in drag.) Also, as Christians and not Jews, your family should be focusing more on the new testament rather than sprouting off Mosaic Law that Jesus was supposed to have come to put an end to. Even if I don't worship the God of the big three, that doesn't mean I don't understand them. I find religion fascinating and would gladly get a degree in Religions of the World if I thought I could get a decent job with it.

I wasn't trying to say anyone has it better or worse. I chose my path and I walk it with pride. I'm always going to have people that sprout off hate. I'll probably never have my immediate or extended family in my life. I was suicidal as a teenager. The only reason I'm still here is one of my cousins intervened and quite literally saved my life, twice. The only thing that makes life worth living and not something to be endured is following your own course. If I can't have the people related by blood/marriage in my life because of their close-mindedness and hate, then I'll surround myself with an adopted family of friends that accept me and love me for who I am rather than who they want me to be.

Being Christian/Jewish/Muslim or any of the minority religions isn't an excuse for your hate. There are plenty from all of the religions that don't hate. But since you are Christian; remember, Jesus preached love, acceptance and forgiveness.

-Danny

[Guest MrAwesome]

Jay are you capable of thinking a single thing for yourself??? I mean really you keep saying the bible this the bible that what authority does the bible have over anybody? I could just as easily say the Quaran says this or the Torah says that or the Gospel of the FLYING SPAGHETTI MONSTER say this... That doesn't mean you would put any actual weight behind what I was saying, or accept that as a good reason to believe in hateful principles. I think you're just so used to living in a community that takes the truth of the bible for granted, and you don't have to think about why you believe it or why you feel the way you do, just that you were told X by your pastor or the bible says X. Welcome to the internet, your religion has no authority here. We're presenting you with ideas and arguments and you're just plugging your ears and saying "but the bible says X". And you've heard from many different people here. Young, old, black, white, native, and it's like you're ignoring everything we say. Just because you're trans, just because your body is the way it is, it doesn't make you a "Weaker vessel" it doesn't excuse you from your own responsibility to yourself to stick up for yourself and to defend yourself. Just because your church says something or your family says something or the bible says something doesn't make it true. You're making it true yourself through a self-fulling prophecy. It also surprises me that, knowing who you are, you still say being gay is wrong. Don't tell me the bible says so either, why don't you give me one good solid example as to why? You know what I think is morally appalling? Saying someone is wrong for being in love, because of what's between the other's legs. A couple years from now you're going to be an adult - you're going to be graduating highschool maybe going to college. You can get a job, move out on your own. And you can choose if you still want to subject yourself to people like your family or your community. Just because they don't understand doesn't mean there's not a vast amount of people out there that do.

[Guest Jay Smooth]

Yes God and Jesus preached love and acceptance and im not gonna sit up here and preach whats right and wrong, You took this way to far

[Guest Hunt]

There are so many wrong things happening here im honestly angry, but i will put that aside to try and be helpful.

Jay,

this is a very immature way to speak and it seems instead of even giving a second thought about what others are trying to say, you're focusing on yourself and competing in a "i have it the worst" game. You say statistics? I say proof. Proof is the people sitting right in front of you trying to make you feel less alone. Its obvious you have internalized the stereotypes of the current environment you live in, however, it pays-and is much less painful or self destructive-to be open minded.

[Guest Jay Smooth]

None of you guys can relate to some of what Im saying, Thats like me trying to sit up here and talk to my dad about loosing a leg, God forbid Ive never lost one but how the hell am I gonna tell him how that feels, I can't, And To MrAwsome Im sorry but God did make Adam and Eve not Adam and steve, Read the bible, But I guess I didnt make myself clear enough Im more liberal my parents and other family are conservitive, I have no problem with gay people or bi people, And just because some of you are also ftm doesnt mean your gonna understand every little thing I go through, Their are people out their that cant even trust their family or people in general, Or just cant stand people or feel like a nobody, Matter of fact I know someone like that and wouldnt think she even felt like that, So their are people who arent trans that understand some of what I feep right know but being trans just makes em worse!

[Guest SamIThinkIAm]

Jay---you've got two ways to go dude.

You can keep claiming to be a special snowflake and no one understands you (ever or completely, take your pick) and you can isolate yourself, be alone and push people away and be miserable.

OR you can start looking for similarities between yourself and realize that while no one is exactly the same we all have common themes in our stories.

And dude, no more 'well I'm black and this is how it works in the black community and no one can get it'. Drop it. There are plenty of black communities and families and people who don't believe/think/do as you do. You are neck-deep in that particular type of black culture/community and are choosing not to see outside of it and also saying that all black people/communities/cultures are like the one you're in.

It's like there are white people who aren't 'rednecks'----not every 'redneck' thing is a 'white' thing.

I'd also *highly* suggest to quit reading the bible OR find yourself a preacher or whatever that doesn't teach hate and is lgbt friendly.

[JJ]

Actually my suggestion is almost the opposite regrading the bible Actually read it yourself. At least the New Testament instead of just hearing quotes on part of it.. The Old Testament is okay too of course as long as you also read the historical context.With the Old testament look at the advise and consider how fast you would be in jail-even prison -now if you followed it. Many of the things that were taught are now felonies. They weren't laws like the ten commandments but advise for living in that place and time in most instances.

It is the New Testament Christians follow so ask yourself what Jesus emphasized. What the message he most often gave was. He had no trouble articulating what he meant. Didn't mince or twist words about right and wrong and though there were trans people at the time as well as gay people he never condemned them. Judging others and failure to act in love were the big sins -along with self righteousness. Even the ten commandments don't address the issue and if it was as big and bad as some churches make it seem you can be sure they would have. People break the commandments all over the place and are accepted. We break none and are condemned. Not because we are sinful -gays either-but because they can't relate and are uncomfortable with us so they use religion to justify their rejection. Jesus did have something to say about using religion to attack others.

And did God make homosexuals and transgendered? If not we need to find who did create them and rewrite our whole one God thing because both occur in every mammalian species. Someone created them that way. I believe it was God. Because I believe he is the Creator of all.

And I have read the bible all the way through. And three different translations of it. As well as partial reading of two others. I do know what it says. And what it does not.

Johnny