Jump to content
  • Welcome to the TransPulse Forums!

    We offer a safe, inclusive community for transgender and gender non-conforming folks, as well as their loved ones, to find support and information.  Join today!

Posted today


SheenaT

Recommended Posts

  • Forum Moderator

I looked it up and found that this was likely the part they mis-quoted and proceeded to embellish:

 

"For you formed my inward parts;
    you knitted me together in my mother's womb."

 

There is no mention of gender.

 

Here is the whole: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=psalm 139&version=ESV

 

Tracy

 

 

Link to post
  • Forum Moderator
Jackie C.

I am (sarcastically) shocked... shocked I tell you... that someone would misquote the Bible to further a hateful agenda. 🙄

 

Jesus was all about love and acceptance. No hate. Love thy neighbor, all that stuff. It's like they never read their own book.

 

Hugs!

Link to post
8 hours ago, tracy_j said:

I looked it up and found that this was likely the part they mis-quoted and proceeded to embellish:

 

"For you formed my inward parts;
    you knitted me together in my mother's womb."

 

There is no mention of gender.

 

Here is the whole: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=psalm 139&version=ESV

 

Tracy

 

 

I see that. I looked it up later thanks. It just confirms the battle I face if I come out.

Link to post
5 hours ago, Jackie C. said:

I am (sarcastically) shocked... shocked I tell you... that someone would misquote the Bible to further a hateful agenda. 🙄

 

Jesus was all about love and acceptance. No hate. Love thy neighbor, all that stuff. It's like they never read their own book.

 

Hugs!

🤗

Link to post
  • Forum Moderator

The passage as it is written is quite right:  "For you formed my inward parts;
    you knitted me together in my mother's womb.
 I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made"

 

I was wonderfully made as i am.  My gender issues are a beautiful part of that.

As are all of us......even cis folks.  It's not their fault they are cis,  they seem to have been born that way.

😄

 

Hugs,

 

Charlize

 

 

Link to post
1 hour ago, Charlize said:

The passage as it is written is quite right:  "For you formed my inward parts;
    you knitted me together in my mother's womb.
 I praise you, for I am fearfully and wonderfully made"

 

I was wonderfully made as i am.  My gender issues are a beautiful part of that.

As are all of us......even cis folks.  It's not their fault they are cis,  they seem to have been born that way.

😄

 

Hugs,

 

Charlize

 

 

I like that thanks.

Link to post
  • Admin

The Psalter in the Book Of Common Prayer of the Episcopal Church has even a little different view of this much more in our favor,

 

Quote

 

For you yourself created my inmost parts; *
    you knit me together in my mother's womb.
  I will thank you because I am marvelously made; *
    your works are wonderful, and I know it well.

 

 

Like so many poor of heart folks though this was ALL taken out of a beautiful greater context.  Their view is "I am perfect, the rest of the world should be like me I am the ONLY correct human image of G and all the rest are losers."   The Psalm is actually praise of personal discovery of our own identity not just what our body looks like.  Talk about one that blew up in your family member's face when you and friends studied the scripture completely and saw it was praise of your knowing who you are, discovering it and then giving thanks.

Link to post
1 hour ago, VickySGV said:

The Psalter in the Book Of Common Prayer of the Episcopal Church has even a little different view of this much more in our favor,

 

 

Like so many poor of heart folks though this was ALL taken out of a beautiful greater context.  Their view is "I am perfect, the rest of the world should be like me I am the ONLY correct human image of G and all the rest are losers."   The Psalm is actually praise of personal discovery of our own identity not just what our body looks like.  Talk about one that blew up in your family member's face when you and friends studied the scripture completely and saw it was praise of your knowing who you are, discovering it and then giving thanks.

😁

Link to post
AwesomeClaire

I would just reply that, if your "creator" didn't do such a lousy job I would have been "knit" as the right gender in the first place. The creator has a pretty bad track record, given all the health problems that may be present due to birth issues, and cannot be trusted. Also the idea of someone being physically knit together is just gross.

Link to post
Marcie Jensen

Wow. Speaking as a pastor, and yes I'm ordained, I don't even know where to begin in responding to this chain. So. I guess I will start with misinterpretation of Scripture. That is a common thing in today's society--Americans of the late 20th and early 21st century are the most poorly educated regarding content and interpretation of the Bible that this country has ever seen. There are a whole bunch of reasons for this, but it remains a fact.

 

Second, I would like to address the notion that God makes mistakes. He does not. (And I use the term "He" because that's how Jesus referred to Him. It has no gender implications at all. I hope I did not give offense, and if I did, I humbly apologize.) I would suggest the fallen and corrupt nature of this world is the problem. Without going into pettifogging detail, I suggest reading Dietrich Bonhoeffer's commentary on Genesis 3. While originally written in the 1930's, this is still used as a reference in seminaries and is widely regarded as the best understanding of sinful, fallen and the broken nature of this world ever written. Which leads to: BEING TRANSGENDERED IS NOT A SIN. Period.

 

In point of fact, the Psalmist in Psalm 139 is addressing a person's nature; their SOUL, as opposed to their physical body. As for those who interpret this differently, all I can say is Scripture has been interpreted to meet personal ends for millennia. That doesn't make the interpretation correct. (That goes for me as well.)

 

I would add that throughout Jesus' ministry, he was always with the marginalized of his day; lepers, prostitutes and tax collectors. This begs the two-fold question of who are the marginalized of today, and where would Jesus be if he were physically among us right now?

 

I like Sheena's point about the viewpoint of folks who think their view is "perfect and all others are losers." This is the sin of the Pharisees and we all know what happened to them. To underscore what Sheena say, John Calvin in his Institutes of Christianity, points out that humanity is, in his words, "so depraved" that they don't even recognize their sinful nature without the direct intervention of God through the Holy Spirit.

 

Small, and bigoted, minds will be with us always. This is unfortunate and sad, but true. I would suggest that in the 21st century, transpeople are the marginalized and are feared by people who would so misconstrue Scripture. They are to be pitied and prayed for. 

 

Remember that God, however one interprets the Divinity, loves us all. And always will.

Link to post
SheenaT
3 hours ago, Marcie Jensen said:

Wow. Speaking as a pastor, and yes I'm ordained, I don't even know where to begin in responding to this chain. So. I guess I will start with misinterpretation of Scripture. That is a common thing in today's society--Americans of the late 20th and early 21st century are the most poorly educated regarding content and interpretation of the Bible that this country has ever seen. There are a whole bunch of reasons for this, but it remains a fact.

 

Second, I would like to address the notion that God makes mistakes. He does not. (And I use the term "He" because that's how Jesus referred to Him. It has no gender implications at all. I hope I did not give offense, and if I did, I humbly apologize.) I would suggest the fallen and corrupt nature of this world is the problem. Without going into pettifogging detail, I suggest reading Dietrich Bonhoeffer's commentary on Genesis 3. While originally written in the 1930's, this is still used as a reference in seminaries and is widely regarded as the best understanding of sinful, fallen and the broken nature of this world ever written. Which leads to: BEING TRANSGENDERED IS NOT A SIN. Period.

 

In point of fact, the Psalmist in Psalm 139 is addressing a person's nature; their SOUL, as opposed to their physical body. As for those who interpret this differently, all I can say is Scripture has been interpreted to meet personal ends for millennia. That doesn't make the interpretation correct. (That goes for me as well.)

 

I would add that throughout Jesus' ministry, he was always with the marginalized of his day; lepers, prostitutes and tax collectors. This begs the two-fold question of who are the marginalized of today, and where would Jesus be if he were physically among us right now?

 

I like Sheena's point about the viewpoint of folks who think their view is "perfect and all others are losers." This is the sin of the Pharisees and we all know what happened to them. To underscore what Sheena say, John Calvin in his Institutes of Christianity, points out that humanity is, in his words, "so depraved" that they don't even recognize their sinful nature without the direct intervention of God through the Holy Spirit.

 

Small, and bigoted, minds will be with us always. This is unfortunate and sad, but true. I would suggest that in the 21st century, transpeople are the marginalized and are feared by people who would so misconstrue Scripture. They are to be pitied and prayed for. 

 

Remember that God, however one interprets the Divinity, loves us all. And always will.

I hope He does

Link to post

Love this! Well stated!

Link to post
Confused1
2 hours ago, SheenaT said:

I hope He does

He Does!

 

Hugs,

Mike

Link to post
  • Forum Moderator
Susan R

@Marcie Jensen Very well thought out post with some great points. Thank you for your contribution to this thread.😘

 

Susan R🌷

Link to post
  • Admin
VickySGV

I posted about this abuse of Psalm 139 in two other Trans Spirituality groups I am part of and it has hit the funny bone of about 90% and comes in at 60 people commenting so far.  The number of Trans folks there who have adopted this as a personal favorite, YES Personal Favorite meditations, and at the current rate growing.  Letting your "spiritual advisors" know that they BLEW their socks off with this one just shows how shallow they are in their understanding and how pathetic a group of victims they have become.  @Marcie Jensen has indeed hit the right notes and is in the company of Trans colleagues who do see this for what it is.  Their Verse Bombs have not destroyed YOU, but they have soot on their faces.  I feel sorry for them.

Link to post
KimmieElise
On 3/1/2021 at 1:30 PM, AwesomeClaire said:

I would just reply that, if your "creator" didn't do such a lousy job I would have been "knit" as the right gender in the first place. The creator has a pretty bad track record, given all the health problems that may be present due to birth issues, and cannot be trusted. Also the idea of someone being physically knit together is just gross.

I like to think of things like in the movie the Last Samurai.  The samurai lord is searching for the perfect cherry blossom, but never finds it until he is dying amid a shower of cherry blossoms blown from the trees nearby.  He concludes, "There all perfect."  When asked, I couldn't say the Father put me in the wrong body.  I don't think there is any mistake.  Just God doesn't conform to human expectations all the time.  He had a plan for me being trans.  I am not fully sure what that is yet, but I have some inkling.  I kinda laugh because there are so many people in Christian circles who would reject me and who are being close-minded and unloving.  I think my being trans might have something to do with being the love of Jesus in a form that will totally piss off the "Pharisees" of this world.

 

Biblical Hermeneutics is basically a set of rules used to interpret the Bible.  The Psalms, when written were pretty much song lyrics, and therefor at times figurative.  Hermeneutics recognizes there are different literary styles in the Bible, and interpretation should take into account literary style.  It is not meant to imply the Father literally knit someone together.  It is a word picture.

Link to post
Marcie Jensen

WSell said.

Link to post
SheenaT
21 hours ago, KimmieElise said:

I like to think of things like in the movie the Last Samurai.  The samurai lord is searching for the perfect cherry blossom, but never finds it until he is dying amid a shower of cherry blossoms blown from the trees nearby.  He concludes, "There all perfect."  When asked, I couldn't say the Father put me in the wrong body.  I don't think there is any mistake.  Just God doesn't conform to human expectations all the time.  He had a plan for me being trans.  I am not fully sure what that is yet, but I have some inkling.  I kinda laugh because there are so many people in Christian circles who would reject me and who are being close-minded and unloving.  I think my being trans might have something to do with being the love of Jesus in a form that will totally piss off the "Pharisees" of this world.

 

Biblical Hermeneutics is basically a set of rules used to interpret the Bible.  The Psalms, when written were pretty much song lyrics, and therefor at times figurative.  Hermeneutics recognizes there are different literary styles in the Bible, and interpretation should take into account literary style.  It is not meant to imply the Father literally knit someone together.  It is a word picture.

😁

Link to post
SheenaT
On 2/27/2021 at 10:44 PM, tracy_j said:

I looked it up and found that this was likely the part they mis-quoted and proceeded to embellish:

 

"For you formed my inward parts;
    you knitted me together in my mother's womb."

 

There is no mention of gender.

 

Here is the whole: https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=psalm 139&version=ESV

 

Tracy

 

 

😉

Link to post

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
  • Who's Online   8 Members, 0 Anonymous, 75 Guests (See full list)

    • Elizabeth Star
    • Bri2020
    • Aurora
    • DeeDee
    • MaryEllen
    • Kakileli
    • Maddee
    • Petra Jane
  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

  • Topics With Zero Replies

  • Forum Statistics

    • Total Topics
      73,689
    • Total Posts
      680,195
  • Member Statistics

    • Total Members
      8,292
    • Most Online
      8,356

    leongreen
    Newest Member
    leongreen
    Joined
  • Today's Birthdays

    1. wishing to be kim
      wishing to be kim
      (61 years old)
  • Posts

    • Bri2020
      I have butt envy Liz I'm in casual mode around the house today and repping my Dolphins. (and I have no butt to show. lol)  
    • Kakileli
      I know that my sister is INCREDIBLY homophobic, so I assume she is transphobic too. Not much else. I don’t live with her btw 
    • Chiefsrule58
      Shame and fear of how others would react and not wanting to disappoint my parents.  Growing up from the time I started kindergarten to when I graduated I was always subject to violence and bullying.  My parents knew of the bullying as well as the  teachers and principles. My mother just kept telling me that if I didn't just act the way I did the other kids would leave me be. My father took a different stance, he thought I should learn to stand up for myself so his approach was either you fight back or I will beat you myself.   It took me a very long time for me to change my believes about myself.  Overtime I got really good at hiding and avoiding others primarily for my own safety. In high school I had the opportunity to join NJROTC which I did because I did not want to deal with the gym locker room.        I enjoyed the experience but still wasn't sure what I wanted to do. My Junior year of high school I took a severe beating by a group of guys so I convinced my mom to let me sign up for the Navy and told the recruiter I wanted to go to Navy boot camp ASAP so I left three days after I graduated high school the next year.        I struggled in my first couple of years in the Navy.  I got better at fitting in and I made friends with a female Sailor and we started hanging out all the time eventually she introduced to me wife. The dysphoria got worse after I married and eventually I came out to her a couple years into our marriage. Eventually our marriage came apart a divorce was eminent then by the grace of God things changed  and we worked things out. At that point I was choosing the Navy; a job that I loved and was good at over authenticity, I had convinced myself that I could tolerate and live with the dysphoria. At this point my wife and I had endured four more deployments and the birth and death of our daughter.      By 2015 we had two more children  both had been diagnosed with ASD.  It was at that point that it just became extremely difficult for me to function and deal with everything on top of the dysphoria. My wife encouraged me and made arrangements for me to see a therapist, so I did and started to attend group as well.  Meeting other transgender people for the first time really changed my life because it gave me hope.       I was at 18 years in the Navy at that point and was very torn on what I wanted to do. I choose to stay Navy and endure.  I kept going to group and therapy when i could and  once the DOD changed the policy I started taking HRT.  Things never really worked out with coming out in the Navy or with medical just to many road blocks. I enjoyed being a Navy Chief so I continued on in my career.  The thing that caused me to move beyond the state of limbo was the two suicide attempts, barley surviving the second one. I held things together after that because I was so grateful just to be alive.        I retired from the Navy in 2020 and things didn't get better so I reached out to the VA for help.  They have been very helpful with the transition out of the Navy.  Along the way I stopped fighting with myself and made the decision to transition and start living full time.  For me it has made all the difference in my life.            Jamie
    • Kakileli
      Kind of. I always feel like my legs are the wrong shape, they look too feminine, they stop me from passing, they make me look like a girl, etc. Etc. 
    • Maddee
      Money.   And fear of making the wrong choices (which Drs, which types and order of procedures, etc)
    • KymmieL
      When I carry my purse. I usually just have my wallet, some makeup, my keys, and maybe some protection. That is about all I can fit in my purse.    
    • Linda Marie
      Out of the blue I get a call. I'm retired and have to go to a business meeting. Do not know what this about, all I know is I text back and told them, I'm wearing polka dots. They said please come as you are. LM♥️  
    • AwesomeClaire
      I was never an alpha male either.  A couple things stopped me from transitioning. Mostly fear and shame. Fear of what people would do to me when they found out, and shame of failing as a man and not living up to others' expectations. Also, I had started losing my hair at some point in my 20s and then I was just like "oh, this is it then, there is no way I can do this." So, another main thing holding me back was lack of knowledge. As far as I knew, "transsexuals" were these weird people that got their stuff removed. Nobody even knew one. I didn't even know about ftm. I didn't know about good wigs even or hormone therapy. It was just me all alone, trying to figure out how to look like a girl, failing at it, and then sadly giving up. I didn't have the words or ability to express what was going on with me. I just knew I wanted to look like a girl, and for a while I tried to make myself look like the very feminine male characters from some video games, especially Dynasty Warriors. I really started experimenting more after coming out to family and some close friends as bi, I tried on a dress and heels for the first time with some friends and just loved it. But then the dark thoughts and fear started crowding in again and I felt what I was doing was ridiculous and wrong, so I quit. It would resurface many times over the years, especially if I got drunk or there was another guy around that I liked. November 2019, a year after my divorce, is when I got a very strong urge to pursue this again - I decided to do it right, I did the research, learned quite a lot, and made the decision to be the real me.
    • AwesomeClaire
      I hadn't had a Facebook account in over a decade. But, my friends in my gaming group were using Facebook groups and I felt I was missing out. A few months into my transition I had decided on Claire, so I started up an FB account. Part of this was intentional. I spent a lot of time and energy talking to my closest friends, family, and coworkers about my transition, explaining why I was doing it, my history, etc. So, rather than surprise more people and have to explain a bunch of stuff, I just put myself out there on FB and let people react as they may. I got an overwhelming amount of support, and it just felt good to get it out of the way and have everyone know about it. 
    • Teri Anne
      You look fab in polka dots Linda Marie. You always look so put together.
    • Willow
      Trying this again, the worry is alway lack of acceptance but it’s never as bad as you imagine.  My wife was my worst and she has given her concerns to God.  We are doing a whole lot better.   Purses, I don’t carry all that in my purse, but I will say after carrying one, I don’t understand why the MURSE never caught on.  I wear glasses in case you hadn’t noticed so a glasses case with my prescription sun glasses, or vice versa, lipstick, hair brush, keys, phone, a compact, I try to carry tissues but use them and don’t think to replace them, a face mask, and my wallet.  It matches the purse.  My wife makes purses and matching wallets out of different materials.  The one I’ve been using is cork.  But she makes quilted, foleather, and others and she usually manages a matching wallet. Sometime my wife and I want the same one and have to share.  Ok, I give in to her most of the time but I have a couple she made specifically for me.
    • Niamh
      While I fully understand that some of us may wish to limit who we "come out" to, I was getting frustrated that I had to work out everytime I posted on facebook who knew what. So on 31 March (transgender day of visibility) I decided to post my transgender status to all those who I had not up to that point informed.  I had feared a bit of a backlash from some of the right-wing family members who were my fb friends, but in fact all the responses I had to my post were entirely positive. One of my fb friends obviously decided to unfriend me (I had made a note of how many fb friends I had before the post), but as I've been unable to work out who that person was - it's clearly no big deal.  But the big plus is that I now know that I don't have to tiptoe around what I post in FB. I have maintained two separate FB identities as I am genderfluid, and I'll post appropriate updates in my male and female FB pages accordingly. I did however invite my male FB friends to "friend" Niamh if they wished and a significant number did.   So I fully understand your desire to not have to hide your identity from anyone - it lifts a big weight from your shoulders and I hope that going forward that your family accept how you are even if they are not supportive.
    • Willow
      Most recent first, Yes I agree the more you manage to come out and (ok why can’t I turn this back off?) are accepted, the better you feel.  
    • Linda Marie
      Oh dear, that horrible depression. I battled that for 3 years. It blindsided me, came from no where. I had everything going for me then that hit. I did kind of what Jackie said, I started talking to it, silly I suppose, but it worked after a long battle. I did set up my camera and was ready for my last day, that was when I woke up and went to battle. I have 5 purses, I love my purses, just to lazy at times to empty then and change purses, lol. Ginger my cat was a feral cat that showed up in my basement a few years ago. I fed her, then trapped her and took her to the vet's and had her spaded, and all her shots, I even put a cat door and food bench in my basement for her and her son, Fuzzy, trapped him also and shots and fixed. They both have been with me now for a few years.  
    • Sally Stone
      Linda Marie,   That outfit looks wonderful on you, very stylish and what's not to love about polka dots. 
  • Upcoming Events

Contact TransPulse

TransPulse can be contacted in the following ways:

Email: Click Here.

To report an error on this page.

Legal

Your use of this site is subject to the following rules and policies, whether you have read them or not.

Terms of Use
Privacy Policy
DMCA Policy
Community Rules

Hosting

Upstream hosting for TransPulse provided by QnEZ.

Sponsorship

Special consideration for TransPulse is kindly provided by The Breast Form Store.
×
×
  • Create New...