Amazon Staff Demand Ban On Books Calling Trans People Mentally Ill

[Carolyn Marie]

https://fortune.com/2022/06/25/amazon-staff-demand-ban-of-books-calling-transgender-people-mentally-ill-if-we-bill-ourselves-as-the-worlds-biggest-bookstore-that-comes-with-a-lot-of-responsibility/

 

 

Carolyn Marie

[VickySGV]

Considering that all major medical associations in their most recent publications and treatment guidelines say we are not mentally ill, I won't say Ban them, but clearly differentiate the books a ancient pseudo science or better yet as Science Fiction.  I do not go for banning even the trash of that sort.  It is all the drivel some people can read at all.

[MirandaB]

It's a tricky thing to decide which books to not sell. Bezos makes so much money he could probably forgo those profits on those books, but since when does someone like him give up one possibly penny?

 

Kinda disturbing that if you type in 'transgender' in the search bar the first or second thing that pops up is "Irreversible Damage". 

[Ivy]

I don't like the idea of banning books.  It can go either way.  We already have enough trouble with people living in their own self-confirming "bubble."  

 

Of course I find this kind of propaganda infuriating.  But it exists, and banning it only contributes to the right-wing's misguided feelings of martyrdom.

 

This kind of propaganda is attractive to people already skeptical of gender diversity, so it drives the search engines.  Banning the books would not eliminate the misguided ideas.  After all, Fox News, etc.

 

Personally, I just think we're skrooed.

[Artpetal]

I don't like Amazon but I support some people there advocating for this.

[Carolyn Marie]

As those on the Right have discovered, much to their chagrin, banning books only makes them much more popular.  I understand the feelings of the Amazon employees, and I'm grateful for their advocacy.  But I think its misplaced.  Banning books is almost never a good thing. People have a right to read whatever they want, unless it is inherently dangerous, like how to build a bomb or make deadly poison.  I would even, as a Jew, allow people to read "Mein Kampf" because of its historical importance.  So no, I don't think Amazon should ban those books.

 

Carolyn Marie

[Heather Nicole]

First of all, I'm shocked...in a very, very good way...to see a significant group of Amazon employees fighting for us. I've had a very low opinion of Amazon for awhile lately, so this is really nice to hear. Especially since I've come across that book before (I work at a library), and that book is one of many, many coming from the far-right propaganda machine that really are truly, genuinely disgusting. That said, I have always agreed with the sentiment that book bans are not good, even for really bad books (Again, like I said, I do work at a public library - we even have a copy of main kompf, for its historical significance as Carolyn Marie pointed out).

 

I do think it's a complicated issue though, what with information silos these days and the very real and present threat from people being fueled by a constant stream of what literally is propaganda. Also, many various degrees of middle grounds can exist between a total outright "cannot be obtained anywhere" ban vs literally being heavily promoted right there on any book search for "trans". Every one of those shades in-between can be debated on their own the own merits (or demerits, however the case may be).

 

However, the article brings up what I find to be a very interesting point: Apparently, it sounds like Amazon already has a policy in place against "hate speech". Now, personally, I would absolutely consider a book like "Irreversible Damage" to unquestioningly fall under the category of "hate speech". And I think that changes the question from "Should Amazon ban these trans-hate propaganda books?" to "Should Amazon ban hate speech, and if not, how should Amazon handle hate speech?"

 

One thing I will say for certain, "Irreversible Damage" absolutely should not be showing up as a high recommendation, with no disclaimer whatsoever, for average, casual books searches on the word "trans".

 

[Heather Nicole]

Another thing too is that unlike a library, Amazon isn't a public or government-funded entity and so, under US rules at least, is under no obligation to offer products they don't wish to offer, for (mostly) any reason they choose. They may be a 600lb gorilla of retail, but they don't control retail entirely, they do have competitors. So if they opt not to sell something it doesn't actually prevent people from obtaining it and (I am not a lawyer) it doesn't violate any law regarding censorship.

 

That's not necessarily to say "Therefore, they should stop selling it", but at the very least it's relevant to consider.

[awkward-yet-sweet]

I oppose banning books.  Even ones I dislike, disagree with, or are plainly false and hateful.  I believe in nearly absolute freedom of speech.  I also oppose telling a private business what to sell or who to sell to.  I feel a bit of internal conflict over this one. 

 

Its a shame that we have so many businesses in tech and other fields that have gotten so huge lately.  They nearly have the power of censorship in some cases, although thankfully there's lots of other sources of books.  Amazon is merely the most convenient.  I avoid buying from Amazon when I can, as I usually dislike their politics and Bezos himself (although I haven't met the man) just exudes something I find repulsive.