Behavior and Passing

[StephieGurl]

Okay for starters I detest "Passing." But it is used and people seem to understand it. I have come to notice that there is more to being gendered correctly than just your looks. Voice is an obvious one. Tried voice training and gave up. But guess what I have found several reasons why my voice in person doesn't out me (It can on the phone). I began to notice how much more I was getting gendered correctly as my hair grew out significantly. I keep my hair long not so much to pass, but that's how I like it, so that's the way I am going to do it. I see both verbal and physical behaviors that may enhance correct gendering. It has been shown that women speak differently. Actually men use the same speak, it is no one notice it because it comes out in different ways and situation. I notice, more than being intentional, about how I stood and walked and sat or whatever was just like the women I saw in public. I didn't pass any better back then. Without hrt physical effects I think I would be gendered correctly less. But, combine hrt and behavioral body position might add to the effect. I also noticed more recently that I often act in a cutesy way, especially when I'm feeling good, or getting complimented does so as well. Does this add to the feminine? I am, aware that my writing style is different than my verbal style, including diminutives, which is classified as feminine. But, I like the way I write and don't see any good enough reason to change it. One more thing I just thought of the effect on how I like to look. What I wear and how do my makeup how I want to I started passing more too, but it is hard to tease out which is which hrt appearance or some of my behaviors.

 

Nothing I have written is for certain as I can't see someone's inner thoughts.

 

Does has anyone notice the same kind of thing, or different things I did not bring up?

[Sally Stone]

The thing about passing is it can mean different things to different people, so it can really be used effectively as any sort of gauge or measure.  Some folks want to be completely stealthy, while others, just want to be recognized for the gender they are presenting.  

 

However, recognition of our desired gender can be significantly enhanced when we can duplicate the traits and characteristics people identify with that gender.  Mannerisms, body language and movement are all gender "tells," so they can either enhance or degrade our gender presentation. 

 

So, Stephie I couldn't agree with you more, that there is more to being gendered correctly than just your looks.

 

I am very tall and not so feminine looking, yet find I am generally always accepted as a woman because I have mastered most of my gender "tells."  There is one other characteristic that can add significantly to this mastery, and that is to be very self-confident.  Self-confidence, in fact, is probably the single, most important trait to wield when you want to be accepted as your chosen gender.  

[StephieGurl]

1 hour ago, Hannah Renee said:

@StephieGurlI do see things similarly. I feel that, for me, subtle works well in adjusting such things as walking, other physical mannerisms, acting cutesy as you say. (I do that a lot - it just seems to add a little something in appropriate circumstances. Like waving at small children with their moms, for instance, I wiggle my fingers a bit.) My hip/pelvic structure is not of the child-bearing type. I don't know if any fat deposits have relocated to a more southerly hemisphere. But practicing walking for the last few years, a more feminine (IMHO) walk - subtle with the hips, a narrower, shorter, and slower stride - I believe suggests femininity, along with arm swing. How you shake someone's hand, kneeling with knees together regardless of how you dress, waving in greeting at people while you're out practicing your walking style.

 

I've been misgendered on the phone when I don't use my name. I think, though in not sure, I was misgendered a week or so ago somewhere. Otherwise not for quite a while. Have confidence in who you are and presenting yourself with that confidence can make the woman (in this case) every bit as much as how you dress (sweats anyone?).

When I first started walking, which was the only action I needed to be consciously aware of, I aimed for a swing, but making not obvious. Not an easy thing to do. I have gotten some southerly activity though. My butt is obviously bigger, I have a slight figure, but my tummy is to big. If could lose even half of it I think It would show a little more. The first thing I notice thought that my thighs where bigger, like sticking out, this also may have a slight figure enhancement. I might not be perfect, but I am perfectly please with all my hrt results. Perhaps the biggest surprise was my face feminized. Keep on swinging Hannah

[StephieGurl]

1 hour ago, Sally Stone said:

The thing about passing is it can mean different things to different people, so it can really be used effectively as any sort of gauge or measure.  Some folks want to be completely stealthy, while others, just want to be recognized for the gender they are presenting.  

 

However, recognition of our desired gender can be significantly enhanced when we can duplicate the traits and characteristics people identify with that gender.  Mannerisms, body language and movement are all gender "tells," so they can either enhance or degrade our gender presentation. 

 

So, Stephie I couldn't agree with you more, that there is more to being gendered correctly than just your looks.

 

I am very tall and not so feminine looking, yet find I am generally always accepted as a woman because I have mastered most of my gender "tells."  There is one other characteristic that can add significantly to this mastery, and that is to be very self-confident.  Self-confidence, in fact, is probably the single, most important trait to wield when you want to be accepted as your chosen gender.  

I completely missed the self-confidence. I have that in my purse too.

[StephieGurl]

22 minutes ago, Hannah Renee said:

I wasn't paying attention to the back side of my moon when I started HRT, so I've never really gotten a sense of any changes. Feels ok when I walk, though. Oh, and I didn't mention that most of my practice was from walks of 3-5 miles, which also allowed me to get accustomed to continue the process while tired.

I don't think I could have made that far, but I did walk a half hour at a time walking close to 3 mph. And yes I was conscious of my walk. I know when I am happy my step gets some extra swing.

[Trans22]

On 9/20/2022 at 9:49 AM, StephieGurl said:

I completely missed the self-confidence. I have that in my purse too.

My wife thinks that self-confidence was/is a major reason that people have so easily accepted my transition.  Several people described me as being awkward in my previous life and they now see as a proud and confident woman.  I wonder whether this is why I haven't been victim of any anti-trans sentiment.  Trans-hate crimes still happen where I live - the latest one that I know of involved a misgendered (as trans) cis-woman.

[Lydia_R]

On 9/19/2022 at 3:36 PM, Sally Stone said:

The thing about passing is it can mean different things to different people, so it can really be used effectively as any sort of gauge or measure.  Some folks want to be completely stealthy, while others, just want to be recognized for the gender they are presenting.

 

I identify with this "just want to be recognized for the gender I am presenting." 

 

I got a car ride (in a convertible in the summer) with a transwoman in 2014 and noticed an enhanced level of freedom and confidence with her.  I know I'm feeling more relaxed now that I'm not under the influence of testosterone.

[Diana Stone]

I am not on any HRT so my body is the one I was born with pretty much though it creaks and pops rather more in recent years. I am fairly well accepted in most places in the sense that people don't seem confused about how I present with regard to gender so that's OK. With regard to behaviour, I can't say I have adopted a different walk or way of moving so if that draws attention maybe I am to thick skinned to notice now to be honest. My speaking voice is different depending on if its people I know or not, so it tends to vary quite a bit. I would say if anything gives me away it might be my hands which are not huge but fairly long. I don't really think about being trans 90% of the time. I have to be a bit more careful in regard to presentation to try and look right   but practice makes perfect they say. I have two different modes really, if I am out playing music on a gig I tend to go for a more showbizzy look.  At other times I am a bit mumsey or grandma ish.  

[StephieGurl]

10 hours ago, Trans22 said:

My wife thinks that self-confidence was/is a major reason that people have so easily accepted my transition.  Several people described me as being awkward in my previous life and they now see as a proud and confident woman.  I wonder whether this is why I haven't been victim of any anti-trans sentiment.  Trans-hate crimes still happen where I live - the latest one that I know of involved a misgendered (as trans) cis-woman.

I agree things would be different if I did not carry the self-confidence that I do.

 

[Kasumi63]

Living in Japan, I have a very different experience, so I'm curious how you guys know whether you are "passing" or not. In other words, do people overtly tell you? Or is it something more subtle? Over here, people never say anything, and to be honest, I sometimes find this frustrating because I would like a little bit of feedback about how I'm doing. Or even just tips on where I could improve. Part of the problem is language, I guess. In Japanese, pronouns are rarely used, so it's easy to avoid referring to someone's gender. People also are extremely reluctant to say anything unpleasant or mean to others. So are there any ways to get some objective feedback?

(Disclaimer:  I agree that we tend to put too much emphasis on "passing," but I do want to keep improving.)

[Diana Stone]

9 hours ago, Hannah Renee said:

 

As has been said, self-confidence in the way you present yourself goes a long way. How you dress, walk, gesture - sure. But like in the movies, act like you belong. Own it.

Behaviour and confidence helps a lot.

 

[StephieGurl]

14 hours ago, Kasumi63 said:

Living in Japan, I have a very different experience, so I'm curious how you guys know whether you are "passing" or not. In other words, do people overtly tell you? Or is it something more subtle? Over here, people never say anything, and to be honest, I sometimes find this frustrating because I would like a little bit of feedback about how I'm doing. Or even just tips on where I could improve. Part of the problem is language, I guess. In Japanese, pronouns are rarely used, so it's easy to avoid referring to someone's gender. People also are extremely reluctant to say anything unpleasant or mean to others. So are there any ways to get some objective feedback?

(Disclaimer:  I agree that we tend to put too much emphasis on "passing," but I do want to keep improving.)

I'm in the US, Easternly liberal area. No one tells me I pass, of course unless I ask directly. But, I have only asked that of a trusted few. I put most of the responsibility of determining if I do or not on myself. Fortunately, I am kind to myself and believe that I do. For those that think otherwise, they remain silent. 

[SamC]

I have put a lot of time into posture, mannerisms, gestures, movement, walking, sitting, and feel pretty good about it. Makeup and clothing that work for me and fit in with my environment.  Voice is a bit of a challenge as well as facial expressions. 
 

I think I generally get taken for granted as being a woman, but I am always anxious about being clocked. I relax most when with cis female friends like in this pic. I am on the

left. 

 

[Red_Lauren.]

I don't know how I pass. I do some how though. My mannerism are not super femmine nor is my voice or height. I think what's helps is makeup, confidence, and over all appearance. 

 

I have been seeing my hair lady for nearly 4 years now, so she has seen the ugly duckling to a beautiful swan. She told me this past winter. She was worried I wouldn't make a attractive woman. She laughed and said boy did I get that wrong. She then was like lose the weight, and you'll be a 10. 

 

I have noticed my Friends call me curvy. Apprently there is a butt back there. I laughed today at work. I was wearing male gym shorts, and as I was walking. I felt it jiggling back and fourth. I'm also stacked ad they say. I don't think so, bit according to them their rather large. I'm like they are only a DD/DDD. I then get thats hhuge. I have also noticed bingo arms. As muscle mass has melted, stretch marks I never had, and one I noticed this spring..I was wearing shorts, and noticed jiggling in my thighs as I drove. 

 

Dose all that help me pass maybe, but I was passing before. Maybe not to the degree I am now, but for the most part. I feel like I pass 95% of the time. 

 

 

[AllieJ]

I have absolutely no idea if I pass or not. I cannot see that woman in my mirror, but today I comfortably used the womens changing room at my public pool. There were a couple of teenagers in there and a mother with two small daughters, and though time in shared spaces was brief, there were no stares or pointing fingers. I had spent the past two hours with my 3 grandsons in the various pools, and spoke to Moms about our children. My grandkids use female pronouns for me, but sometimes ask me why I speak like a man, yet female friends tell me my voice in not out of place for a woman my age. 

 

In reality, I am not going to get reliable feedback from those around me, but does it really matter? I live a comfortable life in my identified gender, and everybody around me is nice to me. In my oldies gym session last week our Physiotherapist said to Peter "it looks like you are the only male in this weeks session, lucky you, surrounded by all these lovely women!" Since GRS, my dysphoria has reduced so much, I don't really need as a stereotypical female, (though it would be nice to look good in that swimsuit), and I'll take social comfort!

 

Hugs,

 

Allie

[Charlize]

36 minutes ago, AllieJ said:

In reality, I am not going to get reliable feedback from those around me, but does it really matter?

I love this.  I have to remember i transitioned for me not for everyone around me.  Wonderfully if i'm comfortable those around me are as well.  I'm blessed that the passing fears have passed for the most part over the years.  Time helps!

 

Hugs,

 

Charlize

[Sandy]

2 hours ago, AllieJ said:

I have absolutely no idea if I pass or not. I cannot see that woman in my mirror, but today I comfortably used the womens changing room at my public pool. There were a couple of teenagers in there and a mother with two small daughters, and though time in shared spaces was brief, there were no stares or pointing fingers. I had spent the past two hours with my 3 grandsons in the various pools, and spoke to Moms about our children. My grandkids use female pronouns for me, but sometimes ask me why I speak like a man, yet female friends tell me my voice in not out of place for a woman my age. 

 

In reality, I am not going to get reliable feedback from those around me, but does it really matter? I live a comfortable life in my identified gender, and everybody around me is nice to me. In my oldies gym session last week our Physiotherapist said to Peter "it looks like you are the only male in this weeks session, lucky you, surrounded by all these lovely women!" Since GRS, my dysphoria has reduced so much, I don't really need as a stereotypical female, (though it would be nice to look good in that swimsuit), and I'll take social comfort!

 

Hugs,

 

Allie

Allie, 

I believe the only opinion that matters is our own. My father told me when I was 16 when talking about gender that if I was female that I would be the ugliest woman ever. I will not lie it was very hurtful. But then I started to think of the women in my life (and in my family) and how a great many of them did not fit into the world's view of that perfect woman, many women do not fit that view! But one thing that stood out for me at least was that the women that my father thought was ugly, was in fact the strongest women I knew! They were kind and tender and so very feminine. All while being so very strong! So I worked on being the woman I knew I was on the inside. It matters little to me what others think of me because I don't live my life for them. I am careful not to embarrass my family, but many things in my life (for anyone looking) are right out there in the open.

 

I think my point is that we worry too much what others think when the only thing that matter is what we think.

After reading your post I think you are a strong lady that is adjusting into the life she deserves!

Proud to know you sweetie!

Sandy

[Ashley0616]

I'm on 33 days with being on HRT and have noticed big differences on how I act and feel and hobbies. Looks I try to blend in but hard to do when you are six foot tall and wear size thirteen female shoe. I have altered my walk and trying to master the feminine voice. I have been told I'm getting there with therapy. My gender dysphoria makes me feel like I still have a male voice and it does come out. I have to really work on getting to sound feminine. I work on it by reading and singing songs. It's fun and makes progress. My mood has definitely improved by a dent. My depression is still bad and still have to take six psych meds just to get through the day and those meds are at max dosage. I'm hoping that maybe in the future I can come off on some of the meds but I'll take what I can get. 

[Rishaya]

I think I pass very well.   Been to singles dances, ballroom dances, no negative reactions from the guys or the ladies.

 

  All before any medical treatment.  I’m extremely lucky in that regard.   Small feet, 7 1/2 dress shoe, small hands.  Very lucky.

 

And confidence is the best tool.  I’m going to two holiday cis world parties this week.

 

BUT I’m not fulltime.  And that part kills me.