Laura

Phytoestogens, Herbals, Bust Creams And Other Ripoffs

23 posts in this topic

Most of you know who have been around a while know about sites that rip off the transgendered. Aside from the $800 breast forms you can get for less than half of that price on a reputible site we've learned to shop around. Plus we all know that we aren't going to look like the GG models with a set of DD's. However when someone offers us a chance to look like that by taking "Fem Juice" or phytoestrogens that are absolutley "Safe" to take without stressing the liver and without a prescription some are going to take the bait. Magic Feminization with herbals involves anything from megadoses of pills to bust Creams that are guaranteed to work unless you read the fine print.

Recently a user here trying to advertize her breast cream company (Seen on TV) stated that Phytoestrogens are absolutley safe. Never mind that her product will turn your little chest dimples into mega-mountains with a few dabs of her cream or so she implys. What she doesn't tell you is that by the time this actually happens your life may have already run its natural course waiting for the growth to begin. What I'm wondering is, if this stuff actually works why would millions of women be still getting breast implants costing thousands of dollars when Only "a dab'll do ya"? :lol:

Phytoestrogen makers and ripoff trans site salespeople touting their benefits point out that they are safe to take becuase they do not stress the liver like prescription hormones do. OK, but what they don't tell you is that they were designed for born post-menepausal women with a recommended dose of 1 pill per day. However trans ripoff sites selling this will tell you to take megadoses of 8 pills or more a day which even the manufacturer does not recommend. Why don't they recommend the megadose? The reason is it is not safe that's why.

Back when I was a nieve Transsexual before I was the beautiful self-assured woman I am today :lol: I took herbal phytoestrogens and other feminizing products for nearly a year. In March of 1996 I had a stroke with bleeding in my brain. My Doctor cited the megadoses I was taking as the cause. I wrote the site and never got an answer. How many people has this happened to since? There have been several cases of users here on phytoestogens who have had strokes and yes even heart attacks at young ages. The Doctor says it also elevates chloresterol which blocks arteries. Since then of course I've had a toltal of 3 strokes and 3 heart attacks as most of you know. While I cannot attest whether the small dose women take is safe or not I can attest that in my opinion it is not safe for transgendered MTF's at least not in the doses trans sites recommend.

http://www.lauras-playground.com/forums/in...&hl=feminol

With all that has happened this year with unsafe products Who can attest to the safety of herbal products? Last week an expose revealed lead in some lipsticks and blushes.

Liquid Silicone Warning

We've carried several articles on the dangers of liquid silicone injections before in our news and archives section and articles but it hasn't been on the forums so I'm bringing it up again. In our culture some of those transitioning from male to female have engaged in pumping parties where they had Liquid silicone injected into, buttocks, breasts, hips and even faces. THIS CAN CAUSE DEATH OR DISFIGUREMENT WITH SEVERE SCARRING. While I used to have pictures I can no longer find them but make no mistake this has occured. THose who injected it in their faces were unrecognizable. I did find 1 picture though of a woman who had liquid silicone pumped into her breasts http://www.siliconeholocaust.org/siliconestories2.html .I can say no more than the picture conveys except DON'T DO IT. Many have died from this.

I'm sorry to say there is no magic wand that can feminize or mascalinize you. If there were I'd have a lump on my head from hitting myself with it and I'd look and sound like Dolly Parton. No offense hon. It's a compliment. There are no "SAFE SHORTCUTS". Go through the steps: Therapy, prescription hormones from a doctor, transition (RLT) and surgery with a well qualified surgeon. Avoid the back alley's, black market hormones and back street castrations as well as herbal concoctions. Taking Internet prescription hormones without medical monitoring is dangerous and has caused many deaths and disabilities. I'm no fan of jumping through hoops but the HBIGDA (Wpath) Standards of care are safe. Our mission here is to save lives, not just from suicide but from foolish and dangerous practices as well. We want you all to be users here for years to come. We want you to be safe and certain of your path. My email volume is heavy and we see the results and regrets of shortcuts all the time. The dangers are not worth your lives, now or in the future. Be safe. :) Be aware.

Laura

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Laura, I totally agree with everything you have said in your post. Several years ago I stumbled onto the "Transformations" web site and thought, OMG. My dreams have come true. Blissfully ignorant at the time, I ordered a 6 month supply of their most potent phytoestrogens. While I didn't suffer any adverse reactions, nothing happened. Absolutely nothing. I didn't gain even an inch on my breasts. Talk about being taken for a ride. The kicker was, every month thereafter, I received in the mail a catalog with all their wares from breast forms to hormones printed on the front cover for all the world to see. Now that was embarassing. It took like what seemed forever to get off their mailing list.

I will echo Laura's warning. DON'T DO IT!

MaryEllen

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I can't agree more on the topic of Phytoestrogens. Considering that due to receptor saturation, and reactance of your own bodys hormonal mixtures being rearranged, they are infact dangerous regardless of the claims. They are way too weak to be much good but too strong to not throw your bodies chemical mix out of whack. I do believe that under the supervision of an endocrinologist, they may be able to feminize to a point, but if you were to do that, why not just do it right with the conventional methods? The main danger, beyond mega-dosing, is potentialy enducing very dangerous imbalances that could contribute significantly to major depressive disorders. The desires you have are yours, its up to you to decide if they are your weakness, or to own them, to control them instead of letting them control you. My advice is, dont let others take advantage of you're desires!

/hugs

Bethany

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Are Evanesce and Feminol Phytoestrogens, though? I've still not been able to find ANY scientific articles on Evanesce and Feminol, and the effects -- positive or negative -- they have on transgendered women. I just keep getting links to various websites repeating each other, with no hard data about either of these two products.

Hugs

Samantha

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Hello Agony,

Evanesce and Feminol are products designed to help post-menopausal women with some of the symptoms of menopause. The actual estrogen content is so small that it wouldn't noticable as an effective HRT. Remember these products are for genetic women who's hormones are mainly estrogen to start with. Don't waste your money on them. We're familiar with the site you mentioned. They will tell you anything to sell their products. In answer to your question. Yes, Evanesce and Feminol are made from herbal extracts known as phytoestrogens. As far as I know, there have been no scientific studys as to the effects of these products. The only studies done have been by the companies that manufacture these products and as you might guess, these studies are extremely biased in favor of their products. You would do well to heed Laura's warning as to the dangers of these products. The dosages of these products recommended for feminization of a M to F are extremely toxic to the system. I would urge you to stop obsessing over these products and go the legal route. See a doctor for a complete physical and let him determine what a safe hormone level would be for you to be taking. I'm sure you don't want to risk getting a serious illness or even dying from taking these unregulated products.

MaryEllen

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I was recently banned at the forum that sells Evanesce and Feminol, for being "combative". All I did was ask critical questions about the products and mentioned to them specific things negatively said about the products. "Diana" over there ALWAYS avoided answering the questions, instead saying something along the lines of that I didn't do enough searching of the myevanesce.com forum. Only a handful of people even post there, and mostly they don't even post unless someone "new" (yeah, right) comes along with newbie questions. The questions are quite often totally unrelated to the issues of HRT and are designed so as to not be difficult to answer (get my drift?). I will finish up my month supply of E & F, then HOPEFULLY I will get my HRT letter from the therapist. After my first session last Thursday, the therapist said that she would give me my letter for HRT, and that she still needs to see me -- mostly for other issues such as anger management, and dealing with my mother's death when I was five years old, and getting past the years and years of abuse by my father and some other members of my adoptive family.

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Just wanted to say thanks for posting this info. I'm one of those naive pre-transition girls who has considered phytoestrogens in the form of Peuraria after having it recommended to me by someone. Whilst I have a great interest in herbal remedies as a complimentary medicine I aired on the side of caution when it came to something like hormones and I'm realising now I was right to do so! Will definitely be waiting until I can get prescription medication me thinks, whenever that time will come.

Thanks again.

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good idea paula to get the proper medication alot of the herbal ones are just a big rip off the shops must make thousands

out of pre op/ post op trans alot of the times people get fed up with waiting to be put on hormones and self medicate themselves which in itsself can be dangerous and they pay silly money for creams or tablets the shops will keep selling them to you all there main interest is the money not what it might do to your health.

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i to tried herbal so called hrt from trandsformation back in the late 1980s through 1994.i did this cause i didn't think i could get help with real hrt .i finally got on real hrt ,although i did see results i was talking more then double the mega dosagges .in 1996 i started urinating blood .i went to the dr and was diagnozed with bladder cancer. two urlagist stated it was more then likely that my megadozing caused the cancer .there is no easy fix go to a endo and do it safe ,once you get your script it is cheaper and safer .

misstina

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Thanks for the info on these herbal products. I do not have access to a therapist in my area, but I will see a physician about HRT treatments.

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Thanks, Laura, for posting this.

No one should EVER take ANYTHING that has not been thouroughly tested using double blind studies and having FDA approval. I know the approval process is a mare's nest and not perfect but it's the best we have right now. It does work.

We are not guinea pigs - don't become a test case or a statistic. Lives are too important to experiment with untested quack remedies.

Take your time, do it right. Never be the first to try anything. Learn critical thinking skills and use them. We are fair game for the charlatans and bad people who are only out for a buck and don't care about the carnage they leave in their wake. They are scum.

Testamonials are not proof of efficacy, pictures of men in white coats are not authorities. Anyone, it seems, can peddle their junk. Caveat emptor.

Okay, my rant is over. :lol: Cookies for everyone :)

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No one should EVER take ANYTHING that has not been thouroughly tested using double blind studies and having FDA approval.

Cyproterone acetate (aka Androcur) is not FDA-approved, though its available in such remote places...as Canada. I don't see why its not FDA-approved. Basically, I wouldn't put all my stock on what FDA says, but more on what it's commonly known to do (per studies), and prescription drugs always being better than off-the-counter ones per effects for the same dose.

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Sara, you are right - I am wrong. I shouldn't have limited it to FDA approval. I was seeing red, I think. :lol:

I should have said to stick with things that have been double-blind tested and are approved by a legitimate regulatory authority based upon those studies. Other countries (including Canada, yay!) are more reasonable about this than is the US. We are so slow at getting things approved, our litigious (sp?) society probably has a lot to do with it.

Just thinking about those charlatans makes me cranky. I better take a nap. After my cookies and milk!!! :lol:

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You know down in mexico they eat Bull testicles , yeah mmmmm yummy..

You ever hear of prairie oysters or rocky mountain oysters?? same thing

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Thank You for this post. It opened up my eyes a little bit and not to hurry the process. I just have to be patient and wait for the doctor to prescribe me what I need to transition. :D

Huggs,

Sarah F

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I used to see this stuff in advertisements all the time. Thank god I wasn't old enough to actually buy that stuff. >.<

If this isn't illegal, it should be. =\

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It would be great to see some research reviewed on these things, but herbs tend to get a backseat in the FDA/pharmaceuatical world. I've used the puerria and EF and had enough indications my wife became concerned, but glad to be moving to a more safe and path. Someday we'll get details on what works and what doesn't. I am also more and more interested in how genomics could play a role in switching on characteristics for people. Bypass trying to send fake messages in the body, but be able to get the body to send the initial signal.

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Hey! I remember this thread. I was doing research into herbals and it's what introduced me to Laura's Playground. It definitely made me say no to an herbal solution. I had forgotten about this thread, so it's nice to have come full circle.

Rayne

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A wile back i checked out a few of the mentioned sites and products.. there is nothing more to say then its a wast of your money. I even tried a couple products like fenugreek and soy isoflavons, theres just is not enough of any ingredient in them to make a difference.. live and learn i guess.

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I'm new to this and admit to falling into taking herbal concoctions. Mainly because you can just go out and get it at any major drugstore, no therapist involved. It's easy! However, seeing a therapist is probably the path I really need to take at this point and have started looking for someone nearby to talk to. There are no answers in a $10 bottle of pills (and no breasts).

Edited by JJ
Removed names of herbs

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Welcome to Laura's Playground

Seeing a good gender therapist really is the best and in the long run the cheapest way to deal with all of this. The herbals are just a waste of money and in the long run you can end up wasting a lot of your life seeking solutions that don't work. If you are lucky enough not to lose your life and health in the process.

Sorry about removing the herbs but sometimes members see the names and not the message or think they may work for them even if not for you. Desperation can sometimes leads to poor judgment and it is better to err on the side of caution.

Please feel free to post all you want and please take a moment to read the T & C if you haven't. They are unique and not the same old, same old due to the nature of the site. If you post an introduction in the Intro forum you'll give us a chance to get to know you and welcome you properly.

Glad to have you here

Johnny

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Thank you Johnny for your feedback. Just got back to this topic today and read your comment. Will definitely take some time and post an introduction. I do love the site and hope to make some good friends!

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I have taken some of the for mention herbal products. I stopped because their was a little effect and needed to concentrate finishing up my full time job and not willing to change just yet. I am now seeing a GID specialist /therapy and lining up for my letter in a couple years.

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