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JenniferB

Name Change

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JenniferB   
JenniferB

A lot is happening close to the same time. I am planning to start the process to legally change my name to a female name.The church records has me listed with my current name.What will the church do when my legal name is changed to Jennifer. Would I be known by my male name, even though I am perceived as female? That would be very awkward amd embarrassed. No way would I attend church then.

Jenny

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Guest John Chiv   
Guest John Chiv

Jenny,

You stood your ground with the bishop. Who knows what will happen when you have your legal name change? Keep the faith and cross that bridge when you get there.

John

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April63   
April63

I would think your records would be updated to your new legal name. That is what happens every other time a person's name is changed. Your bishop does not sound like the type of guy that would force you to keep your old name on the records.

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JenniferB   
JenniferB

Thanks April. If more members were like you, I would feel more comfortable to go back and start the repentance process.

Jenny

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(Lightsider)   
(Lightsider)

I would think your records would be updated to your new legal name. That is what happens every other time a person's name is changed. Your bishop does not sound like the type of guy that would force you to keep your old name on the records.

It is not up to the local authorities, bishop, stake president, Area General Authority etc. Salt Lake city ie. the President has final say on those matters. My request was denied. If it were up to the local leaders my name would have been changed because they knew the full story of what was going on.

This is one of the reasons I am seriously considering having my old name removed from church records. But even if you do that the church still keeps record of your name some where so it really never goes away.

While I was active the Bishop had to bury my records and not even his counselors were allowed to see them. This is one of the problems with being an active member and going about your business. You are marked. You will never be able to escape your past and you will have to revisit your past every time you have a new bishop. My breaking point was when I encountered a new bishop and he asking a very degrading question. You will never be called to work with the youth. You will never be allowed to go to the temple.

On one hand I can understand not being allowed to work with the youth because the way the general membership is if they did find out your "male" past all kinds of accusations could be thrown about because of shear ignorance. Imagine some ignorant person in church suddenly accusing you of child molestation. Just the accusation alone even if proven false could be life long damage.

My leadership wanted me to stick it out another couple of years in hope that the Presidency might change it's mind. That is like waiting for a frog to turn into a Prince. It ain't gonna happen. This is simply the reality of things.

I really hate to be the bearer of the bad news. You are going to have an uphill battle and will make it far but you will be stopped and that will be it.

Now on top of what I just said there a question...why would you feel the need to repent Jennifer? Do you feel living as a female is sinful for you?

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JenniferB   
JenniferB

It is not up to the local authorities, bishop, stake president, Area General Authority etc. Salt Lake city ie. the President has final say on those matters. My request was denied. If it were up to the local leaders my name would have been changed because they knew the full story of what was going on.

This is one of the reasons I am seriously considering having my old name removed from church records. But even if you do that the church still keeps record of your name some where so it really never goes away.

While I was active the Bishop had to bury my records and not even his counselors were allowed to see them. This is one of the problems with being an active member and going about your business. You are marked. You will never be able to escape your past and you will have to revisit your past every time you have a new bishop. My breaking point was when I encountered a new bishop and he asking a very degrading question. You will never be called to work with the youth. You will never be allowed to go to the temple.

On one hand I can understand not being allowed to work with the youth because the way the general membership is if they did find out your "male" past all kinds of accusations could be thrown about because of shear ignorance. Imagine some ignorant person in church suddenly accusing you of child molestation. Just the accusation alone even if proven false could be life long damage.

My leadership wanted me to stick it out another couple of years in hope that the Presidency might change it's mind. That is like waiting for a frog to turn into a Prince. It ain't gonna happen. This is simply the reality of things.

I really hate to be the bearer of the bad news. You are going to have an uphill battle and will make it far but you will be stopped and that will be it.

Now on top of what I just said there a question...why would you feel the need to repent Jennifer? Do you feel living as a female is sinful for you?

I was actually talking in a general sense about repentance, it has nothing to do with repenting of transitioning into a female. It has more to do with my overall living, like the word of wisdom, tithing, keeping the sabbath day holy, etc...

I do see April as more accepting and willing to answer questions. And she understands transsexuality and what gender dysphoria is all about. If more members were like her instead of being ignorant, church would be a more welcome place.

As far as living as a female, I made sure I went to a qualified gender therapist with a good reputation. I wanted to make totally sure I wanted to follow this path. I started with a social worker first who would have given me my recommendation letter when asked. But she didn't follow the SoC and I found that unacceptable, no short cuts. I wanted to make sure. So I changed to a psychologist with a PhD who specialized in gender issues and followed the WPATH SoC. Plus she has a lot of experience helping many transgender people over the years. She's actually retiring this year so you can imagine how many transsexuals she's seen. She gave me my recommendation letter after six months of therapy. I've been on hormones for five months now. And knew this time last year that I had to transition and that the gender dysphoria would never go away or would I be able to hide it again.

I did not take any short cuts, and am feeling very satisfied with the changes. I honestly don't see myself ever detransitioning. However I did leave the door open in case I ever wanted to return to church. And I will consider it closely after pre-op transiton. Yet, it is highly doubtful I would ever return.

Jenny

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(Lightsider)   
(Lightsider)

I was actually talking in a general sense about repentance, it has nothing to do with repenting of transitioning into a female. It has more to do with my overall living, like the word of wisdom, tithing, keeping the sabbath day holy, etc...

I do see April as more accepting and willing to answer questions. And she understands transsexuality and what gender dysphoria is all about. If more members were like her instead of being ignorant, church would be a more welcome place.

As far as living as a female, I made sure I went to a qualified gender therapist with a good reputation. I wanted to make totally sure I wanted to follow this path. I started with a social worker first who would have given me my recommendation letter when asked. But she didn't follow the SoC and I found that unacceptable, no short cuts. I wanted to make sure. So I changed to a psychologist with a PhD who specialized in gender issues and followed the WPATH SoC. Plus she has a lot of experience helping many transgender people over the years. She's actually retiring this year so you can imagine how many transsexuals she's seen. She gave me my recommendation letter after six months of therapy. I've been on hormones for five months now. And knew this time last year that I had to transition and that the gender dysphoria would never go away or would I be able to hide it again.

I did not take any short cuts, and am feeling very satisfied with the changes. I honestly don't see myself ever detransitioning. However I did leave the door open in case I ever wanted to return to church. And I will consider it closely after pre-op transiton. Yet, it is highly doubtful I would ever return.

Jenny

Ah ok. I was not sure where you were coming from. I de-transitioned once. Huge mistake.

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April63   
April63

It is not up to the local authorities, bishop, stake president, Area General Authority etc. Salt Lake city ie. the President has final say on those matters. My request was denied. If it were up to the local leaders my name would have been changed because they knew the full story of what was going on.

But a simple name change should not require approval from the President of the Church. The only way I would think that would happen is if the local authorities forwarded the request. This could be done because they saw it as a step too far into transition. Unless all name changes go to Salt Lake (which they might, but not the President), I would the local authorities would have some kind of say in it first. Changing gender would definitely be a Salt Lake issue, but a regular name change I do not believe is.

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JenniferB   
JenniferB

But a simple name change should not require approval from the President of the Church. The only way I would think that would happen is if the local authorities forwarded the request. This could be done because they saw it as a step too far into transition. Unless all name changes go to Salt Lake (which they might, but not the President), I would the local authorities would have some kind of say in it first. Changing gender would definitely be a Salt Lake issue, but a regular name change I do not believe is.

That's what I was trying to get at. The reason for the name change is because I'm changing gender, although not SRS as of now.

Jenny

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(Lightsider)   
(Lightsider)

But a simple name change should not require approval from the President of the Church. The only way I would think that would happen is if the local authorities forwarded the request. This could be done because they saw it as a step too far into transition. Unless all name changes go to Salt Lake (which they might, but not the President), I would the local authorities would have some kind of say in it first. Changing gender would definitely be a Salt Lake issue, but a regular name change I do not believe is.

I am sorry but what I am telling you is the truth. Not even a name change is allowed once they know you are changing genders. And on top of that even if they by some miracle allowed a name change the fact that they have you down as MALE or female on the records which they can not change on the local level...follows you on your records along with any priesthoods you may have held etc. The ward clerk will see this and it makes the rest moot. Those records even include previous marriages and children.

You can try, and more power to you if you succeed. I am just being truthful about this because I have been there and done that.

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JenniferB   
JenniferB

I am sorry but what I am telling you is the truth. Not even a name change is allowed once they know you are changing genders. And on top of that even if they by some miracle allowed a name change the fact that they have you down as MALE or female on the records which they can not change on the local level...follows you on your records along with any priesthoods you may have held etc. The ward clerk will see this and it makes the rest moot. Those records even include previous marriages and children.

You can try, and more power to you if you succeed. I am just being truthful about this because I have been there and done that.

I need to state first that I believe the LDS church does a lot of good for a lot of people, and that they are there when there are calamities in the world, easing the suffering. Plus I don't have any hatred for them. Actually I believe most of their doctrines.

If this statement by Lightsider is true then I don't believe the LDS church understands transsexualism. Therefore, any transsexual who is considering joining the church needs to understand the church's policies first so they are well informed. Since I feel they would act hostile towards me because I am transsexual, I have no desire to become active unless they change their policies.

Jenny

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Guest Haileyruso   
Guest Haileyruso

I legally changed my name to a female name, and feel no need to have the church change it on their records. The only reason that I can see why it would be important is if you paid tithes to the church and wanted to use that as a deduction on your taxes...donation name and tax record name need to match. Otherwise it seems like more trouble than it's worth. If the church leaders come looking for (old name), I will just tell them that he is not here.

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VickySGV   
VickySGV

wanted to use that as a deduction on your taxes...donation name and tax record name need to match.

I don't know that much about the Mormon Church, but I do know the IRS quite well after 33 years, Life is better than you thought-- if you have checks or copies of them from your bank with a name you can civilly prove is yours , with the ward /stake/ church endorsement on them, you get the deduction!! The state or IRS goes to you, not a church, unless something is REALLY fishy.

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Guest Haileyruso   
Guest Haileyruso

wanted to use that as a deduction on your taxes...donation name and tax record name need to match.

I don't know that much about the Mormon Church, but I do know the IRS quite well after 33 years, Life is better than you thought-- if you have checks or copies of them from your bank with a name you can civilly prove is yours , with the ward /stake/ church endorsement on them, you get the deduction!! The state or IRS goes to you, not a church, unless something is REALLY fishy.

Then I see no reason why you would need to change the name on the church records, unless you are seeking validation from the church, which I personally don't need or want...but that's just me.

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(Lightsider)   
(Lightsider)

The reason a person would want a name to match church records is for the following reasons:

1. Validation of ones true being.

2. So that your personal business is not the business of the ward clerk and every one else with access to the records.

3. So you can hold a calling (a church job).

4. If you tithe you must do it anonymously. And the list goes on and on.

There are several road blocks in the way when church records do not match the persons identity. As it stands now it is just best to not take part in it or have your name removed from the records.

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Julie1957   
Julie1957

I'm not Mormon so this may be a dumb question: Can you quit the church, change your name, and rejoin the church under your new name?

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(Lightsider)   
(Lightsider)

I'm not Mormon so this may be a dumb question: Can you quit the church, change your name, and rejoin the church under your new name?

You can try but if they catch you then it will be a huge set back. I can not believe I did not see this question until now. I am pretty certain they ask for birth certificates...and other forms of ID. Birth dates....parents... etc. I think they even ask for social security numbers because they use that in tracking genealogy. My best guess is they would eventually catch you. And besides do you want to be dishonest when you join them and have a black cloud hanging over you? And what if some one recognizes you? Not worth it.

My feeling is this... if the LDS church wants to treat you and other trans the way they do why would we want to support such oppressive behavior? They either openingly love and accept you or they don't.

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