Is this a normal feeling

[Cmattison]

Hey. So I'm afab, and questioning. I thought for a good while I was definitely FTM. Then after a few months of accepting and coming out to my husband, I went back to feeling just female. Then for a few months, I went back to feeling like a guy. When I'm in guy mode I have these intense needs to flatten my chest, pack, cut off my long hair, and have facial hair. 

 

Since early September I havent felt any dysphoria, or need or desire to be/present male.....and I want to?

 

I'm sad that now that I've accepted being Male (at least sometimes) and that has gone away. 

 

Also, in girl mode I seem to be asexual. However when I'm in guy mode, I tent to be a more sexual person. 

 

Is all of this normal? 

Thanks in advance for the kind comments.

[Jani]

I think we all tend to want to apply a name or label to our identity when in reality its not necessary.  And it may be harmful as we exclude options and possibilities that may be valid.  Do you have anxiety because of this?  Being gender fluid, being able to flow back and forth is valid and may be your answer.  Remember there is lots of room between the binary ends for us to live happily.  

 

Jani 

[Cmattison]

Just now, Jani said:

I think we all tend to want to apply a name or label to our identity when in reality its not necessary.  And it may be harmful as we exclude options and possibilities that may be valid.  Do you have anxiety because of this?  Being gender fluid, being able to flow back and forth is valid and may be your answer.  Remember there is lots of room between the binary ends for us to live happily.  

 

Jani 

Hi Jani,

 

I don't think its necessarily the label that bothers me. I know I am who I am. I think what bothers me the most is that I feel almost like 2 different people?? I mean my likes and dislikes, my personality, me overall doesnt change. But for a while I feel fine. No dysphoria (I think?) And I'm okay being female bodied. But then for awhile I am absolutely not okay being female bodied and the need to be Male bodied is intense. 

 

I guess I'm just unsure how to navigate it. I mean, I feel fine being female bodied at this current moment, but if I could cha ge a few things, I would. I'd still prefer a flat chest, body hair doesn't bother me, I'd still prefer facial hair. But I dont hate being in this body. When guy mode comes, I cant stand not having body and facial hair. My chest is excruciating to have to deal with and see, and female parts just dont feel right. 

 

I don't think transitioning is something I am ready for....because I don't think that will help on my more female days.

[Willow]

Hi,

 

I can't say that I can completely relate because I am mtf, not ftm.  But from the opposite point of view I have or have had similar feelings.  there are times that I am fine being who I am physically.  And there are other times I have very specific needs or desires to be female.  So here is something to think about.  What is different when you have the very strong need to be male?  Stress?  Depression?  Lack of intimacy or satisfaction?  Fear of rejection or something else?  You don't need to express your answer just think about it.  Is there something in your life that triggers or that stops how you feel in male mode?  If there is and you can identify what that is, it may help you understand yourself and how you feel.  but like others have said, you don't need a label, you may be whatever you want to be, but the most important is to be happy with who you are and to understand that for yourself.

 

 

Willow

[Cmattison]

12 hours ago, Willow said:

Hi,

 

I can't say that I can completely relate because I am mtf, not ftm.  But from the opposite point of view I have or have had similar feelings.  there are times that I am fine being who I am physically.  And there are other times I have very specific needs or desires to be female.  So here is something to think about.  What is different when you have the very strong need to be male?  Stress?  Depression?  Lack of intimacy or satisfaction?  Fear of rejection or something else?  You don't need to express your answer just think about it.  Is there something in your life that triggers or that stops how you feel in male mode?  If there is and you can identify what that is, it may help you understand yourself and how you feel.  but like others have said, you don't need a label, you may be whatever you want to be, but the most important is to be happy with who you are and to understand that for yourself.

 

 

Willow

I know you said not to get express my answer...but that's the thing...I cant find anything??? I found I went back to basically girl mode when I was in a wedding in the beginning of September. I was terrified I was going to hate getting my nails done and wearing a dress and my hair and makeup. But I found I enjoyed it. I didnt have any dysphoria. And j stayed that way for quite a while until I just recently started feeling masculine (as in today) again. I know I also have terrible social anxiety. I've been saying for 6 months now that I want to cut my hair off and have yet to do it for some strange physical attachment and the fear I'll look androgynous or butch. I want to outwardly present femme, but at home present and be my masculine self. And my long hair just causes a lot of dysphoria for me. But to the outside it helps me cover up my true feelings as I'm not ready to come out to anyone.

 

It's not necessarily a label I'm looking for, it's more I guess a way to live in my female body, present female to the outside world but be comfortable enough to be masculine at home. I've considered starting T for a bit because I want facial and body hair. I want bottom growth. But I'm afraid my voice will drop and while in Male mode I'm okay with that, if I still try to present feminine outwardly, the voice may throw people off. I figure I could shave the hair when I need to, but mostly I want the hair...

[Willow]

I understand how you feel but from the opposite prospective.  I want long hair, breast growth and no body hair.  But similar you I still want to be able present as my birth gender when necessary. 

 

Willow

[Cmattison]

Just now, Willow said:

I understand how you feel but from the opposite prospective.  I want long hair, breast growth and no body hair.  But similar you I still want to be able present as my birth gender when necessary. 

 

Willow

I guess it's hard to be in either position. thanks for your responses.

[Jani]

Transitioning is about going as far as you need to get to a comfortable point for you, and our loved ones (if they are in the picture).  

20 hours ago, Cmattison said:

I guess I'm just unsure how to navigate it. I mean, I feel fine being female bodied at this current moment, but if I could change a few things, I would. I'd still prefer a flat chest, body hair doesn't bother me, I'd still prefer facial hair. But I dont hate being in this body. When guy mode comes, I cant stand not having body and facial hair. My chest is excruciating to have to deal with and see, and female parts just dont feel right. 

 

I don't think transitioning is something I am ready for....because I don't think that will help on my more female days.

Well, how about changing a few things?  What would you change?  You could get a mastectomy and maintain the other female attributes of your body.   You would need to go on Testosterone to get facial hair.  I don't know of any other way.   And then you would eventually have a change in your voice to deal with.  This may or may not be problematic for you and/or your spouse.   You can take medication to stop menstruation.  As you see this is all a balancing act to get to where we are comfortable and have less stress in our lives.  It may be social or medical transition, or a combination of the two.  

 

You say you're not ready to transition.  That's OK.  Then fine tune your life, presentation and social interactions to fit how you feel.    Its good that you are thinking about this and you seem to know where your limits are as to what you need.  

 

Hugs, Jani

 

 

[Cmattison]

Just now, Jani said:

Transitioning is about going as far as you need to get to a comfortable point for you, and our loved ones (if they are in the picture).  

Well, how about changing a few things?  What would you change?  You could get a mastectomy and maintain the other female attributes of your body.   You would need to go on Testosterone to get facial hair.  I don't know of any other way.   And then you would eventually have a change in your voice to deal with.  This may or may not be problematic for you and/or your spouse.   You can take medication to stop menstruation.  As you see this is all a balancing act to get to where we are comfortable and have less stress in our lives.  It may be social or medical transition, or a combination of the two.  

 

You say you're not ready to transition.  That's OK.  Then fine tune your life, presentation and social interactions to fit how you feel.    Its good that you are thinking about this and you seem to know where your limits are as to what you need.  

 

Hugs, Jani

 

 

Thanks Jani. Luckily my husband is completely supportive. He said hes on board with whatever I need to do. yay! I'm actually okay with most of the changes Testosterone would give me. The only one that scares me is the voice change. I feel as though I'd love to medically transition without socially transitioning. I've been buying more predominantly men clothes. Other then tshirts and basketball shorts that is my usual summer attire. I've bought some mens Jean's, flannel shirts, and boots, and beanies. I'm super excited to wear them. I think I'm just back to the social issues. Now that I'm thinking about it, I'm scared to wear them. Before I'd just grab my husbands clothes and not think twice about it. 

[Jani]

Thats good that he's on board.  Voice change would be a big change!   There are plenty folks that do the medical only but it is a little harder as some of the changes are a bit difficult to mask.   Please don't be afraid to wear your new clothing.  Start slow by substituting one piece at a time unit you get comfortable and then you add another.  Before you know it, no clothing issues!   And of course you can always switch back or go into a holding pattern when you feel all right.  

 

Cheers, Jani

[Lorraine]

So l guess l am not really relating. I have long hair, nicely proportional breasts and a nice female form. I try to keep a decent manicure and yet l also dress in a very masculine fashion.  I engage in predominately male activities and yet, l would be completely horrified if l were to even consider trying to somehow masculinize my body. 

I just cannot follow. I happen to be happily married to a really sexy guy, but even still, l am occasionally approached by other women.

Please do not mis understand . I completely support whatever you choose to do to, or with your own body. After all. It is yours. I just honestly cannot conceive of trying to somehow look or act like a  man, l clearly am not.

[Jani]

Thats the difference between a male and female brain!  I've fought the hard battle to remove some of the things Cmattison desires.  I dress as a woman yet engage in a number of masculine oriented activities also.  I do not want to be perceived as a man but I can certainly appreciate others needs.  Viva la difference! 

[Cmattison]

9 hours ago, Lorraine said:

So l guess l am not really relating. I have long hair, nicely proportional breasts and a nice female form. I try to keep a decent manicure and yet l also dress in a very masculine fashion.  I engage in predominately male activities and yet, l would be completely horrified if l were to even consider trying to somehow masculinize my body. 

I just cannot follow. I happen to be happily married to a really sexy guy, but even still, l am occasionally approached by other women.

Please do not mis understand . I completely support whatever you choose to do to, or with your own body. After all. It is yours. I just honestly cannot conceive of trying to somehow look or act like a  man, l clearly am not.

Hey...so I'm not really sure i can explain it. Trust me, if a few years ago somebody would have told me I'd be having these thoughts and feelings on a man, I would probably tell them they're crazy. I've never been "feminine" in the normal aspect. I dont shave any hair, I bite my nails and keep them short, i hardly wear makeup. The one exception is for the most part, my hair has always been long. 

 

But when the dysphoria hits me it's real and its hard to deal with. I have extreme beard and body hair envy, I wish I had no chest. They just dont feel right and I cant stand them (even when I'm feeling slightly femme). 

[Robin]

I wish that it was possible to simply be recognised as transgender, without having to do anything.  Nobody seems to accept that someone can have a female brain in a male body, or vice versa.  I am expected to either behave as a man, or to modify my appearance so that I can pass as a cis woman.  It would be great if there was another option, that allowed me to be believed, and to be acceptable as I am.

 

Robin.

[Willow]

You are very fortunate that your husband is very understanding.  Not all of us are that fortunate.  When i first came out to my wife her response was that at the end of the summer she was leaving me.  Well, I have had less dysphoria lately and she has become more understanding.  But, that comment is always there.  I don't know what she would do or say if she saw me in a dress or other women's clothing.  (yes I have owned and worn some even outside the house although not exactly in public)  I agree with the suggestion that you should go with one item at a time and as you become more comfortable add another.  fortunately mens clothes tend to be more androgynous and lots of very femme women can and do dress in flannel shirts and jeans so that's easy.  Wearing a suit and tie might be a bit of a stretch to start, but we've all seen sexy female models dressed that way.

 

At least what ever you chose to wear at home you don't have to feel self conscious about it.  

 

Willow

[Cmattison]

30 minutes ago, Willow said:

You are very fortunate that your husband is very understanding.  Not all of us are that fortunate.  When i first came out to my wife her response was that at the end of the summer she was leaving me.  Well, I have had less dysphoria lately and she has become more understanding.  But, that comment is always there.  I don't know what she would do or say if she saw me in a dress or other women's clothing.  (yes I have owned and worn some even outside the house although not exactly in public)  I agree with the suggestion that you should go with one item at a time and as you become more comfortable add another.  fortunately mens clothes tend to be more androgynous and lots of very femme women can and do dress in flannel shirts and jeans so that's easy.  Wearing a suit and tie might be a bit of a stretch to start, but we've all seen sexy female models dressed that way.

 

At least what ever you chose to wear at home you don't have to feel self conscious about it.  

 

Willow

Willow, 

 

I am very thankful that hes so accepting. And you are absolutely correct that its more socially acceptable for a female bodied person to go out in mens attire then it is the opposite. But mens attire, though does help some, doesnt help my dysphoria with my body. It sounds dumb, but for me, my lack of facial hair and inability to grow it, is torturous. My chest not being flat, and my curves are not something I enjoy.

 

I'm sorry that your wife is having a hard time accepting it. I've thought about it the opposite, and if my husband came to me and told me he was trans, truthfully I'm not sure how I'd handle it. I mean, I love him, hes my rock and my world, and absolutely always will be. But it would take some adjusting. And that's coming from me, a person who does fall somewhere on the trans spectrum. 

 

My best advice to you, is give it time, keep your communication open, and dont be afraid to talk to your wife. Both of you have strong feelings that need to be listened to and handled. Dont be too afraid to try again. It may have been an initial reaction. I know for me...when I first started questioning I was quick to reject the thoughts. Then I slowly started accepting it. Maybe your wife just needs an adjustment period and as you said, start small. For you, put clear nail polish on, slowly grow your hair out a little longer, wear some foundation, wear womens underwear. This is stuff that may help you, your wife may  or notice and they are small subtle changes, instead of one huge change.

 

[Willow]

Hi,

 

You are right in everything you've said.  I started using clear nail strengthening nail polish a few years ago.  worn women's undergarments off and on for years both with her knowledge at the time.  Got my ears pierced almost two years ago.  Started shaving my body hair about a year ago. But I didn't "come out" to her until late spring this year.  Right now I'm slowly pushing to buy a wig.  You wouldn't know, but the ability to grow my hair long was lost years ago.  LOL.  

 

I do understand your dysphoria over facial and body hair but that's because while you want it, I want to be rid of it.  As for your curves, men with gynecomastia wear vests, special undershirts and even items similar to women's sports bras to flatten and hide their curves so there are items of men's clothing that could help you with that.  I can't help you with the desire for facial and body hair.  Obviously leg and underarm hair might be easy,  Leonisa which is a women's online store also sell men's gynecomastia garments.  There are others if you search gynecomastia.

 

Willow

[Willow]

"I wish that it was possible to simply be recognised as transgender, without having to do anything.  Nobody seems to accept that someone can have a female brain in a male body, or vice versa.  I am expected to either behave as a man, or to modify my appearance so that I can pass as a cis woman.  It would be great if there was another option, that allowed me to be believed, and to be acceptable as I am.

 

Robin."

 

I agree that I wish we could be recognized and accepted as TG but clearly. while people are becoming somewhat more accepting, we aren't there yet, not by a long shot.  

 

I just read in the news how a transgender girl in Virginia was not allowed to join her classmates during an active shooter drill in a place of protection.  The teachers involved made her sit in the bleachers in the gym while they debated if she should go to the girls locker room or the boys.  if our schools are afraid of an 11 or 12 year old, it's no wonder we can't be accepted yet as adults. They never did put her is a place of safety.

 

Willow

[Cmattison]

52 minutes ago, Willow said:

Hi,

 

You are right in everything you've said.  I started using clear nail strengthening nail polish a few years ago.  worn women's undergarments off and on for years both with her knowledge at the time.  Got my ears pierced almost two years ago.  Started shaving my body hair about a year ago. But I didn't "come out" to her until late spring this year.  Right now I'm slowly pushing to buy a wig.  You wouldn't know, but the ability to grow my hair long was lost years ago.  LOL.  

 

I do understand your dysphoria over facial and body hair but that's because while you want it, I want to be rid of it.  As for your curves, men with gynecomastia wear vests, special undershirts and even items similar to women's sports bras to flatten and hide their curves so there are items of men's clothing that could help you with that.  I can't help you with the desire for facial and body hair.  Obviously leg and underarm hair might be easy,  Leonisa which is a women's online store also sell men's gynecomastia garments.  There are others if you search gynecomastia.

 

Willow

Yes. Leg and underarm hair pretty much stay year round. I will shave my underarms if I'm going out somewhere nice in a sleeveless top. My legs not so much. But it's very thin blonde hair. People really dont notice my leg hair, but neither do I really. I wish it were more coarse. I'm dealing with that the best I can without having transition for now. I didnt know there were mens clothes that I could get to flatten my chest. I know about binders and already know which one I'm getting, I just need to measure. I'll have to look into that. Thank you. 

[Lorraine]

On 10/9/2018 at 9:21 AM, Robin said:

  It would be great if there was another option, that allowed me to be believed, and to be acceptable as I am

That is what l am getting at. Why be anything? Why not just be yourself? 

I am accepted as l am. Just who l am. Why must gender be an issue?

[Jani]

34 minutes ago, Lorraine said:

Why be anything? Why not just be yourself? 

What would you be if you didn't know what you were?    Being you is a great point.

 

Jani

 

[GothicLucas]

@Cmattison I see the conversation has been going on for awhile, just wanted to say that literally every word in your original post describes me ? Are you me from another dimension? lol...

It sounds like you're doing a lot to explore your feelings, so I suggest that you keep doing that. I've been on this journey for a little over 3 years and although I originally wanted to jump right into an FTM transition, I was forced to wait and that sort of ended up being a good deal for me. I had a chance to explore some more feelings, and I think at this point I'm getting a really good grasp on who I really am and what I want to do to get closer to that person. Or just...what I want to do to relieve myself of the discomfort, because in a sense I am already me.

Let me know if you want to exchange any thoughts and feelings in private, though. The one major difference I see between us is I have this desire opposite yours to pass as male / transition socially, but still be like "Bro, I'm a woman." I think I might never pass as a bro, actually, but it would still be nice to have a deeper voice and actually fit into the clothes I like to wear.

[Lorraine]

As a woman, l tend to look at what you seem to be alluding to,  ss a usurpation of male privilege.?

[Cmattison]

On 11/5/2018 at 11:39 AM, GothicLucas said:

@Cmattison I see the conversation has been going on for awhile, just wanted to say that literally every word in your original post describes me ? Are you me from another dimension? lol...

It sounds like you're doing a lot to explore your feelings, so I suggest that you keep doing that. I've been on this journey for a little over 3 years and although I originally wanted to jump right into an FTM transition, I was forced to wait and that sort of ended up being a good deal for me. I had a chance to explore some more feelings, and I think at this point I'm getting a really good grasp on who I really am and what I want to do to get closer to that person. Or just...what I want to do to relieve myself of the discomfort, because in a sense I am already me.

Let me know if you want to exchange any thoughts and feelings in private, though. The one major difference I see between us is I have this desire opposite yours to pass as male / transition socially, but still be like "Bro, I'm a woman." I think I might never pass as a bro, actually, but it would still be nice to have a deeper voice and actually fit into the clothes I like to wear.

Hey!! Thanks so much i am so happy to hear someone else feels the same.

 

Id definitely like to chat. I like exploring who i am and i have nobody in real life i can talk to. I mean...my husband will losten, and he is totally cool with whatever i do. He just doesnt understand how it works and i truthfully have no clue how to even explain it to him.

[DisenchantedHalo]

Would love to jump in here. I have been on this journey for a few months. The longer it goes on the more I begin to understand myself. Some days are good and I'm just ME, other days are a total emotional trainwreck over a body I feel betrays me (I'm afab) but have never said I was born in the wrong body, although I hate my female characteristics, so never really thought I could be trans. Non-binary in any form doesn't really sit well with me in terms of identity, but I still like the option to express in skirts or dresses and with long hair. Being someone into pop punk/emo music helps because so many of the men in that space wear nail varnish and eyeliner that when I wear them out it doesn't feel quite so feminine but still it hurts when people automatically assume that a petite person with delicate features MUST be a woman.

 

To know there are others on the journey too helps. Although I have a close friend and a husband who accept and want to help, they're both firmly cis and can empathise, but don't understand, even when I try to explain. I think part of the problem is that the more I explore the real me my understanding of that is changing faster than I can explain to them - they always feel like they're playing catch up and walking on eggshells around me.

 

I would love to be able to talk to and provide some mutual support to anyone else in this spac.