Cis girl with dysphoria?? (Mention of bodily functions)

[Emma?]

Hi,

So I am in a sort of confusing situation gender wise. When I was little, I was a very stereotypically “girly” girl, but as I got older, some influence from family and friends caused me to become fairly masculine. This continued becoming more potent as I got older (I am 16 now btw) and I spent last semester questioning my gender, both feeling that this masculinity suited me, and experiencing discomfort with my female body. However, over winter break I came to the conclusion that I am cis after all, and that all these years I had just been forcing myself to be less feminine.

My sureness in my cis-ness ended again yesterday. My period (which is extremely irregular) came for the first time since September, and what I assume is dysphoria hurled itself at me again- I am not supposed to have a uterus, or a vagina, or breasts, and having these things makes me very upset.

The confusion arises with the fact that I feel most comfortable identifying as a girl. While they/them pronouns do feel good to me, she/her is fine too. And I like makeup, long hair, dresses, and stereotypically girly things like singing and dancing. Additionally, a dream of mine is to be able to sing really well with a female voice.

Since I am feminine now, and also was when I was a small child, it only makes sense to me that I would be a girl. But I really can’t ignore the problems I am having with my body.

Does anyone know what might be going on? Can cis people have dysphoria?

Thanks!

[A. Dillon]

No, it is impossible for a cis person to have dysphoria - having dysphoria is what makes you trans. I was pretty feminine for a lot of my life, until puberty hit, and I suddenly felt a need to free myself from that. You can be very confused, that's not a problem. Just try and explore it, don't suppress anything. I also had a dream of singing with a female voice, I saw myself as an old woman in the future, I had no problem being called she/her pronouns. I thought of myself as a girl, the problem really was what that meant.

 

I specifically remember the first time that I was really confronted with what I facing. My mom got me a puberty book, and the idea that I was going to become a woman and simply become even more curvy, while I had been wishing for more muscles, was like a slap in the face. I had nightmares about being pregnant, I just wished it could all go away. My dysphoria was only really obvious in hindsight, but it was there. Explore this, a first step could be just trying to dress up and pass as male for a day. It can give you a lot of information, about others and about yourself. This is not a long term thing, see how you feel when you go back. Consider a gender therapist in your area, and just listen to what your body is telling you.

[VickySGV]

Gender does not always make sense to us.  Those for whom gender makes sense are the people we consider to be Cis gender.  What sticks out to me in what you are saying is the problems with periods being that irregular.  There are several Intersex conditions that can affect people's sense of gender that need to be diagnosed by an M.D. and then worked on with a gender therapist.  I can only speak as a parent of now adult girls, but by your age their periods were stable and regular in frequency.  If you have not contacted a doctor and had the possibility of intersex conditions such a ADHS or PCOS and others evaluated I would recommend that you do check with your doctor.  Those conditions are not readily visible on the outside of a person's body but can be diagnosed through laboratory and ultrasound tests. They can affect how the person feels about their gender.  I have been in IRL support groups for Trans people where people with those conditions have talked about gender chaos as they called it.  

[A. Dillon]

I don't know, I have had that problem since I started. It has been 5 years now, and yet there are still months of nothing, maybe 3 days long and light, and others are 1.5-2 weeks apart, 1.5 weeks long, and super heavy. I think it might be unrelated to anything, I haven't ever talked about it with a doctor. However, it is such a terrible time for me that I am never really focused on the health part.

[Emma?]

Thank you both so much for your replies! 

A. Dillon:  I will definitely explore male presentation and try to listen better to myself. In the past I have been careful to make sure I didn't dress too suspiciously- I think my parents will get worried pretty easily!

VickySVG:  I have been tested for PCOS, but I don't have it. Thank you for your concern though!

[VickySGV]

 @A. Dillon   I was referring to  @Emma?   up there about the long time between periods.  You however need to take care of your health as a priority.  The terrible time you are having can be affecting how your body is working.  I raised two cis females during their puberty+ as a single dad at the time and stress times threw them off like a brick.

[ShawnaLeigh]

Disclaimer. I am not a therapist nor think I am even close.  BUT I do not see why a cis gendered person can not have a dysphoria.  That being said, and I wrote this in another post just this morning, that if are even questioning your gender then you are trans as there is "something" about your gender that is confusing you.  Its a bare bones explanation sorry.

 

However I agree with Vicky that this could more then what's on the surface.  The your cycles should be stable or at least close by now.  

Please take her advice.

 

[Emma?]

@ShawnaLeigh thank you for your insight as well!

[ShawnaLeigh]

39 minutes ago, Emma? said:

@ShawnaLeigh thank you for your insight as well!

Welcome to the forum BTW!

Sorry late to the party again...

[A. Dillon]

1 hour ago, VickySGV said:

 @A. Dillon   I was referring to  @Emma?   up there about the long time between periods.  You however need to take care of your health as a priority.  The terrible time you are having can be affecting how your body is working.  I raised two cis females during their puberty+ as a single dad at the time and stress times threw them off like a brick.

 

Yes, I knew. I just wanted to suggest that it might not be too strange. Thank you for the concern, I am pretty sure it is simply related to stress from depression and anxiety. 

[Emma?]

1 hour ago, ShawnaLeigh said:

Welcome to the forum BTW!

Sorry late to the party again...

?

[Susan R]

Hi Emma, glad your here taking advantage of the wonderful forums here. I’ve been helped so much and I’m sure you will be too. It does sound like there’s some kind of gender related issue happening but I’m surprised it’s NOT hormone related.   High stress, anorexia, obesity and other weight issues can also cause similar irregularities. Has anyone diagnosed the exact reason for your irregularities?  There may be a clinical link between your “off and on” gender dysphoria and these mensuration irregularities.  If it was me, I would keep a journal or use an app like ‘Clue’ to keep close track of these two traits to see if there is any correlation between the two.  I’m no doctor but I always wanted to play one on TV.

 

Dr. Susan R?

[Emma?]

@Susan R Thank you so much for your advice!
I have always been irregular, but when I was 14 I did have anorexia which caused me to not have a period for an entire year. I am now at a healthy weight, and my doctor is not worried about the irregularity especially since my mom and older sister were both irregular for a long time.
I did download clue and will be monitoring whether they seem related. It seems like a great app!

[Zeda]

Contrary to what some have said, I definitely think you can be cis and have dysphoria; there are many reasons why one might have it other than being transgender, including the fact that gender expression is just plain wonky from culture to culture (and even subcultures and communities).

 

That being said, it is a lot more common for trans people people

I'll give you three anecdotes:

• My cousin came out as a (trans) boy to supportive parents a few years ago with a similar story to yours, but has since come to the conclusion that she (her pfp) is actually a butch lesbian-- she doesn't want to be a boy, but enjoys the "masculinity" (I put that in quotes because a butch friend once informed me that it was a different kind of masculinity?)
• My spouse had a lot of gender dysphoria as a kid and into adulthood, but enjoyed some "traditionally feminine" things like makeup. They have since come to the conclusion that they are non-binary and genderfluid. (For them, gender is like an expressive art form. They don't wear makeup to hide, they wear makeup as a way of expression.)
• For me, I do go through phases of gender dysphoria, sometimes it is okay, sometimes it is bad. Sometimes I just really want to be feminine, sometimes it is fun to be masc. Most of the time, I just don't care about gender; it's overrated (until it's not). I kept a diary, tracked my patterns over the course of a year, and decided that I definitely need to go on hormones even if I occasionally don't mind my body. I came to the conclusion that I am genderqueer.

 

All three of us had dysphoria. In my cousin's case, she is cis, in mine and my spouse's case, we are trans, and I'm the only one doing medical transition.

[A. Dillon]

@ZedaI don't mean to be rude, I just have a really hard time understanding that. Like, I can be a drag queen and the most feline person on the planet, but my male dysphoria would still tell me that I am male, should have male genitalia, etc. You can also be an incredibly masculine trans women, who passes as male better than me, but still know that she should have a female chest. Dysphoria, as far as I am aware, is what makes you trans. A drag queen isn't trans, even as they use female pronouns and names, because they don't have dysphoria. It is not that cis people "can't" have dysphoria, but it is the symptom of being trans. Think about it like ADHD - it's not impossible for your average seeming person to have it, but if they don't suffer from hyperactivity, then you don't have it. Of course, this is honestly just my opinion, but I have no experience to say otherwise, and all trans people I have met expressed dysphoria. Vid people can suffer from body dysmorphia, or course, things like anorexia are the most common but there are others. When it comes down to it, pronouns are simply used to assign your gender to the rest of the world. They can be a huge part of social dysphoria, but your are not born to prefer one set over another. However, androgens in the womb form your mind's gender at a separate time from your body, and occasionally has a little whoops moment. For instance, me. Contrary to what many TERFs may say, society didn't tell me I should be male, my brain just knew. I would love to hear about your experience, the only people that I have ever met who described themselves as nonbinary only described male dysphoria and came out as such. How do you define the line between gender expression and identity? I am genuinely interested...

[Zeda]

36 minutes ago, A. Dillon said:

@Zeda It is not that cis people "can't" have dysphoria, but it is the symptom of being trans.

Hmm, I looked into it and from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transgender:
 

Quote

Many transgender people experience gender dysphoria, 

---

Quote

How do you define the line between gender expression and identity? I am genuinely interested...

I would say that gender expression is just the way you present yourself (tangible), whereas your identity is mental (intangible). You could be a big, burly man who identifies as a man, but wears dresses and makeup and that would be a femme expression (at least in my culture), even though his gender identity and physical appearance might suggest otherwise. 

[Susan R]

Interesting discussion... very good points from everyone.

 

After reading through what has been written I have a question.  Based on the quote below... if GD is not necessary to be trans, do any of you feel the crossdresser (in the example below) is NOT on the trans spectrum? Does this make them a Drag Queen and not a crossdresser because of the lack of experienced GD?

45 minutes ago, Zeda said:

You could be a big, burly man who identifies as a man, but wears dresses and makeup and that would be a femme expression (at least in my culture), even though his gender identity and physical appearance might suggest otherwise.

I’m trying to see where the line stops and starts using Zeda’s explanation.

 

Susan R?

[Lexi C]

wow You guys just blow my mind. Thank God I don't do drugs anymore...PUFFF...so confuse right now

[BrandiBri]

I think in the example above that the man is on the trans spectrum, even if he does not know it. (That was my own experience.) I don't think he would be a drag queen even if he didn't experience GD. I think that even though he wears the clothing his gender expression would still be masculine since he would only wear the clothes occasionally. One description of crossdressing is finding pleasure in wearing certain clothes. Imho, drag queens are men who dress to perform or draw attention to themselves. I am not a drag queen since I want only to blend in. 

I think the line can be a bit fuzzy, but when you begin to realize that there is more to it than  just cding that is when the gender expression starts to begin to match one's gender identity, weather it be MtF, FtM, or anywhere in between.

[Lexi C]

ok So who had a period  , whose wearing what and dose anyone know where I can find peanut butter Whisky! This is better then a Netflix serious

[Emma?]

Gender does not directly correspond with clothes- gendered fashion is something society came up with. I think none of us can decide whether or not the person would be on the trans spectrum. It depends on whether they are simply dressing in those clothes because they like to, or if they're dressing in them because doing so also decreases their discomfort in being seen as male. It is entirely possible for someone to simply enjoy clothes stereotypical of another gender.

[A. Dillon]

For me, this is an issue I have personally grappled with. I am very short, and deep down, very fabulous, so I love wearing chunky heels. However, I could never leave the house like that because I wouldn't pass. It is not that someone is telling me this - it is my own dysphoria, I would rather miss out on some fashion opportunities than be uncomfortable and ashamed for hours on end. It is not that I don't enjoy masculine clothes - I love my working jeans, t-shirt, hoodie, and black snowboots that I wear every day. But I can't deny those electric blue velvet 4" heeled boots with silver tinsel stripes under my bed. When it comes to expression, I see that as very fluid. I have never had any experience with a fluid gender though, so I have a hard time understanding that. I am always male, even with my heels on, because I still know that I should have a flat chest and a beard.