Androgyny In Mythology, Alchemy, And Symbolism

[Guest Flistan]

I just think this stuff is soooo cool to look up some times. I'm writing this story and I wanted to get info about symbolism and sexuality, since my main character had GID (but doesn't really notice it). I like to load my stories with ironic symbolism even if it has nothing to do with the plot- it's more like stuff that you either catch and it's a hidden treasure/meaning or you don't. It's sort of like the irony of my life... ><

So, I was going to have her wear a charm, and me loving the planetary symbols, I found it really awesome that Mercury is related in history and alchemy to androgyny.

Check this out. ^.^

I first looked here for transgendered symbols...

http://societies.dsu.ca/DalOUT/resources/symbolsdoc

And me being a dork like that, I recognized that the farthest one on the left in the transgendered line of symbols was Mercury.

Lol I used it in a picture once too

And then I found these...

See the arrangement of the elements in the triangles?

http://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/forum...showtopic=57382

http://www.astro.com/mtp/mtp24_e.htm

There's probably more cool stuff out there- just really busy and have to leave. Really cool, isn't it? ^.^

[Sally]

It is very interesting and I am intrigued by the idea of your story but I have a twisted sense of humor and I must tell you what I see.

Obviously, the Sun is a bull's eye, Earth is in the cross hairs, Women are from Venus, Men are from Mars And convenience store clerks are from Jupiter!

And Vesta seems to have been one of the founding members of Van Halen!

Love ya,

Sally

[Guest Donna Jean]

Pay no attention to Sally....she's off her meds again!

I just love the symbolism...I think they're really cool and interesting...

Show some more if you get a chance....OK?

HUGGS!

Donna Jean

[Guest Flistan]

lol glad you guys like it. ^.^ There's this other myth I vaguely remember I should post some time again... Hmmm...

I'm a mythology freak. ><

Weeellllll venus for women and men for mars... they sort of fit, haha. There's a lot of cool stuff about the moon I forgot about... >< Reading the links though was pretty cool.

[Guest Flistan]

OOOOOOOOOOOOHHHHHHHHHHHHHH I get the store clerks one... >< I always saw it as something else when I was growing up. My dad had a poster of all of the symbols.

[Guest Ryles_D]

On another forum, there's a thread about androgyny in mythology. http://www.whatisgender.net/phpBB3/viewtop...f=121&t=187 They've got a lot on there.

[Guest Flistan]

HOLY CRAP HOW COULD I FORGET AKHENATEN?!! He was like... the coolest dude... EVER. AAAAND actually he's in another one of my stories- on Ancient Egyptian murder mysteries- King Tut dies and takes a trip to the afterlife to find see his uncle Akhenaten and discover how he and his uncle died.

Aaaand I forgot about cupid/eros. >< So many of these I didn't even realize too, like Loki.

Thanks for the link! ^.^

[Guest Wry]

AAAAND actually he's in another one of my stories- on Ancient Egyptian murder mysteries- King Tut dies and takes a trip to the afterlife to find see his uncle Akhenaten and discover how he and his uncle died.

That has got to be...

...

...the coolest thing I've heard in a good long while.

There's not enough Ancient Egyptian murder mysteries out there... Or any really.

[Carolyn Marie]

Although not a murder mystery, another Egyptian mystery, and one with a trans-twist, is the story of Hatshepsut, the 18th Dynasty ruler,

for whom there is a fair amount of evidence that she portrayed herself in public as male during at least part of her reign. After her mysterious

death, all traces of her were erased from Egypt, including her name and image on almost every public place.

History can be a lot more fun, and a lot more fascinating, than most people think.

Carolyn Marie

[Guest Elizabeth K]

Idid toons of that - trying to get a handle on what I am - and ALL mythology and 'god/creation/mythos' seems to be loaded with androgyny. And my favotitr? Tiresius and how he was changed into a woman because he saw/interupted/killed two snakes copulating!

And for a modern myth-like story? Virginia Wolff's ORLANDO. That was my Internet name before I realized I was really a full woman.

And the symbols! GRAND. It shows where our tri-symbol came from.

Lizzy

[Guest Flistan]

Wry- and since Akhenaten was the only pharaoh to change the art of the 3,000-year dynasty of Egypt for a short-lived 13 years to a modern, trippy-style, his afterlife is distorted and trippy because the depictions reflect his afterlife, and it's really hilarious. Tut doesn't get much, since they didn't expect his death and most of his stuff belonged to someone else... 3:

The first character I mentioned in this forum is a shapeshifting transgender half-Indonesian girl in this future communist society in Shanghai with other gifted people.

It's really weird- I didn't actually intend it but if you think about it- cross dressing is a lot like shape shifting... which is why I named myself "Shift" which is her name. ^.^ Loki and other myths of androgyny involved shape shifting too.

All of these myths and art-history class references are amazing. *sigh* I love art history and mythology... I wish I was in a mythology class. ><

I just LOVE this stuff! *squee!*

[Guest Chrysee]

Wry- and since Akhenaten was the only pharaoh to change the art of the 3,000-year dynasty of Egypt for a short-lived 13 years to a modern, trippy-style, his afterlife is distorted and trippy because the depictions reflect his afterlife, and it's really hilarious. Tut doesn't get much, since they didn't expect his death and most of his stuff belonged to someone else... 3:

The first character I mentioned in this forum is a shapeshifting transgender half-Indonesian girl in this future communist society in Shanghai with other gifted people.

It's really weird- I didn't actually intend it but if you think about it- cross dressing is a lot like shape shifting... which is why I named myself "Shift" which is her name. ^.^ Loki and other myths of androgyny involved shape shifting too.

All of these myths and art-history class references are amazing. *sigh* I love art history and mythology... I wish I was in a mythology class. ><

I just LOVE this stuff! *squee!*

I would suggest that you explore the symbolism found in Hermetic Magick as well as in the Kaballah.

I, too, am involved in a writing project that began back in '99. It is an epic poem consisting present;y of over 300 pages of text plus illustrations. It begins with The Creation and the working title so far has been 'The Bible of Hell', which is a title that William Blake--my favorite poet--came up with but never used.

By the way, Akhenaten was an Anannage (Anunnaki.) Note the shape of his skull.

[Guest Chrysee]

I would suggest that you explore the symbolism found in Hermetic Magick as well as in the Kaballah.

I, too, am involved in a writing project that began back in '99. It is an epic poem consisting present;y of over 300 pages of text plus illustrations. It begins with The Creation and the working title so far has been 'The Bible of Hell', which is a title that William Blake--my favorite poet--came up with but never used.

By the way, Akhenaten was an Anannage (Anunnaki.) Note the shape of his skull.

Now I read much about Hermaphrodite-vs.-Androgyne and yet they appear as synonymous in many dictionaries. I bring this up because the Creator God of The Old Testament was named Jehovah (from the Hebrew: 'Yah' {male} & 'Havah' {female.}

Further evidence that our Creator was Androgynous!

And in true Jungian fashion, It projected It's Inner Woman (Anima) into the Abyss and mated with It, thus planting the seed for our Universe. This gives a much more in depth view to the story of Adam's rib. Though it is doubtful that Eve was crafted from one scrawny bone, again we hear the story of an Inner Woman being projected outward. As well, both Jehovah and Adam had Inner Women.

Truly hope that I did that justice.

Thanks for reading.

[Guest Micha]

Now I read much about Hermaphrodite-vs.-Androgyne and yet they appear as synonymous in many dictionaries. I bring this up because the Creator God of The Old Testament was named Jehovah (from the Hebrew: 'Yah' {male} & 'Havah' {female.}

Further evidence that our Creator was Androgynous!

And in true Jungian fashion, It projected It's Inner Woman (Anima) into the Abyss and mated with It, thus planting the seed for our Universe. This gives a much more in depth view to the story of Adam's rib. Though it is doubtful that Eve was crafted from one scrawny bone, again we hear the story of an Inner Woman being projected outward. As well, both Jehovah and Adam had Inner Women.

Truly hope that I did that justice.

Thanks for reading.

Holy Crap do you have a way of making me feel overwhelmed in all the things I want to learn about. Glad you posted this because I've always felt that God was either androgynous, agendered or perhaps consisting of the entire gender "spectrum," "omnigender" perhaps?

I always had the intent to read Carl Jung, but then again, I mean to read a lot have yet to get very far through my list. I'm a poor reader and my comprehension skills are next to nil, so it's a long process.

[Guest Chrysee]

Holy Crap do you have a way of making me feel overwhelmed in all the things I want to learn about. Glad you posted this because I've always felt that God was either androgynous, agendered or perhaps consisting of the entire gender "spectrum," "omnigender" perhaps?

I always had the intent to read Carl Jung, but then again, I mean to read a lot have yet to get very far through my list. I'm a poor reader and my comprehension skills are next to nil, so it's a long process.

Didn't mean to overwhelm. I just wanted to give you a glimpse at the wondrous world of information out there. Instead of reading Jung, you might try Joseph Campbell. He was the master of comparative mythology/religion, and used Jung's work as a roadmap to travel through every world myth system, showing where it's the same cast of players acting out the same story over and over again, only wearing different costumes (for the most part) each time.

I would heartily suggest that you read: 'The Hero with A Thousand Faces' & 'Myths To Live By'. They are master works by Campbell that show how we live out ancient myths in our daily lives and by knowing this come to appreciate a depth to our existence that shouldn't be missed. As Campbell stated: myth is the presence of Divinity.

If you were close by, I'd loan you both books and not even worry about getting them back.

And if I begin to sound like a teacher, know that I briefly taught high school English.

Later,

Chrysalis

[Guest Micha]

Didn't mean to overwhelm. I just wanted to give you a glimpse at the wondrous world of information out there. Instead of reading Jung, you might try Joseph Campbell. He was the master of comparative mythology/religion, and used Jung's work as a roadmap to travel through every world myth system, showing where it's the same cast of players acting out the same story over and over again, only wearing different costumes (for the most part) each time.

I would heartily suggest that you read: 'The Hero with A Thousand Faces' & 'Myths To Live By'. They are master works by Campbell that show how we live out ancient myths in our daily lives and by knowing this come to appreciate a depth to our existence that shouldn't be missed. As Campbell stated: myth is the presence of Divinity.

If you were close by, I'd loan you both books and not even worry about getting them back.

And if I begin to sound like a teacher, know that I briefly taught high school English.

Later,

Chrysalis

I'm not complaining at all. Totally appreciate the recomendations and glimpses.

[Guest Chrysee]

I'm not complaining at all. Totally appreciate the recomendations and glimpses.

You say that you're a poor reader. Have you thought about 'talking books?' They can be spendy, but I bet there's a library close by that has/can get them.

Just out of curiosity, where's 'South Metro?' Sounds like someplace in Boston (but you're in Colorado, of course.)

Have a good one!

[Guest Micha]

Yeah, books on disc are great for me, but I still need the time to sit a pay proper attention. We got the Douglas county libraries, and they've got good selection. However I currently owe them money, enough that I can't check anything out 'till most of it's paid. South metro refers to the Denver area.

[Guest Chrysee]

Yeah, books on disc are great for me, but I still need the time to sit a pay proper attention. We got the Douglas county libraries, and they've got good selection. However I currently owe them money, enough that I can't check anything out 'till most of it's paid. South metro refers to the Denver area.

Yeah me and library fines. . .now there's a truly sad story.

I meant to mention that Joseph Campbell's 'Hero With a Thousand Faces' was used by George Lucas as a story outline when he was writing the original Star Wars.

Thanks for the South Metro clarification. I have a friend from Denver and when I wrote and asked him yesterday if he knew what South Metro might mean, he didn't know.

Go figure.

By the way, I've been through Denver a couple of times. I was just a kid, however, and spent most of our cross country car trips in the backseat with my nose shoved in a book or a comic book.

Have a good one, my friend.

[Guest Chrysee]

Have been a Tarot reader since age 18, for the most part working with traditional decks. Recently, I obtained a deck of the Voyager Tarot. I think of the them of as as Collective Unconscious cards. To get to know them (and them, me) I am following the suggested 'One Card A Day' plan. So far, just about every card has been right on. I figure that if you stare into this deck, the deck stares back.

The other day, I drew The Lovers. The Voyager card is a bit more insightful (and appropriate to my lifestyle today, than the traditional card. It speaks of unifying your opposite parts as a means of achieving Oneness.

Now in the course of writing my poetry, I have been crafting my own personal mythology, based largely on several religious and occult systems. And this 'unifying of opposites' starts it out and continues throughout.

In the beginning, like thought impulses, the Absence (that is The Universe before it is imbued with Spirit) is Disturbed by the First Stirrings, i.e. two currents of energy, one masculine and the other feminine. They commingle and engender an hermaphroditic field of force that is our Creator. Believing Itself to be alone, the Creator sees Itself reflected in The Abyss and moved by such love projects It's feminine side into it. From their coupling arises Creation.

This is the Archetypal courtship. Think of the scene in Genesis, where 'God' sees that 'the man' is alone and from within him draws out a mate. It was psychologist/occultist Carl Jung who came up with the concept of The Anima, the image of the perfect woman that lies in the soul of every man. (Sorry about the heterosexual overtones!) Now men are famous for projecting this perfect woman onto the partner they pursue, which can cause some ugly results. After all, what woman can live up to such an image. Much of the Anima comes from feelings left behind within the man by his mother. And few wives can ever do anything the way mom used to do it! And just as Eve was the Queen in Paradise, many men feel that once united with their partner, by virtue of her perfection, so shall their world be perfect. When the relationship goes bad, it is because the woman has failed to perform well in the role in which her husband cast her in his movie. Usually, it is a role that she can't recall auditioning for in the first place.

At any rate, be the relationship opposite or same sex, each member is seeking to merge his/her opposite polarities in the physical world.

The Lover card urges the reader to maintain individuality all the while seeing themselves reflected in others.

As I heard a Rabbi recently state:

"Every union is a reunion."

Hope that I conveyed this clearly and perhaps inspired some thought.

Thanks for reading!

Chrysalis

Soror In Vitro Veritas

[Guest mad_scientist]

I've always thought Earth represents androgyny well -- it's between Mars and Venus. But since we all live on Earth it's probably not thought to be appropriate to denote to one identity.

[Guest Chrysee]

I've always thought Earth represents androgyny well -- it's between Mars and Venus. But since we all live on Earth it's probably not thought to be appropriate to denote to one identity.

Think 'Mother'. Not to be corny, but Mother Earth.

In my previous post, I broke down the Creation. It began with two currents of energy, one masculine and one feminine. Theses are The Grand parents. The Creator they begat then projects his inner woman into the Void. This becomes what I deem The Feminine Firmament. And she gives birth to manifestation. At each stage, there is a maternal presence. Here, that presence is the globe.

I would suggest that you read anything concerning the Kabbalistic Tree of Life to see the roles portrayed by gender in the grand scheme of things. Infact, anything that you could lay your hands on by Dion Fortune would be most beneficial, I feel.

Servitor Mundi Morientis

[Guest Kendall]

On another forum, there's a thread about androgyny in mythology. http://www.whatisgender.net/phpBB3/viewtop...f=121&t=187 They've got a lot on there.

thanks for posting that Ryles. i just joined laura's. this is a topic of course dear to my heart

[Guest Ulysses]

HOLY CRAP HOW COULD I FORGET AKHENATEN?!! He was like... the coolest dude... EVER. AAAAND actually he's in another one of my stories- on Ancient Egyptian murder mysteries- King Tut dies and takes a trip to the afterlife to find see his uncle Akhenaten and discover how he and his uncle died.

Aaaand I forgot about cupid/eros. >< So many of these I didn't even realize too, like Loki.

Thanks for the link! ^.^

Hahaha! This post made me laugh!

This is such cool topic, too: I never really thought much into androgyny's relation with mythology, alchemy, and symbolism. But now that I'm reading all this, I can't help but make connections! Especially Loki. Norse mythology is my favorite: I should have seen it sooner!

And I'm curious after reading "in another one of my stories": one of your stories as in a written story? That you wrote? If this is a stupid question, I apologize. I'm new to these forums (just joined today) and still figuring it all out.

Have a great day/night, everyone: until next time. -Ulysses

[Guest Luna Selene]

1. Sally: HAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAHHA I needed that!

2. Thor once had his hammer stolen by some Giants, so he dressed as a woman, made the Giant fall in love with him, marry him, and on the wedding night when his hammer was presented, he grabbed it and killed everyone. It's Rambo meets Pretty Woman.

3. I found this interesting article, I haven't done any background checking on it, of Hermaphroditic Hyenas. It's much more bad--- than a tubeworm...(I found more articles about those...)

4. Two notable Greek Hermaphrodites, (Almost too obviously) Hermaphroditus, and the lesser known, Tiresias.

I only say Hermaphrodites, because traditionally I found that was the only type of Androgyn in mythology. SUPER COOL IDEA! I look forward to hearing how it came out. (I know I missed the ball on the posts. )

_Luna