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How do you explain it without people getting upset?


Guest Maria_B

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Guest Maria_B

Personally, I loathe to here ''It's just what god has in store for you'' or things along that vein when I'm going through a hard time. I don't believe in God or that he has any reins in my life, and it really irks me and makes me even more upset when people do stuff like this.

Yet, they're saying it out of the good of their heart. They are saying something from love.

How do you explain that their kind of consoling is actually making your mood or condition worse without just giving a huge spitball in their face? It's not particularly fair to either party. :(.

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Guest -guest-

I don't think you can.

Faith is such a personal thing that you can't help but hurt them by a response that questions what they believe - especially when, as you say, they're only trying to help.

My own approach is to afford people the same level of respect that you demand from them. You have a perfect right not to be a religious person, and they have a right to walk whatever path suits them. None of us has the perfect answer in that regard, but we can at least be civil to one another until it becomes available.

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Guest Maria_B

Not really trying to convert them or step on their beliefs as much as saying ''It hurts me when you say that''.

In a sense, it's applying your beliefs on someone else, even if in a loving and caring way.

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Some times there is not a easy way of saying it. as the person of that religion is so blinded by "their" beliefs that they can't understand how anything they just said could be taken in the wrong way.

The way i deal with it is simply say "I understand you're trying to make me feel better, But saying it that way really does not help me." And other times i just tell them where i stand on the whole "god" thing.

If a person knows me and says this to me i will get a little upset, As i know that person is just doing it to try and hurt or shame me.

I mostly never try and reason with a person of faith as that's imposable, To them their "logic" is untouchable and perfect. When really it just defies the very meaning of logic.

I am not trying to be hateful to them but it's like on (How i met your mother) You can only take so many rainbows before losing it and snap, And after you do lose it you feel bad because that person is like a kid Not understanding why you yelled at them. :hairpull:

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Guest sophia.gentry58

If you're not wanting to be frank with them in letting them know that you hold no such belief, then why not just let them know that you are not in the mood to hear such conversation.

Sophia

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Guest Maria_B

Megan, I do believe thats just the way to go about it. Generally it only hurts when people who know I don't share their belief do it, as it sends the message ''I disregard your belief'', even though thats 99% of the time not the intended message.

Sigh.

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Guest Kelly-087

I shy away from people with those sayings.

I don't know what the culture is like Australia but over here the people who really say those things tend to be more religious.. People don't spend much time talking about christianity even if a lot of them are christian.

My dad is unfortunately one of them. I just roll my eyes. I can't stand the mindset that I've no control over whats going on. Not that I believe I have control. I really don't. But if god is directing everything, whats the point of morality because any violation of morality would be god making you violate that morality in the first place ?_?

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Guest Bellexia

I just shrug it off. Mom does it all the time. After all that has happened in our lives, I am not going to tell her it's not helping me feel better. She needs that little bit of faith if it helps her get through the day. As her pagan daughter which she respects, I am going to respect her belief. She's come far enough that she respects me for being trans and calls me she, amber etc. Even her mom who calls me he and my bio name I just shrug it off because there really isn't a point in arguing it. She waits for someone to argue with her on it as I expect many do and you are just feeding their martyr system if you do. Just my 2 copper.

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  • Admin

Even though at least part of my spiritual belief system does involve a deistic element, those phrases are between mildly annoying and deeply hateful even to me. It is a sign that the speaker wants to turn the conversation away from your feelings and your humanity, or is taking some small satisfaction in your suffering. I will not use such ideas even to a deistic believer, because I take the time to see and listen to the other person and can accept their suffering and can accept suffering in general as a part of being human just because we live in a world that ultimately will kill us at some point, not because of fault or misdeed, just because of TIME.

The people who say those things may or may not actually have a deep personal belief pattern that has been thought out, their beliefs are almost like an old overcoat that has been passed down from a grandparent, to parent to child holes and all. Marias signature line :I KNOW OTHERS HAVE IT WORSE OFF, I'M HURT, DON'T DISMISS MY FEELINGS is beyond their scope of understanding. That is not said in disgust or hatred, but in statement of fact. I experience the same thing within my sphere of faith from such people. They use those phrases to dismiss the feelings of the person they are talking to because they do not want to open themselves to another's hurt.

The best thing to do is to see yourself on another silent path that is less traveled but more intense and tuned to feelings, and they at best are on a path yards or miles from yours that contains few if any feelings, and they are shouting to the wind.

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Guest Sarah Faith

Even though at least part of my spiritual belief system does involve a deistic element, those phrases are between mildly annoying and deeply hateful even to me. It is a sign that the speaker wants to turn the conversation away from your feelings and your humanity, or is taking some small satisfaction in your suffering. I will not use such ideas even to a deistic believer, because I take the time to see and listen to the other person and can accept their suffering and can accept suffering in general as a part of being human just because we live in a world that ultimately will kill us at some point, not because of fault or misdeed, just because of TIME.

The people who say those things may or may not actually have a deep personal belief pattern that has been thought out, their beliefs are almost like an old overcoat that has been passed down from a grandparent, to parent to child holes and all. Marias signature line :I KNOW OTHERS HAVE IT WORSE OFF, I'M HURT, DON'T DISMISS MY FEELINGS is beyond their scope of understanding. That is not said in disgust or hatred, but in statement of fact. I experience the same thing within my sphere of faith from such people. They use those phrases to dismiss the feelings of the person they are talking to because they do not want to open themselves to another's hurt.

The best thing to do is to see yourself on another silent path that is less traveled but more intense and tuned to feelings, and they at best are on a path yards or miles from yours that contains few if any feelings, and they are shouting to the wind.

Something that I have learned, is that if someone is always hurting and wearing that hurt on their sleeve others tend to run out of things to say to cheer them up. I have a friend who is basically always unhappy he was unhappy with high school said it would be better with college, he was unhappy with college said it would be better when he got a job, he got a job, now he says it'll be better when he finds a different job. He's always lonely and yet he refuses to even try to meet new people. This has been ongoing for years and I have spent a lot of time over the years trying to help him through his feels, opening my self up to the hurt. There comes a point where the other person is so in love with their hurt that they will not take steps to move beyond it, there comes a point where you run out of things to say because you've said everything and all that's left are hollow platitudes.

Sometimes those things aren't said to dismiss the others feelings, but only because there isn't anything else left to say. I will always be there to listen when he needs to vent hes one of my best friends, but I just have reached a point where I don't know what to tell him anymore. Don't just assume that things like that are said out of a selfish desire to avoid facing another persons pain, sometimes those things are said because they don't know what else to say and want to try to show they do care.

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Guest Bellexia

Even though at least part of my spiritual belief system does involve a deistic element, those phrases are between mildly annoying and deeply hateful even to me. It is a sign that the speaker wants to turn the conversation away from your feelings and your humanity, or is taking some small satisfaction in your suffering. I will not use such ideas even to a deistic believer, because I take the time to see and listen to the other person and can accept their suffering and can accept suffering in general as a part of being human just because we live in a world that ultimately will kill us at some point, not because of fault or misdeed, just because of TIME.

The people who say those things may or may not actually have a deep personal belief pattern that has been thought out, their beliefs are almost like an old overcoat that has been passed down from a grandparent, to parent to child holes and all. Marias signature line :I KNOW OTHERS HAVE IT WORSE OFF, I'M HURT, DON'T DISMISS MY FEELINGS is beyond their scope of understanding. That is not said in disgust or hatred, but in statement of fact. I experience the same thing within my sphere of faith from such people. They use those phrases to dismiss the feelings of the person they are talking to because they do not want to open themselves to another's hurt.

The best thing to do is to see yourself on another silent path that is less traveled but more intense and tuned to feelings, and they at best are on a path yards or miles from yours that contains few if any feelings, and they are shouting to the wind.

Something that I have learned, is that if someone is always hurting and wearing that hurt on their sleeve others tend to run out of things to say to cheer them up. I have a friend who is basically always unhappy he was unhappy with high school said it would be better with college, he was unhappy with college said it would be better when he got a job, he got a job, now he says it'll be better when he finds a different job. He's always lonely and yet he refuses to even try to meet new people. This has been ongoing for years and I have spent a lot of time over the years trying to help him through his feels, opening my self up to the hurt. There comes a point where the other person is so in love with their hurt that they will not take steps to move beyond it, there comes a point where you run out of things to say because you've said everything and all that's left are hollow platitudes.

Sometimes those things aren't said to dismiss the others feelings, but only because there isn't anything else left to say. I will always be there to listen when he needs to vent hes one of my best friends, but I just have reached a point where I don't know what to tell him anymore. Don't just assume that things like that are said out of a selfish desire to avoid facing another persons pain, sometimes those things are said because they don't know what else to say and want to try to show they do care.

Heck I wasn't even coming here for advice but I can take a lot of this as good advice for me :3 Well said hun. There is so much truth in this post. I need to take this and reflect on it a bit. Stuff happens, I gotta keep on and shrug it off. No more amber in love with her pain! Now she will be in love with herself or her new mate :3 I feel I have gotten better. Also at least in all the misery I've forced upon myself I can use that as experience to help others or see that not much can be done until they realize they want to be happy. ^,..,^

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The great philosopher George Carlin said:

When someone backs their car over kid on a tricycle invariably someone else says, "It's God's will."

To which I say, "Then we have got to get this guy God because that's the fourth kid this week!"

Sometimes things intended to supply comfort just fall short and telling a drowning man about the beauty of the ocean is a poor substitute for a life preserver.

People speak without thinking, certainly without thinking about someone else's beliefs - I never take offense at someone saying that they will pray for me - I never check to see what church affiliation they might have to be sure that the prayers' destination meets with my approval - I accept it as being offered in support but just telling someone "That's just the way it is," while anchoring it with the entire weight of their belief system requires that you accept that system along with whatever platitudes might be coming next.

If you must say something that you think is important then tell them that they will be in your thoughts - a form of secular caring.

I find that it is much harder to insult me these days but never fear - so far no one has given up trying.

Love ya,

Sally

Maria, I could say that the responses to this topic are just what God had in store for you but I will not - I never use that phrase because while I do believe in God, I do not believe that you have to nor do I believe that God has a detailed plan for everyone - some things happen just because - nothing more and nothing less, there is an element of random chance in everything in the world.

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Guest ~Brenda~

Hmmm,

I think it all depends on context. I would hope that people who know you would understand to refrain from religious references when trying to help you. Those who do not know you only can use what they know to help you.

I would just try to see the spirit of the intent that people are simply trying to help.

Hope this helps.

Brenda

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Guest JazzySmurf

Truth is, you may not find a silver-bullet-solution that works for all situations, as these issues are often times very personal. You can also say:

You can recognize their intention, but ask them to approach you a bit differently (or ask them to meet you half way). Even much after the fact, you can say "Thanks for trying to console me (yesterday, the other day, etc). Just so you know, I personally don't find it very comforting to hear about God in these situations. If you don't mind, would you be willing to just give me a nice hug next time?" I would personally try this one if there seemed a good chance of success :-)

Sometimes, you may need a bit of a buffer... a simple "Thank you" and a smile always work :-)

Or many other possible ways :-)

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Guest Jaques

when my father died at 61, my mother was going on about God being good and all that stuff - i felt really angry inside and questioned her faith when my dad had suffered so much, and so had she - they were together since childhood - that wasnt kind of me - i didnt mean to hurt her but it must have. It was her faith, her belief and i was so wrapped up in my own anger and pain, i didnt think i was adding to hers..........so when people say things you dont like or believe, out of kindness and faith to try to help and console you, i feel thats what it is, compassion - i wished id had more when i was younger when i put my mum through that episode...........

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Guest -guest-

so when people say things you dont like or believe, out of kindness and faith to try to help and console you, i feel thats what it is, compassion

I agree, Jaques.

And sometimes it's a belief that they need to hold onto in order to cope with a painful loss or other tragedies that beset them. I try to take that into account and give people the benefit of the doubt.

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  • 2 months later...

Many times, "I'll pray for you" is a knee jerk reaction, Some thing you say automaticly. I have Athiest friends, and friends of other non-chritsian faiths, that use phrases like that. It is what the grew up hearing, so it became an automatic response, kinda like Pavloves dog.

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  • 2 months later...

so when people say things you dont like or believe, out of kindness and faith to try to help and console you, i feel thats what it is, compassion

I agree, Jaques.

And sometimes it's a belief that they need to hold onto in order to cope with a painful loss or other tragedies that beset them. I try to take that into account and give people the benefit of the doubt.

I try very hard to keep this in mind. Like many of you here, it does hurt my feelings quite a bit when someone who knows I'm an atheist tries to comfort me with religion. On the other hand, I do have a good friend at work who will habitually say something to the effect of "I know you don't believe in it, but I will pray for you because I believe it will help". For some reason, I feel she respects my beliefs and is just trying to help me in a way she truly believes is possible. Probably most other people who "will pray for you" really have a similar motive, but most of the time it's hard to hear.

That being said, I usually just graciously smile and say "thank you" and try really hard to believe that they say such things with good motives.

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Guest Always Good

All you need is one question... "So God wants me to be miserable?"

Yes= An okay to be rude since they basically just told you to suffer.

No= "Oh, so he wants me to get GRS then!"

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  • 5 months later...
Guest Rose1993

Ugh, this whole deal, makes me nausious just thinking abut it. Im adopted, and luckily by good people, but when i finally got to meet my birth parents (not to mention tons of brothers and sisters! :unsure: ) (These people are breeding like rats, who give birth to humans, and turn them into rats! Btw im not talking about anyone but my birth family here) At first they seemed to be good people, but i was very very wrong about that. I told them that a was transgender, and all they would say when i took the time to explain it clearly again and again, every time, all i could get was "Duh, You know you wouldnt be here if it werent for a man and a woman right?" Honestly, i know i dont have to explain this to anyone here, but WHAT THE HELL DOES THAT HAVE TO DO WITH ANYTHING! I didnt even go into the fact that im athiest, and thank goodness! This whole ordeal ended with these immature jerks telling me in going to hell (HAHA!), and that they almost aborted me. Not to mention quite a few other nasty comments. Honestly, i think oftentimes there is no reasoning with these people, and if they wont change their views, cut them out of your life entirely! That is my honest opinion, and if you ever have to deal with this kind of person, its often the best way to go. Thats what i did, and now, not only do i not have to deal with them, they never want to talk to me again! Hence "cut them out of your life entirely". It was a great decision and although i had to stoop to their level of maturaty to urine them off enough to never want to talk to me again, it was 100% worth it. Its unfortunate when this kind of thing happens, but, as i said, sometimes it is unavoidable. Honestly though, after leading me to thinking they were good people and making me think i had realized a lifelong dream to get to know them, only to have that dream shattered into a million pieces, i honestly hope theyre right, and that hell exists, because if it does that is DEFINATELY where they are headed. (like that is any consolation for the pain they caused me, pfft)

Id also like to say that although this doesnt bother me much now, if one of my genetic siblings turns out to be transgendered, or at least not sraight, i would die inside because their oldest child is 13 and the youngest was just born lasy year, and thats a lot of crap to deal with. As horrible as it sounds, I honestly wish my birth parents would somehow be seperated from my biological siblings, because from the sounds of it, they are ruining them, only putting more bigoted individuals on the face of this planet, when they just as easily could have been good people. I know all that sounds is horrible, but i mean well when i say it because if their family didnt exist, those poor kids wouldnt have such horrible parents and i wouldnt feel nearly so bad about this, because i wouldnt feel like i had to buy a plane ticket out there just so i could punch them in their bigoted faces for making not only me feel horrible for well over a month, but potentially giving one or more of my biological siblings a life of hell. (the second being the main reason, otherwise i could just drop this whole thing with absolutely no problem) Its not like im actually going to shell out money for a plant ticket out there, only to punch them, but it is a nice thought to think about.

But these are thind of feelings people like this sow, and none of them deserve to have anything to do with children, or any of us. Why being openly homophobic, transphobic, or any --Censored Word-- excuse for treating people who are different than them like crap is even legal,(not to mention racism, but thats not the point) seeing as it has caused so many deaths, is beyond me, and, unlike when it happens to almost anyone else on this planet, it makes me smile to see someone like that suffer misfortune when they treat us (and odds are other individuals) like crap for absolutely no good reason at all, just because "the bible" says so. I dont wish misfortune on anyone, but if it happens on its own, like it inevitably will to everyone at some point, theres no reason i cant enjoy it if the person deserves it.

Now im not saying all of them are bad people, that is definately not the case, some of them actually try to help, and genuinely care, as has been said above. But, what i am saying is be careful who you let into your life if you dont know them too well, because not all of them are as nice as they seem to be. I learned that the hard way, and i want to see as few other people suffer the same fate as i possibly can. Get to know people before you let them into your heart, life will be much easier that way.

Sorry to go on a rant and get all into a huff, but I just wanted to share my feelings, and hopefully help someone else out there avoid this whole horrible situation. Dont let these people fool you into thinking they are good people because, as i have said, that isnt always the case. ( Hopefully your experiences will be different) I honestly dont hate them, but not only do they deserve it, its not like they are so mature themselves that they dont hate me.

Best of luck to you all in telling your friends, and the people you love what they need to know.

Best Wishes - Rose M

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  • 11 months later...
Guest Chris546

Hi Maria,

I get the "I'll pray for you" comment. And it is no more acceptable than being called "sir".

But, in both cases, the best response is to be gracious. If the opportunity is available to kindly enter a discourse, then do it, but most often it's not. Thank them, walk away, sigh...

Love, Megan

I have had the pleasure of receiveing the "you know your going to hell for that" and "you are living in sin" comment quite alot. Family members have told me that I would have to say the most. I have generally over the years not held back as far as stating back to them in the basic same tone with comments such as, "Oh a mythical place you believe in where you would like to see me, thanks and your going to some better mythical place? One side of my family like to say the "you are living in sin" which I grew accustomed to saying "vs. you are not?"

The "I'll pray for you only" comment may have gone against a sometimes very apparant belief, I usually chalk it up as intent. SO, I also have to ditto the Thank them, walk away, sigh...

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  • 1 year later...
DaHudie Biz
On 4/26/2013 at 8:33 AM, Megan Rose said:

Hi Maria,

I get the "I'll pray for you" comment. And it is no more acceptable than being called "sir".

But, in both cases, the best response is to be gracious. If the opportunity is available to kindly enter a discourse, then do it, but most often it's not. Thank them, walk away, sigh...

Love, Megan

You don't have to believe what you don't want to. Still, the real question is do you need them to agree? If you do, well, then, I guess you don't. Think about it.

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DaHudie Biz
On 4/26/2013 at 0:46 PM, VickySGV said:

Even though at least part of my spiritual belief system does involve a deistic element, those phrases are between mildly annoying and deeply hateful even to me. It is a sign that the speaker wants to turn the conversation away from your feelings and your humanity, or is taking some small satisfaction in your suffering. I will not use such ideas even to a deistic believer, because I take the time to see and listen to the other person and can accept their suffering and can accept suffering in general as a part of being human just because we live in a world that ultimately will kill us at some point, not because of fault or misdeed, just because of TIME.

The people who say those things may or may not actually have a deep personal belief pattern that has been thought out, their beliefs are almost like an old overcoat that has been passed down from a grandparent, to parent to child holes and all. Marias signature line :I KNOW OTHERS HAVE IT WORSE OFF, I'M HURT, DON'T DISMISS MY FEELINGS is beyond their scope of understanding. That is not said in disgust or hatred, but in statement of fact. I experience the same thing within my sphere of faith from such people. They use those phrases to dismiss the feelings of the person they are talking to because they do not want to open themselves to another's hurt.

The best thing to do is to see yourself on another silent path that is less traveled but more intense and tuned to feelings, and they at best are on a path yards or miles from yours that contains few if any feelings, and they are shouting to the wind.

You can't make people either believe you or make them agree you. You just have to move forward without them.

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Quite frankly I see 'praying' as about as useful as pondering. In fact some of my girlfriends that do believe, know I don't believe, so when something bad happens, instead of saying "praying for you", different people make up different 'things'. 

 

One kinda makes it into a funny thing, she says she'll shake her butt, or something. The idea is they feel better that they've reached out, and I feel better not seeing that stuff. Not that it really hurts me, but it gets annoying when some people take it too far. I usually state "in my thoughts' or something along those lines.....

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  • 3 months later...
On 3/14/2017 at 10:48 AM, Fiona said:

Quite frankly I see 'praying' as about as useful as pondering. In fact some of my girlfriends that do believe, know I don't believe, so when something bad happens, instead of saying "praying for you", different people make up different 'things'. 

 

One kinda makes it into a funny thing, she says she'll shake her butt, or something. The idea is they feel better that they've reached out, and I feel better not seeing that stuff. Not that it really hurts me, but it gets annoying when some people take it too far. I usually state "in my thoughts' or something along those lines.....

I typically try and say things like "sending good vibes your way".  I'm not someone who believes in prayer (though trust me when I tell you I wished that worked) but at the same time I want to tell the person I am hoping things get better and that I care that they are suffering. It's hard communicating with people that are religious if you aren't because people can be very protective of their views and sometimes find the most innocent of comments to be some sort of attack on their beliefs.

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      No one needs to help I really just need to get this out, sorry if this is in the wrong forum thing   Why keep living? I’m different, who would even want to be friends with me?, I know I can be a bother and why keep trying?   why keep living? I guess because of good experiences the many I’ve had, trips to the arcade I like, watching movies I love, playing games that has made life great (well while the games are good for me)   but I’m different 😔 and yet why care right? As more and more people get more competitive I can enjoy games more than others as in just enjoy it not enjoy the competition, I’m kind and this world needs more kind people, I even try to help even if I’m pretty bad at it or I’m down too, and I haven’t done it since start of last school year but I can make myself not feel sad anymore it’s mostly because I mostly look for any positives which now I’m trying to do again   Yet who wants to be friends with me? I i know I’m mostly boring plus can be a bother... but it can also be worth it to get to know me    why keep trying? That I don’t really know, things try to mentally kill me yet things try to keep making me keep going all the good like video games, movies, cartoons, everything else that’s good keeps trying to keep me going. I’m mainly trying for me but I’m happy there’s one more reason: for my best friend
    • Davie
      Thanks, Delcina    Good comments. You must be a writer yourself to say it like that. Actually, the voice of the poem is a mtf six-year-old, so his syntax is a bit taxed. My stories get supported (in a subconscious way) by my poems. This won't actually be in the story itself, but it's essential to find the right voice and poems do that. The whole thing is very early work-in-progress. cheers, David PS: It'll probably take a year to finish, if I'm lucky. That's a time lapse.
    • Teri Anne
      Looks like fun Bri enjoy yourself.
    • Timber Wolf
      Hi Claudia, Welcome to Transpulse. I'm glad you're here!   Lots of love and a big welcome hug, Timber Wolf🐾
    • Ellie Jean
      Same way I feel about my dad lol...Well, actually I can't cut him completely out of my life yet because of the half-million dollar life insurance policy my 70 year old mother has on him; it's set up to transfer over to me in the event mom dies before dad dies, so both me and mom are actively wishing for my father's death lol. (They got divorced years ago; he screwed her out of hundreds of thousands of dollars by letting the farm in Alaska she bought go into foreclosure so that she couldn't sell it. The bank owns my childhood home now and my siblings and father have all been kicked out of it. ....If I ever become independently wealthy I'm totally gonna by our old farm back. ...Lotta horrible memories there....but a lot of good ones too. 😥
    • Jackie C.
      Oh that does look nice. I need to pamper myself more.   Hugs!
    • Ellie Jean
    • Mary Jane
      Yep I've felt this even now, I don't know how I keep going or why but there's things that just won't let me give up not till I really 100% mean it and you aren't being selfish everyone's problem can't be measured and compared by the problem they can only be measured and compared by how the person feels    And remember that other post you did searching for friends? You don't need to worry about me leaving you because I give multiple chances, in fact I'm practically friends with someone that used to bully me thanks to it. There's better people to be friends with than me but I'm always an option at least   And sorry that I can't say more
    • Bri2020
      Hanging with some ladies at the beach this week before heading to Savannah this weekend. Some of us went out for Mani/Pedis. It's still a bit chilly so just wore jeans and long sleeve T-shirt. Having a blast with all of them!
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