Progesterone the truth for Trans Females

[Guest Cyndysub]

This topic has probably been addressed before on this site but my search on it failed to bear any fruit.

I have read online that a growing number of Transgender Females are taking this and I would like more information. My doctor told me that he doesn't prescribe it but he also said that about Finasteride as well and after I showed him some data on it he prescribed it. He is older than me and he is so busy that he doesn't do any research. Here is something that I found:

o should MTF TS take Progesterone as part of HT? The answer, like a lot of medical decisions, is that endocrinologists and patients should discuss the risks and benefits and make a decision and then to carefully monitor the results. To include progesterone in MTF TS HT runs the risks of potential serious side effects. To not include progesterone runs the risk of having unsatisfactory breast development that leads to the breast augmentation surgical risks including loss of sensitivity and pain (Pitanguy, 2007; vanElk, et al. 2009 Kaasa, T. et al. 2010; Araco, A. 2011). The 50% risk of needing to have breast augmentation is clearly too high. There is not currently enough information to make these decisions with formal quantified risk assessments because of the dearth of published scientific evidenced-based research. We can, with some certainty, rule out advice to otherwise non-underweight MTF TS patients to gain weight in order to have bigger breasts because of the well-established risks of being overweight. At the risk of repeating, given the dearth of research results and the resulting unquantified risks, we can conclude with great certainty that MTF TS HT should not be undertaken without careful monitoring by an endocrinologist experienced in this area. According to WPATH, this includes monitoring of testosterone, estrogen, progesterone and prolactin in addition to other tests.

[Guest Cyndysub]

I found this also on the site: http://www.tgforum.com/wordpress/index.php/progesterone-for-breast-development/

The indications from scientific data is that progesterone facilitates breast development. Models of breast development show estrogen and progesterone working together (Swerdloff and Ng, (2011). They both encourage release of growth hormone for breast growth and stimulate growth through breast receptors.

[Guest LizMarie]

We lack conclusive data, so far as I know, that scientifically demonstrates a link between progesterone and MtF breast development.

However, we do have tons of anecdotal data that indicates that it can help in many circumstances.

My two bits - given what I've read about biology, natal female breast development, and the role of progesterone there, it seems likely there is a correlation and probably causation. But I wonder if the knowledge is poorly enough understood that dosages, method of delivery, and drug regimen (continuously or periodic) need to be more specific to achieve more consistent results?

TL;DR - progesterone may help you. That's all we know right now.

[Guest LesleyAnne]

The following is my 2 cents worth.......

http://www.gender.org.uk/gendys/2009/47curtis.htm

It is believed from this report that Progesterone plays no real part in breast development.

I personally have no idea. I'm doing just fine without, but as we know everybody is different.

Best left to the medical experts, but unfortunately those experts can disagree.

[Charlize]

Thank you for that post LesleyAnne.

This quote from the attachment says it all: "The above are the reason the risk-benefit ratio associated with progesterone renders it unethical to prescribe. The benefits of it are extremely limited and unproven."

Hugs,

Charlize

[Guest Cyndysub]

LesleyAnne

Dr. Richard Curtis is not even a endocrinologist and does not ever cite any scientific data or reference. His BS has been floating around on the net for years.

[Guest Cyndysub]

The Most Prominent Anti-Progesterone Information Source

There is a prominent clinical article from 2009 that touches on all of the HT breast development issues and which takes a definite stance against using progesterone but is devoid of scientific references. It provides 20 reasons why progesterone should not be used in MTF TS HT. The document was prepared by Dr. Richard Curtis of the London Gender Clinic and published by GIRES (Curtis, 2009) and is still widely distributed through various websites. Curtis runs the London Gender Clinic and is a general practitioner, not an endocrinologist, although his clinic does prescribe for MTF TS HT.

This guy doesn't really have any cred with the medical community.

[Guest TGTrish]

I can only provide anecdotal info. My doctor (not an endo but experienced in trans) says progesterone is needed for proper breast growth and good hormone balance. She does keep a close check on all my levels.

Trish

[Guest Cyndysub]

Thanks Trish have her call my doc Doctor Thomas Jefferson (No Pun Intended) in Little Rock Arkansas. I have tried to get my doc to prescribe it but he said that he doesn't prescribe it. Grrr. He said the same about Finasteride too but he finally prescribed it after I showed him some documentation on it. He probably saw that Dr. Richard Curtis BS that has been floating around on the net for years. There is a dearth of hard facts and information on the Transgender issue and the Hormones. She could fax him a letter if she is hesitant to call. I wish that I had a female doctor.

[Drea]

Isn't the conclusion is to just take the mostess of everything cause what can it hurt?

[Guest So-kool]

I can say from my experience that when i was on only estrogen, my breasts formed nodules and nipples changed. I added progesterone 1 year later and noticed additional growth. The problem with my data is that I can not say for sure if the addition of progesterone helped or if prolonged estrogen would have done it alone.

I am under care of a trans specialist endocrinologist. She prescribed my progesterone and has had me on it for about 1 1/2 years.

Exam and tests happen every 4 months.

With that said, my personal opinion is that i would rather take progesterone in addition to my orher HRT pills. My dose is basically a standard low dose and I have not encountered any bad side edfects thus far.

Naturally you can not assume that taking progesterone will develop enough breast tissue to eliminate a desire for implants.

[Guest April Kristie]

CyndySub, certainly your Dr. Doesn't either believe in the drugs effectiveness , or simply doesn't feel the risk outweighs the benefit. You, of course can shop around for a female Dr. But there are no guarantees there either. My prescriber is a gyno and is female but doesn't feel the progesterone has any basis in MY regimen. I know you you won't know until you have tried it, so find yourself a willing Dr,

[VickySGV]

I have been on Estrogen for 5 years 11 months right now and never had progesterone. At 2.5 years my breasts were the same size as one sister who was not obese, and about half a cup size larger than our other sister who was also not obese. Neither sister had children and nursed them wihich our mother had done. My mother was also very obese at the time she died, but had only "C" cups. My sisters and I are all B cup. No help n your stats or predictions there, but I have no intention of having BA. My breasts do wrap under my arm pits which gives me a nicer shape, but which would be another cup size if the tissue were behind the nipple. The nipples are QUITE Sensitive I might add. I have had two mammograms and both report that the tissue is normal, but is dense and could be a problem in detecting very early cancer to a small degree. I will be having mammo's every two years from here on out.

[Guest Cyndysub]

So-kool are you taking the Oral Micronized progesterone or the synthetic version.

[Guest]

I remember reading somewhere that in natal cis girls their progesterone cycle doesn't strongly kick in until way after breasts have grown.

Personally I did it for a month, but didn't really feel emotionally any different and it was really expensive so I stopped. Still getting breast development at a decent clip. Kind of wish I had better nipple development but whatever. Small nipples can be cute too.

[Guest So-kool]

I dont know which type i take.

The doctor wrote the RX.

I can tell you that the label says:

Medroxy pr AC ... And then the dosage.

I'm Guessing "medroxy" is the generic name.

I assume "pr" refers to progesterone.

The "AC" might refer to which type it is.?

[Guest]

Mine works like gangbusters, I couldn't be happier. I love my large fully developed nipples and areolas. My breasts do everything breasts are supposed to do. My labs are fine and I have always taken micronized progesterone.

Maybe you could contact Dr Patrick Shine in Washington DC for a medical opinion.

[Guest Cyndysub]

So-kool, Micronized is the best to take because it is chemically identical to natural Progesterone, anything else can have bad side effects. When you pick up you pills at the pharmacy ask the pharmacist if it is Micronized Progesterone.There is generic micronized progesterone.

Jodyann I am giving my doctor the boot. I know more about this stuff than he does. He only prescribes

sprio and Estradiol. I had to fight with him to get him to prescribe Finasteride. Other Trans folk here have given him the boot as well. I found a lady doctor that does prescribe Progesterone and she is a endocrinologist as well. Doctors should work with their patients not against them.

.

[Guest Cyndysub]

So-kool yours is synthetic:

Medroxyprogesterone acetate (INN, USAN, BAN), also known as 17α-hydroxy-6α-methylprogesterone acetate, and commonly abbreviated as MPA, is a steroidal progestin, a synthetic variant of the steroid hormone progesterone.

[Guest DesiB]

My gynecologist prescribes my hormones based on what is healthy for a post-menopausal woman. I think this is far more important than concerns over breast size. Of course that's easier for me to say since I've already had GCS & BA over 3 years ago. Still, I'd recommend doing a search for the term "estrogen dominance" and perhaps starting here: http://progesterone.com/estrogen-dominance/ You can also go to amazon.com and search books by Uzzi Reiss, OB/GYN.

[Guest Deenah]

my Endo shot me up with Depo-Provera// medroxyprogesterone acetate ( derivative of progesterone) at my May visit. I did notice change in a week or so but thats just how depo is. I go back in at the end of July so i can comment more on this then. All the research that i have done on Progesterone use in TG individuals states that it is rather useless there is however, some conflicting information on this subject.

[Guest Cyndysub]

Micronized progesterone aka PROMETRIUM is the only one to use that does not have bad side effects. It is the only form that is chemically identical to progesterone. New data shows that men also have progesterone and this was previously thought to be a female hormone only. It comes from the testes for men. In women it comes from the ovaries, placenta, and adrenal glands. Progesterone is a building block that testosterone and estrogen both come form. There is a lot of bs to wade through on the net on progesterone. Dr. Richard Curtis is not an authority on this at all. Hes is not an Endocrinologist and never cites studies of any scientific data in his BS ramblings on the subject. The info is out there but most of the pearls are from Trans females that are taking the micronized version.

[Charlize]

I think one of the reasons there is resistance to progesterone is that it has been self prescribed by MTFs with some disastrous results. I'm sure any qualified endocrinologist can make that decision better than any of us here. Cyndy perhaps you need to look around for someone you trust. I have severe coronary artery disease and self medication would be fatal. There are unfortunately others in the trans* community who continue to follow their dreams without professional assistance. While the study of HRT may be interesting for the lay person and may help in choosing professional help i hope fewer of us will take that option. Getting meds on line after self prescribing is extremely dangerous which is why we limit the discussion of dosages here.

Hugs,

Charlize

[Guest KerryUK]

Well, I don't know whether my input is worth anything but here goes.

Some time ago, I asked my Endo about progesterone because I was concerned about developing 'tubular' breasts. I had read somewhere that being prescribed progesterone can help to alleviate this. She informed me that my HRT patches actually are a mix of Oestrogen and Progesterone. Oh, and so far my breasts have developed beautifully (not a tube in sight).

[Guest Cyndysub]

I'm changing my GP Doctor for a Endo. Charlize if you will read my post you will see where i talked about side effects. I did not feel the need to go in to depth about that. "Micronized progesterone aka PROMETRIUM is the ONLY one to use that does NOT have bad side effects. It is the only form that is chemically identical to progesterone". I have researched this to death and I'm satisfied with the knowledge that I have gained on this subject. My Endo that I found is prescribing the Micronized progesterone for transgender Females. I realize that people not in the peak of health should be very cautious on their medications.