Faith and the alternative community

[Guest Raya]

So, the breach between the "faith" and "lgbt" communities bugs me. A lot. Sometimes I see some hope, and wanted to share.

-At a group today, we had wildly divergent views represented, all having a civil discourse about being trans and spiritual (or not spiritual as the case may be).

-Tonite, I saw this from a hero of mine, about an event I was privileged to be at:

"...and people with various and sundry sexual and gender identities and when the whole thing was over, the only words I had to describe it were transcendent and holy. "

An apt description. More of this please!

From Paula Stone Williams, who spoke there. A woman who has experienced religious intolerance, and still has a faith I admire.

[VickySGV]

By ourselves. Trans* folk are highly spiritual, as I have found out in a number of places. I myself hold to several spiritual paths and still maintain solid active membership in a Christian Community without finding any conflict. I agree that we do Transcend what non trans people can bring within themselves. We have had to find our own spirit paths since others have put us outside their belief patterns. We recognize in each other the "Outlaw" spirituality and make that a way for us to grow closer to each other. We have found doctrines that exclude us and reject those and do not use them to define others or confine ourselves.

[Charlize]

It is unfortunate that so many established religions express doctrines that are so non accepting. I must admit to having had lost all interest in religion. Perhaps the first change came when i was doing yoga with my wife with an instructor from Integral Yoga which embraces all faiths are being different expressions of a higher power. It wasn't until i found sobriety and the need for a higher power that i began to search for faith again. I now consider myself part of a spiritual community and while i don't attend any organized religious organization i am certainly more tolerant of those who do while hoping that they can be tolerant of me as well. I have had moments in groups with others where as you describe things "were transcendent and holy. "

I relish those moments when i feel so close to others living within a power much greater than myself.

It is a pity that some profess religion while practicing exclusion rather than the exclusion that ultimately brings us all together.

Hugs,

Charlize

[Guest Raya]

Yes! radically inclusive outlaws

Reminds me of a descriptor I liked, a 4R christian:

Reformed and refitted renegades and rebels.

[Guest]

Yes! radically inclusive outlaws

Reminds me of a descriptor I liked, a 4R christian:

Reformed and refitted renegades and rebels.

A book that follows along that line is The Ragamuffin Gospel, I think the author is Brennen Manning.

Orthodox religion: come and be saved, God wants you. Follow all of our impossible doctrines and be just like us, so you meet our approval. You are not like us and won't conform. sinner!!! God (we) don't want you! Exclusive. To hell with it!

Spirituality: God wants you, come to the sunlight of the spirit. Love me as I love you! I will provide for you and guide you on your life journey and have more for you when your mortal life ends. Boundless joy for all to have, just for the asking. Infinitely inclusive. Now that's the Heaven I want! Hug. JodyAnn

[Guest Deanna]

I've about had my fill with Christian Churches. It's been a really bad experance for my daughter, to the point of making her sick. We have spent most of the week talking to the pastor. His best advice "Give it time".. This is the same advice he gave us 6 months ago. It seems like hate is not only tolerated but rewarded.

As for me I gave up on them several months ago. I was treated horrible ( been there for 15 years) after transition. When I said something the pastor just said "Give it time". I see a pattern here.

My spouse refuses to leave the church and wants the kids to keep going there to please her mother.

I am now going to a UU church , at least they will talk with me.

[Guest cerise]

God can be found in and out of church. In some ways we are the eyes of the universe so its our responsibility to see things clearly without being skewed by our own perceptions.

For me when I had to list my shortcomings ( defects of character ) it wasn't till much later that I realized the biggest one was lack of faith. Not in the religious sense but what faith is in it nakedness. Trusting the process.