Are you a one issue voter?

[Alejandra]

The issue being LGBT rights. In other words would you vote for a man being smeared as a misogynist who as a successful business man and has the experience and know how to re-vitalize the American economy  and has a good chance of avoiding a nuclear war or.....A woman who is a proven liar with a track record of mafia type, Chicago 'old school' dirty tricks?

Personally I am stunned by the avalanche of incriminating emails being "leaked" by Wiki-Leaks which the main stream media is pointedly ignoring.  Why for example, did all this dirty laundry on Trump not come out during the primaries where it would have eliminated him in favor of a stronger (more 'Establishment' candidate such as Cruz or Fiorina or even Huckabee?

[SugarMagnolia]

Hi Alejandra,

It's an interesting question. 

I'm a multi-issue voter although liberty/personal freedom is certainly a big one and I include LGBT rights in that. I am not a one party voter and usually take previous actions, character, and policy into account and vote for whomever I feel is the best candidate. So, that answers the question in the title. :-)

I'll skip the comparison of candidates as I think they're both flawed, but the dirty laundry question has an easy answer. It's likely that the women who are coming out now previously thought they'd be dismissed/ignored/attacked, as is common in these situations. Lou Dobbs publishing the address and phone number of one of the women is a good example of why someone might choose to keep quiet. It's the same pattern we saw with Cosby's accusers although I'm not intending a direct comparison. The video from the bus and Trump's own words are really the catalyst for women coming forward now, in my opinion, and it took a few days for the NYT and others to interview the women and get some basic level of fact checking done.

I don't know why the video didn't surface until now. Probably, like most of us, Access Hollywood couldn't imagine that anyone running for president would be that misogynistic and also stupid enough to say those things out loud while knowingly being recorded. I know I was surprised. I would guess they didn't think to look at outtakes for that reason.

The wikileaks stuff is being covered, it's just not terribly damning and I think that's why it hasn't received as much coverage. What specifically do you consider incriminating in what's been released? The open borders thing is probably the most politically damaging that I've seen, but it's simply unrealistic to think that that would even be possible which is why I think she called it a "dream" rather than a "plan". 

I would love to have seen a moderate Republican candidate as an alternative, but that didn't happen. Trump not allowing self-vetting should have been a warning for the party.

The Republican party has simply failed to come to grips with the fact that the issues and stances that energize the MAGA crowd and the less moderate part of the party will not win nationwide elections. Alienating latinos, african americans, non-christians, legal immigrants and LGBT voters and their allies was already going to result in a close election. Alienating women makes it impossible. Until, the party becomes more inclusive they're going to continue losing presidential elections regardless of whether they nominate establishment or outsider candidates. Lindsey Graham was right when he said that we're not making enough angry white guys to sustain the GOP.  It's just demographics.

Hang in there, Alejandra. I get worked up about politics and the media a lot myself too. It's frustrating when things don't go the way we hope they will, but the country has survived civil war, world wars and depressions. We'll make it through this, too.  

- Julie

[Charlize]

I am not a one issue voter by a long shot but i do definitely look at the candidates record and position on civil rights as well as his or her VP's record.  Being a Jersey Girl, close to Manhattan and Atlantic City i have unfortunately watched Mr. Trump for years.  Until this election campaign i rarely saw him in the national news, but locally he has worked to make a big name for himself.  I am glad that the recent materials concerning his proclivities are coming out.  Our local business magazine's most recent issue speaks of a local Princeton attorney who represents a young woman who at 13 alleges she had a sexual encounter with him.  This suit has been on going from before the campaign and has nothing to do with the "left wing".  As to his business success it simply doesn't exist.  It is smoke and mirrors based on a name pasted in gold colored paint.  

It is obvious who i will vote for.  The problem is that somehow in this present climate the level of hate has been ramped up for political gain.  To be demonized for being on the left or right side of politics is divisive at best.  The rhetoric (and i can be guilty as well) does not lead to good governance.  

 

Hugs,

 

Charlize

[Briana]

Well said Charlize & Julie!  I'm not either.  I try to look at all the issues (when you can get past all the silliness & rhetoric) and consider what's going to do the most good for most people.  In general I'm fiscally conservative but open and accepting otherwise.  Sometimes I think it might be better is at the presidential level we had NO parties; just debate the issues and present your case.  Or, having a viable 3rd party might be a good thing. 

For me, one scares the woman right out of me and the other scares me less.  It's a shame that Johnson and his sidekick Weld weren't more qualified.  If I may be allowed one personal insult..I hate to say it but I think Johnson is kind of a dope.  A nice guy perhaps but jeezzzzz....

[Alejandra]

I want to thank both Julia and Charlize for y9ur thoughtful answers. In many ways I agree with both of you while at the same time having just a couple of points that I want to raise.

8 hours ago, SugarMagnolia said:

Alienating latinos, african americans, non-christians, legal immigrants and LGBT voters and their allies was already going to result in a close election. Alienating women makes it impossible.

This statement above is a good example. IMHO this is a valid conclusion based on the information being provided by the "main stream" media outlets such as CNN, ABC,NBC, CBS and of course Univision. ALL of which take their lead from the NYT. Without exception all of these so called 'independent news outlets" have admitted in print that they support Hillary Clinton.

This type of collusion between one of the few safe guards against government over reach is terrifying to those of us who believe in the Constitutional principles upon which America was founded.

This is my fear. Most voters form their opinions based on what they believe would work best for them, or which candidate would best provide for their needs. the problem that I see is that the media has created a false narrative, an example of which is quoted above.

Have you not heard of Trump's outreach to the Black community wherein he points out (validly IMO), that the Black is in worse shape than it has ever been under Democratic rule.  IMO what this and all  communities need is more and better jobs, NOT entitlements,

Even more frightening is the mass media; obsession with these unsubstantiated claims  of sexual misconduct while at the same time ignoring  emails between John Podesta,  (HRC campaign manager), and his senior staff withholding certain emails between Potus and HRC after they had been subpoenaed by Congress. 

 

 

 

 

[Alejandra]

As to why the Access Hollywood  video surfaced when it did, I am of the opinion  te the timing is the result of highly coordinated opposition research openly conducted by hundreds of researches to be used strategically to distract from the onslaught of highly damaging emails being currently released by Wikileaks..

[Sakura]

On 10/14/2016 at 3:52 AM, SugarMagnolia said:

 

 

Every time I flip on the news I feel like I am watching the death of democracy in this country most certainly the death of impartial journalism. Main stream news outlets and their "reporters" have become extremely biased skewing facts or simply failing to report anything that does not fit. conform with or  support the views of their political alliances in most cases Democrat and far left liberal.

Hilary Clinton was quoted "  why I am not wining by 50 points or more?" the reason is simple. The internet. Many independent news sites that don't have alliances with Rep or Dems. Have viewership that rival the new york times and washington post. Instead of being spoon fed Hilary by CNN or MSNBC many can now seek out truly impartial reporting that does not protect either side. I just watched a video on one such site truly disturbing. President Obama showing off his erection(through his pants) to the flight attendants of air force one. While this video would never ever see the light of day on CNN it is readily found by those willing to look and it has millions of views on youtube.  Then when you look at the comments sections even on cnn they are against her nearly 5 to 1 the reason she isn't winning by 50 points ( she likely isn't even winning in most states) is because almost no body but her media posse really seems to like her or trust her.

Not sure why that is quoting you magnolia was not intentional

   

[Alejandra]

Which begs the question as to why.  Why would those supporting HRC according to the polls, continue seemingly so blindly in their support for someone who so openly panders for votes, saying what ever the audience at hand wants to hear.

[Carolyn Marie]

4 hours ago, Sakura said:

 Instead of being spoon fed Hilary by CNN or MSNBC many can now seek out truly impartial reporting that does not protect either side. I just watched a video on one such site truly disturbing. President Obama showing off his erection(through his pants) to the flight attendants of air force one.

   

Really, Sakura?  An impartial "news" site like Fellowship of the Mind, which first posted that video? The site also features conspiracy theories such as, that Sandy Hook and the Boston Marathon shootings were staged, and which refers to gays and lesbians as Sodomites.

I watched the video.  It is blurry, grainy, and there is no way to tell what the flight attendants are giggling about.  Legitimate media outlets wouldn't cover that "story" because there is no story.  The President of the United States was standing in the isle of AF 1.  That's news?

But if you wish to get your news from Youtube, you go right ahead.  I like to get facts from places that actually print facts, and not fantasy and conspiracy theories.

Carolyn Marie

[Alejandra]

Perhaps the point that is being missed is that in this case the issue is not sex. Most healthy men get wood in close proximity to an attractive female.

The question is do we want a country with an economy in shambles, an impotent military that is a disgrace more concerned with diversity than protecting its citizens...or are we willing to look past the current media crap storm being thrown up as  smoke screen to protect someone totally unconcerned with those very pertinent issues that affect us in ways much more important to our future well being.

[SugarMagnolia]

44 minutes ago, Alejandra said:

Perhaps the point that is being missed is that in this case the issue is not sex. Most healthy men get wood in close proximity to an attractive female.

The question is do we want a country with an economy in shambles, an impotent military that is a disgrace more concerned with diversity than protecting its citizens...or are we willing to look past the current media crap storm being thrown up as  smoke screen to protect someone totally unconcerned with those very pertinent issues that affect us in ways much more important to our future well being.

Alejandra, can you clarify your claims? 

The economy is vastly improved from eight years ago, significant crime is at historically low levels and our military is the single most powerful fighting force the world has ever seen.

I can tell that you're unhappy with what you perceive as a lack of coverage of the wiki leaks info, but you're vastly overstating the current state of affairs.  

[Alejandra]

1% growth is not an economic recovery in anyone's book.  It is 1% away from another recession

58 minutes ago, SugarMagnolia said:

our military is the single most powerful fighting force the world has ever seen.

If you believe that I can sell you a bridge in Brooklyn.....really cheap.

And if you believe that crime is "down significantly", you might want to visit Southside Chicago, or East St. Louis

[Alejandra]

Maybe this will scare some sense into you:

"In the main email in the thread, Neera Tanden [President of CAP, a left wing activist arm of the Obama administration] harkens back to the first Obamacare case, decided on a 5-4 vote in 2012, and says that she believes the White House “scared off” Chief Justice John Roberts by politicizing the case. She suggests that the Clinton campaign should do the same with regard to the then-pending second Obamacare case, King v. Burwell. She identifies Justices Roberts and Anthony Kennedy as most vulnerable to political pressure:

“It is most likely that this decision has already been made by the Court, but on the off chance that history is repeating itself, then it’s possible they are still deciding (last time, seems like Roberts went from striking the mandate to supporting it in the weeks before). As Jennifer will remember, it was pretty critical that the President threw the gauntlet down last time on the Court, warning them in the first case that it would politicize the role of the Court for them to rule against the ACA. As a close reader of the case, I honestly believe that was vital to scaring Roberts off.

“In this case, I’m not arguing that Hillary spend a lot of time attacking the Court. I do think it would be very helpful to all of our interest in a decision affirming the law, for Roberts and perhaps Kennedy to see negative political consequences to ruling against the government. Therefore, I think it would be helpful to have a story of how progressives and Hillary would make the Supreme Court an election issue (which would be a ready argument for liberals) if the Court rules against the government. It’s not that you wish that happens. But that would be the necessary consequence of a negative decision…the Court itself would become a hugely important political issue.

 

“At CAP Action, we can get that story started. But kinda rests on you guys to make it stick.

“What do you think? If you want to proceed, we should move soon”

Jake Sullivan, the Clinton campaign’s foreign policy adviser, responded that he’s “into it” but allowed Jennifer Palmieri, the Clinton campaign’s communications director, to make the final say.

“She has already been making this an issue. Not sure how in depth you are suggesting but seems like this should be manageable.”

Whether or not Chief Justices can be swayed by political pressure is not so much at issue here as is the fact that the Clinton campaign believes they can be, and tries to manipulate them accordingly.

H/T: InstaPundit and the Wall Street Journal

 

 

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About Brian Thomas

Brian Thomas lives in Cleveland, where he is part of a program helping elderly and disabled veterans. He has worked in education, journalism, and public relations since his college years at Ashland University

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Filed Under: USTagged With: Chief Justice, Clinton, John Roberts, wikileaks

[Sakura]

14 hours ago, Carolyn Marie said:

Really, Sakura?  An impartial "news" site like Fellowship of the Mind, which first posted that video? The site also features conspiracy theories such as, that Sandy Hook and the Boston Marathon shootings were staged, and which refers to gays and lesbians as Sodomites.

I watched the video.  It is blurry, grainy, and there is no way to tell what the flight attendants are giggling about.  Legitimate media outlets wouldn't cover that "story" because there is no story.  The President of the United States was standing in the isle of AF 1.  That's news?

But if you wish to get your news from Youtube, you go right ahead.  I like to get facts from places that actually print facts, and not fantasy and conspiracy theories.

Carolyn Marie

Hmm had never heard of fellow ship of the mind until just now. I am kinda of offended that you would assume I watched that video there or would be associated with such a hate filled site.  

[Timber Wolf]

Hi Everyone,

 

Presidential campaigns are kind of like two candidates standing by an eisle trying to paint a rosey picture of themselves with one hand while flinging mud at the other's picture with the other hand, all the while having thier media allies flinging mud right along with them. It happens on both sides. Pretty tough to know the trurh about either candidate by what is said by the campaigns or the media. You have to know something about each candidate before the campaign began. It's a shame that all the media has thier chips in with a political party. There are no nonbiased media outlets without an adgenda. That's what freedom of the press was intended for, to be the peoples watchdog. Unfortunately, the press (media) has surrendered that freedom to thier chosen political party. They have given up thier freedom to report honestly and without bias through self imposition of servitude to thier political party.

 

Lots of love,

Timber Wolf?

[Alejandra]

I just heard a Democratic spokesman for HRC saying the reason for her support is her "vision of a global community, open borders and free trade".  Sounds great  in a campaign speech or a trailer for some fairy tale, but....that ol' pesky reality just keeps getting in the way.

Again, the question is not whether or not Bill C. or Don T. have a healthy male sex drive.  The question in my mind is a question of corruption.  The latest reveal is that the Obama State Dept. offered extra overseas postings for FBI personnel in exchange for changing the security classification on some of HRC's emails.  Add this to the well substantiated "pay for play" allegations and one has a pretty ugly picture of your typical tin pot totalitarian dictator.

Read your history folks.  This is how nations fall.  First the press, then the courts.  All this accomplished by appealing to the electorate's basest, most lurid instincts. At this point the picture is pretty clear.  The issues: free trade, the economy, taxes, education, National Security.  All of these have gone by the wayside in favor of unsubstantiated allegations of sexual misconduct.

[SugarMagnolia]

Alejandra, 

Scaring sense into people implies that you don't believe they have sense. Not a great start.

1) gdp - this fluctuates as any other economic measure does but real gdp has bounced up and down around the two percent level for years. Please don't cherry pick a single data point and then state that if it was a lower number that would be bad.

2) crime - again cherry picking two cities' murder numbers does not change this https://ucr.fbi.gov/crime-in-the-u.s/2013/crime-in-the-u.s.-2013/tables/1tabledatadecoverviewpdf/table_1_crime_in_the_united_states_by_volume_and_rate_per_100000_inhabitants_1994-2013.xls

3) military - ok, it's difficult to assess my claim objectively. Reasonable people could differ. However, there's no denying that our military spending is more than the next 10 countries combined and that we outclass any other country in overall capability. What measure are you using to reach the conclusion that our military is impotent?

Julie

 

[MarcieMarie12]

46 minutes ago, SugarMagnolia said:

3) military - ok, it's difficult to assess my claim objectively. Reasonable people could differ. However, there's no denying that our military spending is more than the next 10 countries combined and that we outclass any other country in overall capability. What measure are you using to reach the conclusion that our military is impotent?

Julie

 

Military is not just the quantitiy of equipment and man power. Much of which is mis-used as a basis for judjing military strength. True military strength is actually a combination of those but the harder to gauge items are leadership, logistics, and technological prowess. If you don't excel in all those categories you are not a top contender. Where many of US's potential adversaries have large numbers of troops, and may be a generation or equal to the US, the amount of top grade equipment, logistics and leadership leave a lot to be desired. Also, with the exception of Russia and China, all the remaining top 10 navies after the US are US allies or friendly to the US.

Now on to GDP---don't expect the president to impact the economy that much. Market forces cause the economy to go up and down depending on so many other things. A billion+ different things impact the economy--what the president does or wants to help the economy usually has to be approved by congress. Sometimes they hurt it trying to help too because of the unintended consequences.

 

Sorry for the somewhat off topic slide, but I'm a military history buff and an econ major.

 

[SugarMagnolia]

Those are great, points @MarcieMarie12. Thank you. Not a hijack at all.

It is a complex topic and I just can't see any reasonable analysis that concludes our military is "impotent".

 

[Alejandra]

2 hours ago, MarcieMarie12 said:

Military is not just the quantitiy of equipment and man power. Much of which is mis-used as a basis for judjing military strength. True military strength is actually a combination of those but the harder to gauge items are leadership, logistics, and technological prowess.

Hmmm... you might want to take a quick look at the battle of Kursk.  The German army had superior equipment, leadership, training logistics and esprit de corp.  The Russians had vastly superior numbers, virtually no leadership other than "hold the line", and a tank corps consisting of mostly peasants. Guess who won.

 

2 hours ago, MarcieMarie12 said:

with the exception of Russia and China,

pretty big "exception".

The point is 70% of the US population knows this country is going in the wrong direction under our current "leadership".  If that majority is willing to ignore that reality and choose someone who will carry on and even double down on the current course then God help us all.  We will get what we deserve.

[Timber Wolf]

14 hours ago, Alejandra said:

Hmmm... you might want to take a quick look at the battle of Kursk.  The German army had superior equipment, leadership, training logistics and esprit de corp.  The Russians had vastly superior numbers, virtually no leadership other than "hold the line", and a tank corps consisting of mostly peasants. Guess who won. 

(First off, any discrepancies in the end of the quote are due to the fact that I erased too far and had to retype the end of the quote)

 

Actually while the German commanders may have been more seasoned and skilled, by the time they invaded Russia, the German commanders had been reduced to message boys. Adolf (I use his first name because I think the automatic word scrubber's might remove and replace his last name) was making all the major command desissions, and had already lost his ability to make rational desissions. Therefore, the German leadership was actually worse than the Russian's. As far as the tanks go, although the German's did have good tanks, the Russian tanks proved to be superior in design. Due to there shape, the Russian tanks deflected a significant amount of the impact of an incoming shell, making it more difficult to destroy them. The German tanks, while well armored, were more blunt in shape, taking the full impact of the shell. Add to that, that it's generally more difficult to take a posission that it is to hold one, and one should begin to see that the Russian's actually had the edge on the German's.

 

Our military is second to none! I am so proud of our soldiers. They are our champions! While you can argue that this president or that president made poor leadership desissions, our military can do things that most other military's can only dream of.

 

Lots of love,

Timber Wolf?

 

[Carolyn Marie]

Please keep the posts on-topic.  I seems that it has gone sideways at this point.  While interesting, this isn't a history forum.  Thank you.

Carolyn Marie

[Alejandra]

Yes. I am very proud of our soldiers.  They are heros, many of whom gave their lives and parts of their bodies in the service of hapless leaders who have something other than America's national interests at hand. US forces took and pacified Mosul during the 'surge' in 2007.  As predicted, when Obama, (under HRC's State Dept.) pulled out all our troops, Mosul was over run. Even as sat images showed ISIS moving large columns of military men and equipment across open desert, HRC/Obama did nothing. Now our troops are again in harms way.

I also agree with Carolyn that this discussion should not be about the comparative merits of  the Russian T-34 vs. the German's T3,T-4, Panther and Tiger Tanks, the latter two of which had bigger, more powerful guns and much heavier and more effective armor.

This discussion is about how so many voters are simply unaware, (or don't care), about some really scary stuff. I notice there was absolutely no comment about the fact that FOYA requests, (NOT Wikileaks), have revealed that seniors staffers at the State Dept. solicited changes in the security classification of Clinton emails.

[Timber Wolf]

4 hours ago, Carolyn Marie said:

Please keep the posts on-topic.  I seems that it has gone sideways at this point.  While interesting, this isn't a history forum.  Thank you.

Carolyn Marie

Sorry, I got all caught up in history stuff. I realized after I had posted that I probably strayed too far, but by then, it was too late. 

 

Lots of love,

Timber Wolf?

 

[Briana]

Lol Timber Wolf!  I like history too and I actually paid attention in those classes.  

Alejandra, your last statement in bold about voters and issues is right on to me.  We the people need to get better at this vetting and voting stuff.