A Great Take On The J.K. Rowling Dust Up

[Carolyn Marie]

https://www.washingtonpost.com/lifestyle/style/jk-rowling-transgender-women-comments/2020/06/07/303dd2e2-a8f7-11ea-a9d9-a81c1a491c52_story.html?utm_campaign=wp_post_most&utm_medium=email&utm_source=newsletter&wpisrc=nl_most

 

 

Carolyn Marie

[Tory Aoi]

That was a good read, thank you for sharing.  I got a chuckle out of the "All houses matter" analogy.

[DragonflyGirl]

I was watching her implode the other night on Twitter. She's probably deleted everything by now (although the screenshots will do the rounds for some time) but she'd clearly had a few too many vinos and was really going some!

 

Among the highlights was: "My butch lesbian friend just phoned and said f****ng yeah!" ?

 

The upside is I think she's actually drawn more attention to the sheer absurdity of TERFism than the negativity towards trans people she was attempting to propagate.

[Dana Michelle]

I couldn't read the article linked because I don't have a subscription but Googled some stories. I'd like to see her explain why she thinks transgender people are erasing the concept of biological sex, and why she thinks the reason Maya Forstater was fired is for saying biological sex is real. Being transgender means being uncomfortable with one's birth sex, which means the concept depends on biological sex. If sex did not exist, transgender would not exist either.

[DragonflyGirl]

Maya Forstater wasn't fired. She didn't have her contract renewed because she committed herself to making a humiliating and hostile working environment for trans people.

 

Rowling knows that very well, and chose to be totally disingenuous about it.

 

Anyway, there is justice in this world, and she's unwittingly defeating the TERF agenda. Most people are taking our side after seeing her stupidity.

 

Look at this... https://www.thetrevorproject.org/2020/06/08/daniel-radcliffe-responds-to-j-k-rowlings-tweets-on-gender-identity/ ???

[KayC]

3 hours ago, DragonflyGirl said:

TERF agenda

I had to Google TERF because I had no idea what the acronym meant ... now I know ?

I brought this up in another Forum discussing whether MtF trans are generally accepted by cis-women, or if we are looked at with suspicion or derided for not "truly" being women.  I understand TERF was originally attached to some lesbian/feminist factors but is now applied more broadly across the female spectrum.

What I really don't understand (or actually maybe I do) is WHY do people have to apply labels and then find ways to isolate and put down others who don't fit into their category of "us".  Would think that the collective struggles of the LGBTQ+ community would bond us, verses the opposite.

Well... this is humanity right now.  No wonder the world is such a crazy place today

[DragonflyGirl]

The word TERF has never been  applied across the female spectrum. I suspect whoever made that claim knows that very well and has more than a few more untruths up their sleeves about trans women.

 

It is a bad acronym though, and I really should stop using it. The problem is the inclusion of the word 'feminist'. They're not feminists in any shape or form. In fact, their attitudes towards various demographics of women are nothing short of appalling. The word gives them an implied status that they really don't deserve.

[Dana Michelle]

34 minutes ago, DragonflyGirl said:

The word TERF has never been  applied across the female spectrum. I suspect whoever made that claim knows that very well and has more than a few more untruths up their sleeves about trans women.

 

It is a bad acronym though, and I really should stop using it. The problem is the inclusion of the word 'feminist'. They're not feminists in any shape or form. In fact, their attitudes towards various demographics of women are nothing short of appalling. The word gives them an implied status that they really don't deserve.

I think TERF is a useful term (even if the acronym might not be right). It describes a common prejudice against transgender people and is as useful as terms like transphobia, homophobia, sexism, etc. Maybe the reason for the 'F' in 'TERF' is that it describes a perception that transgender people are a threat to feminism. Maybe it could be TERFF for transgender exclusionary radical fake feminist.

[DragonflyGirl]

It should also be said that the most virulent TERF on social media is an abusive, narcissistic male, who has shown time and time again what a disgusting attitude he has for all women, yet these so-called feminists continually turn a blind eye.

[Dana Michelle]

I find it ironic that J.K. Rowling judges transgender people as erasing biological sex yet she dyes her hair. Maybe J.K. Rowling is denying the reality of hair color. As a natural redhead, maybe I should deride J.K. Rowling for not being a "real" redhead.

(To clarify, I don't really find anything wrong with people dying their hair. I'm just calling J.K. Rowling a hypocrite in a sarcastic way.)

[DragonflyGirl]

'Erasing biological women' is such an absurd dog whistle, yet it whips the bigots into a fury every time. I wonder if they ever actually think about their logic. I really do.

[Dana Michelle]

More irony is that J.K. Rowling equates "women" with "people who menstruate" yet given that she is 54 years old, she probably no longer menstruates. She erased herself from the definition of women.

[KayC]

I think you really got everybody's motor running @Carolyn Marie ??

[Carolyn Marie]

3 hours ago, KayC said:

I think you really got everybody's motor running @Carolyn Marie ??

 

Thanks, Kay.  I've always thought I had good mechanic skills.  ?

 

Carolyn Marie

[Carolyn Marie]

Rowling's logic is very similar to that used by opponents of same-sex marriage:  "OMG, if you allow that it will eliminate the institution of marriage!"  It always seems to be a zero sum game for some; if you give X more rights, that reduces the rights of Y.  I'm no logic expert, but that makes no sense.  Never has, never will.

 

Carolyn Marie

[Mx.Drago]

Normally, I would find it comical, a fiction writer having a mental malfunction, over reality and/or lack of logic. But this is just sad and disturbing. It's unfortunate, so many like those books she own rights to.

[VickySGV]

She is showing how totally fictional her characters are, she does not believe them herself.

 

[Just Lee]

I've said it before and I'll say it again, it is NOT oppression (or erasing) when one group gains rights that you've always had... to Rowling and bigots like her. This exclusion has GOT to stop. If it's wrong to be racist or sexist, why the exclusion against transgender people? Is it just yet another excuse to hate someone that's not you? I honestly don't understand why it's a reason to hate others. The clerk at my local Market Basket, Marcy, is a kind, hard working woman. Underneath the lame work vest is always a well dressed woman with classy jewelry and a flawless manicure. It's a small place I live in and not once have I witnessed anyone misgendering or mistreating her. I have the brains to understand why misogyny or racism occurs but I can't wrap my head around why there's so much hatred for transgender or binary people. There is no threat in any way. I truly don't understand why. 

[Carolyn Marie]

31 minutes ago, Just Lee said:

 I have the brains to understand why misogyny or racism occurs but I can't wrap my head around why there's so much hatred for transgender or binary people. There is no threat in any way. I truly don't understand why. 

 

It always comes down to the fact that for too many cis-folks, we are "the other; we are different, and so we are to be feared and loathed.  So it has always been throughout history.  In colonial days "the other" were the local populations.  Thirty years ago "the other" were gays and lesbians.  Sixty years ago, and sadly still today "the other" were black people.  Until we are no longer "the other" this mistreatment and denial of basic rights will go on.

 

Carolyn Marie

[Mx.Drago]

This just means, I ,along with other story writers got to get writing more inclusive fiction, and whatever with her noise. Folks just looking for a fight to keep themselves looking better, being exclusive will be their problem.

[Just Lee]

Thank you Carolyn and Drago, I appreciate it. In my Ojibwe culture, people that 2 Spirits were always revered for having the ultimate gift of 2 spirits in one body. Not feared--revered and highly respected. I guess there will always be an other in mainstream society. Fortunately, humans have an amazing ability to adapt quickly to new things. With all my heart, I hope this too will pass to a time when transgender is not a whispered word or where we must congregate separately for protection. 

[Astrid]

So, Rowling released a 3600 word essay explaining her stance today...and ultimately she rolled out bathroom insecurity as an issue. All I can say as someone who worked 6 months on a referendum to defeat this argument... she has no meaningful statistics to support that. Sigh. Here we go again. Getting tired of this stuff!!!

 

Astrid

[Dana Michelle]

48 minutes ago, Astrid said:

So, Rowling released a 3600 word essay explaining her stance today...and ultimately she rolled out bathroom insecurity as an issue. All I can say as someone who worked 6 months on a referendum to defeat this argument... she has no meaningful statistics to support that. Sigh. Here we go again. Getting tired of this stuff!!!

 

Astrid

Something that confuses me is if she cares what other people think of her. Previously, she has not explained herself and her publicists have given short excuses, which made it sound like she's not interested in explaining herself. Now she has diarrhea of the mouth.

[Dana Michelle]

J.K Rowling said "I tweeted my support for Maya Forstater, a tax specialist who’d lost her job for what were deemed ‘transphobic’ tweets. She took her case to an employment tribunal, asking the judge to rule on whether a philosophical belief that sex is determined by biology is protected in law." Could that be a bigger strawman? Maya Foraster said "My belief … is that sex is a biological fact, and is immutable. There are two sexes, male and female. Men and boys are male. Women and girls are female. It is impossible to change sex. These were until very recently understood as basic facts of life by almost everyone." Saying sex can change is not denying that sex is not determined by biology. The fundamental elements of chemistry are the atomic elements, but guess what: with technology we can change them! Collide some Plutonium-239 with some Helium-4 and you get Curium-242! Chemistry is waayyyy more concrete of a science than biology, and chemistry has much cleaner and more specific definitions than biology. If chemistry allows change, then so does biology.

[Guest]

On 6/9/2020 at 4:23 PM, Dana Michelle said:

Maybe it could be TERFF for transgender exclusionary radical fake feminist.

?

I love it! That is a nice take on the abbreviation! ???

I coined my own term that unite all the 'tarns-friends who hate us' - Genitalists, because they are so obsessed with and want to enforce genitals as something more than a physiological characteristics for procreation ( I am not talking about intercourse, because casual s*x is something different, it's our own deviation from the instinct to procreate, that we use for fun or bonding) . They are turning them into something that defines us!

 

Sorry, I am not defined by my modified 'cl*t' that you call 'pe**s', TERFF girl!

 

I'll use your acronym with pleasure! Thanks for it! 

 

As for JK - she's an ignorant fool! End of statement!