12 Years C and S and I Intend to Keep on Going.

[VickySGV]

As time goes by I pay less and less attention to the alcohol and more attention to the Character I want others to see.  Every now and then I happily surprise someone by my pride in being a recovering addict.  They have only the worst visions of an Addict and I totally mess with their mind on that by being the happy and self assured person that I am today.  (Not to mention being a sassy old Trans broad as well.).

[Jani]

Great news.  Being who we really are is intoxicating too.  Its the only high I'm interested in.  

I think its good that you do surprise people.  It gives a face to the disease that shows not all is bad.   Sassy old (trans) broads are cool!!  Congratulations on another year.  More to come!!

Hugs, Jani

[Heather Nicole]

Pardon my naivete, what is the "C" and "S"?

[Susan R]

Clean and Sober

[Heather Nicole]

Ahh, ok. (Seems obvious in retrospect, duh!) But that does make the technical side of my mind wonder: Is there some specific meaning to the "clean" part (as opposed to the "sober" part), or it is just a colloquialism like "nice and soft"?

[VickySGV]

2 hours ago, Heather Nicole said:

Is there some specific meaning to the "clean" part (as opposed to the "sober" part),

 

To some degree it is as you call it, a colloquialism these days, but it has its roots in the nature of addictions.  Most of my friends use C&S, but for some reason the topic title did not want to use the ampersand, so I wrote it out.

 

The term Clean refers to not abusing drugs as I was doing, albeit they were prescription drugs that I was not taking per my doctor's orders, and I had gotten them by lying to him about the severity of my drinking problems.  People who abused street drugs and are in NA or MA or some others use the term as a synonym to sober in their cases.  I had to be very careful about abusing pain pills after my GCS nearly 7 years ago.  I could have gotten hooked on them and gone back to drug abuse.  Thank heaven it did not happen.

 

Sober does refer to being free (clean) from Alcohol and no longer using it.  A person can be physically sober (we call it Dry) and not have alcohol in their bodies, but still have the underlying problems that lead to abuse of it.  To be in extended Recovery we need to have the mental problems that caused alcohol abuse to happen on our lives worked on, resolved and under control.  The same is true for the narcotics aka drug users. 

 

Hope that helps.

[Charlize]

CONGRATULATIONS

VICKY

12 YEARS

IS

AWESOME

!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

As to clean and sober Vicky is right on

: "To be in extended Recovery we need to have the mental problems that caused alcohol abuse to happen on our lives worked on, resolved and under control.  The same is true for the narcotics aka drug users. "

This sober part is often called emotional sobriety.  It is one reason we try to stay active in recovery.  

 

Hugs,

 

Charlize

[Robin.C]

Congratulations, wonderful to hear.

Hugs

Robin

[Lee H]

My drug of choice was alcohol, so I'm active in that Program, but one of the NA readings we use out here on the Left Coast says, "We cannot afford to be confused about this. Alcohol is a drug," to which the members in attendance often say, "Period." I hit more AA, but I don't hesitate to walk into any NA meeting, because alcohol merely was my drug of choice over the other illicit ones. I also qualify for, and attend, AlAnon and Adult Children meetings.

To me, "Clean and sober [C/S]" describes someone being in recovery and working a program. I think it's all one program with certain aspects emphasized in the corresponding meetings. I like them all.

[VickySGV]

4 hours ago, Lee H said:

I think it's all one program with certain aspects emphasized in the corresponding meetings.

 

When we have been in the programs and have experience over several years, the differences do mean less and less to us.  A person entering any of them on the First Step though is not ready for the spiritual aspects that they will eventually see.  They all need (as we did) the Experience of others with their drug of choice otherwise it is easy to avoid those experiences that go hand in hand with their own.  An example from a mixed group of Trans Addicts on Face Book was that for alcohol, you buy it easily over the counter, and the drug addict who had to buy from a pusher could not fully get their point across and become in relation to the OTC alcohol abusers.  What mattered really was communication on the overwhelming slavery our drugs place on us, and if was not a matter of "if" that happened but they were only able to listen to HOW in enslaved them. 

[Lee H]

Hi Vicky --

I like the NA philosophy -- "We're not interested in the specific drugs you took, who was your pusher, or where you got them." That attitude is imperative in NA meetings, because they're talking about recovery from addiction, not just recovery from this or that drug. I agree with you that,

16 hours ago, VickySGV said:

They all need (as we did) the Experience of others with their drug of choice otherwise it is easy to avoid those experiences that go hand in hand with their own.

Declining to listen to "those experiences" is a more common phenomenon in AA. Many alcoholics are unwilling to acknowledge that they were or still are practicing addiction to alcohol. I've had this discussion several times since I've been in AA. Sometimes there is more heat that light when I mention that even Dr. Silkworth referred to it as "alcoholic addiction." [BB, 3rdEd, p. xxv.] I think this is more of a problem with how they think others would think of them if we were to acknowledge and call ourselves "addicts." But my POV that "it's all addiction" certainly is way over toward one pole of the AA spectrum about "singleness of purpose." The AA program needs the entire spectrum. 

 

I also think the druggie who thinks that he/she had a rougher time than us alkies -- pusher v. OTC -- should hit a few more AA meetings, perhaps try a little H&I in a prison or halfway house for paroled felons. I quickly learned there is no "most terrible bottom." For many, me included, it depends on luck or the crime for which one got caught. 

 

16 hours ago, VickySGV said:

What mattered really was communication on the overwhelming slavery our drugs place on us,

I think Step 1 really is, "This stuff is killing me. I've got to stop. I can't stop. I am well and truly screwed." And I agree with you, it is a slavery taking us only toward death or insanity, [or jails.]  

 

BTW, Vicky, thanks so much for the work you do to help keep this Forum working for all of us. It's where many of us start experimenting with coming out, and that is a very valuable service. 

 

~~With a hug for you, Lee~~

[VickySGV]

@Lee HAll excellent points, and thanks for the virtual hug.