Sonny And Cher's Child Transitioning From Female To Male

[Guest]

Sonny and Cher's child transitioning from female to male

http://www.cnn.com/2009/SHOWBIZ/06/11/ent....bono/index.html

[Guest Eth]

Pretty cool. I really wish these articles would stop it with the "choice" and "decision" things though... It's like they're emphasising "they're choosing to do this- it's not like it's necessary...".

Oh well... Give it time.

[Guest Zabrak]

The only part of this I like is that another FTM is getting to be their true self.

The media part is not so good.

[Guest April63]

Hmm. Do you think negative or positive publicity?

[Guest Donna Jean]

Hmm. Do you think negative or positive publicity?

Actually, I think this could go either way and probably go some of both....

There will be lots of "Jerry Springer" type hype.......

Then there will be good articles and stories about the plight of Transgendered people and Chaz Bono is high profile, so people are interested...

So I gusess we'll see it go both ways.....I just wanna read the good ones....

HUGGS

Donna Jean

[Guest _Michael]

Definitely a good thing in my opinion. News reporting on it has been sketch - there have been lots of she's and the like and it's being sensationalized, but seeing trans in the mainstream is going to be a good thing overall. Chaz is high profile, and he's already an activist.

[Guest meridian]

I have to say that I fell asleep in front of the TV last night, but when I heard the words "change gender" I snapped to attention. So, first of all, we must hear a lot more than we think when we're sleeping, and, second, the parents of transgendered children definitely develop radar for this! As the parent of an MTF, I can only see Chastity Bono's announcement as good news. Even if a lot of the publicity will be exploitative, more and more people will feel that they "know" someone who is transgender, and that is to the good. (In a similar way, the election campaign and inauguration of President Obama has given many white Americans the feeling that they now "know" someone who is black--also good. Not so many are familiar with Chastity Bono, but there are a lot of us boomers out there who remember Sonny and Cher.)

Let's see what happens now.

Meridian

[Guest Evan_J]

oy....I feel ill......

I just read the first of the "ugly " comments.....

If you wanna (and think you can bear it) google and use the key words chastity bono (comma) universal health care. -yes, paired with that

Ugly....awful....from peeps bein "outraged" that he's referred to as "he" to the "this is because of horrible upbringing, family with dispicable values and connected to having a democratic president" ones.

What I was actually looking for (theres a rumor) was info regarding a supposed correspondence from Bono to D.C. about the healthcare.

[Guest joe0117]

Those are some ugly comments, Evan. I couldn't get through them all. People are so ignorant ans so full of hate Stupid people are dangerous.

Joe

[Guest Eth]

oy....I feel ill......

I just read the first of the "ugly " comments.....

If you wanna (and think you can bear it) google and use the key words chastity bono (comma) universal health care. -yes, paired with that

Ugly....awful....from peeps bein "outraged" that he's referred to as "he" to the "this is because of horrible upbringing, family with dispicable values and connected to having a democratic president" ones.

What I was actually looking for (theres a rumor) was info regarding a supposed correspondence from Bono to D.C. about the healthcare.

...Evan... I wish you hadn't told me... and they call US sick? That's just wrong.

[Guest Elizabeth K]

WARNING

Don't read the response comments, other than to get a general feel. Transgender issues ALWAYS bring out the HATE MONGERS!

Look at the Zapado murder - unbelieveble nasty and vile responses. But Mia - who lives in the general area where the murder happened - kept us informed that generally people were supportive of justice for a horrible hate crime. GOOD people don't spread their opinions - unlike those terribly unhappy beings, the ones that are so afraid of their own gender questions, they have to spew hatred toward anyone outside what they consider the 'norm.'

So don't read too much. Value your breakfast - don't toss your cookies... ask GOD they might see the error of their ways, those who hate us so much.

Just my opinion...

Elizabeth Anne

[Guest Eth]

I made this post on one site that appeared to have a lot of flaming and such going on towards Chaz Bono for being transgender. I doubt it'll do much good, but if it gets even one person to open their mind and look at us in a new light... then it's worth it.

Ignorance = Intolerance. No, I'm not talking about stupidity- I am talking about IGNORANCE. A lack of understanding due to being unaware of both the basic and more complex facts surrounding an issue.

People who are ignorant of something are not bad people- they merely need to open their minds and thoroughly study what it is they are talking about before they form an overall opinion. Those who are uneducated on an issue are obviously not going to understand it- how can you have a true opinion on something that you know nothing about?

For starters, I would like to state that Gender Identity and Sexual Orientation are not even remotely the same thing. Transsexuals are not "gays to the max". There are many transsexuals out there who are interested in the same gender (notice I say gender- not sex) romantically and/or physically, which, by your standards, would make them heterosexual. It's no wonder you are confused when you are so very far off. Please allow me to explain so that you may develop a deeper understanding of this issue for future reference.

If you are male and you are interested in women, then you are heterosexual. If you are interested in men, then you are homosexual. There are many other sexual orientations out there, but we need not get into them right now (this does not include beastiality, pedophilia and all that other junk you've been raving on about). Those who are FtM transsexual are and always have been male. Their physical sex may have been female, but their gender was always male (even if they didn't understand that until now). Gender roles are something that is so ingrained into society that it is very difficult for transgender people to find themselves on the gender spectrum. The world insists that they are what their bodies say they are, but they don't understand that the mind simply does not match the body. A FtM transsexual who is interested in females is heterosexual, as their gender is male.

I then followed it up with this because I ran out of space on the comment box.

There are many websites out there that provide tons of useful, legitimate information on transgendered individuals and what it means to be transgender. I do hope that you will take the time to do a little bit of research before you try to make an opinion about us. No, you do not NEED to look this up, nor am I or anyone else telling you that you "have to" or whatever (I am not so high-and-mighty as to believe I can demand or 'tell' you to do anything), but if you are going to make hateful, discriminatory or otherwise ill-informed comments, and if you are going to be voting on matters that affect our fundamental rights, then you should know what you are talking about. I ask you, please, to take the time to understand who we are as human beings before you judge us in an irrational manner. We are no less deserving of equal rights, privileges and social status as you are. We have no affiliation with pedophiles, zoophiles, necrophiliacs or any other sexually-driven group other than those under the LGBT umbrella. Transgenderedness has absolutely nothing to do with sexuality or sexual preference. Please do not label us as anything we are not, and do not assume that we support things that aren't even remotely related to us. We are not 'freaks', 'perverts' or any of those other unpleasant names you've given us. We are merely living our lives as the gender we have always truly been- it is a blessing for so many of us to finally come to grips with who we are so that we can identify as such. Don't be ill-informed. Do some research, then say what you think of us. Thank you.

[Guest AshleyK]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/artic...sex-change.html

Also has a column on the NHS giving young people advice on how to get a sex change. Unsurprisingly, the Mail has chosen the ever-moaning Tax-Payer's Alliance (who complain at everything that tax money is spent on anyway) and a Christian to talk about how disgraceful it is.

I'm surprised by the ammount of positive comments though, I always thought Daily Mail readers were as closed-minded as the newspaper.

[Guest joe0117]

Eth - I think your comment was well thought out, educational, and respectful. I hope that people will read it and do as you suggest and educate themselves. You made some excellent points and did it very eloquently. Nicely done!!!

Joe

[Guest Alyssa Leigh]

This is the one I came across and found extremely offensive on all levels. Except a few educated people. http://www.nydailynews.com/forums/thread.j...ssageID=1016022

It seems that everyone that has left comments are ignorant, uneducated and close minded. For them to even think that we just woke up one day and said I want to switch genders or sex is insane.

[Guest Alyssa Leigh]

So don't read too much. Value your breakfast - don't toss your cookies... ask GOD they might see the error of their ways, those who hate us so much.

Just my opinion...

Elizabeth Anne

Its to late for that I already did and am wishing that I hadnt read the comments.

[MaryEllen]

This is the one I came across and found extremely offensive on all levels. Except a few educated people. http://www.nydailynews.com/forums/thread.j...ssageID=1016022

It seems that everyone that has left comments are ignorant, uneducated and close minded. For them to even think that we just woke up one day and said I want to switch genders or sex is insane.

Geez! That comment by American Man is really offensive. He could really benefit from some intense psychotherapy. To be that hate filled just isn't normal. I bet he even hates himself. I'm glad I don't live next door to him.

MaryEllen

[MaryEllen]

This is the one I came across and found extremely offensive on all levels. Except a few educated people. http://www.nydailynews.com/forums/thread.j...ssageID=1016022

It seems that everyone that has left comments are ignorant, uneducated and close minded. For them to even think that we just woke up one day and said I want to switch genders or sex is insane.

ROFL I'm sorry. I just couldn't help myself. The devil made me do it. Click on the link and scroll down to the comment made by BillieJo in response to American Man"s offensive comment. I used the alias BillieJo cause I don't want that nutcase idiot coming anywhere near me.

MaryEllen

[Guest mia 1]

Oh excellent! The ignorant bigot probably won't read your comment...but if he ever wore pink panties like I am at this moment he would never go back to those white stained red neck cotton briefs with Rush! on one cheek and Cheney! on the other and James Dobson in the middle were it hurts the most...lol......

P.S. Thank you Dr. WWOTHW....Love Mia

[Guest Leah1026]

ROFL I'm sorry. I just couldn't help myself. The devil made me do it. Click on the link and scroll down to the comment made by BillieJo in response to American Man"s offensive comment. I used the alias BillieJo cause I don't want that nutcase idiot coming anywhere near me.

MaryEllen

Good one. I could help myself either and I piled on.

[MaryEllen]

Oh he read it all right. I think I pushed his bigot button. LOL

MaryEllen

[Guest Donna Jean]

LOL!!!!!

ME!

Is that a cut on us GOOD Americans that have a double first name????

(Billie Joe) Donna Jean

Mary Ellen...OMG! This is SO un like you......

I'm RFLMAO!!!!

HUGE HUGG!!!!!

Dee Jay!

[Guest Alyssa Leigh]

That was to great, His comment was one of the most offensive ones on there. It is kind of sad when you would have to go online and spew garabage like that around.

[Guest S. Chrissie]

WARNING

Don't read the response comments, other than to get a general feel. Transgender issues ALWAYS bring out the HATE MONGERS!

Look at the Zapado murder - unbelieveble nasty and vile responses. But Mia - who lives in the general area where the murder happened - kept us informed that generally people were supportive of justice for a horrible hate crime. GOOD people don't spread their opinions - unlike those terribly unhappy beings, the ones that are so afraid of their own gender questions, they have to spew hatred toward anyone outside what they consider the 'norm.'

So don't read too much. Value your breakfast - don't toss your cookies... ask GOD they might see the error of their ways, those who hate us so much.

Just my opinion...

Elizabeth Anne

I regretted not heeding your warning...The comments were vile..

[Guest Eth]

-half laughs at MaryEllen- That was good and funny XD... but...

Personally, I think that if we make accusations towards them, or "fight" back, we really make ourselves look as bad as them. Though I do think MaryEllen did it in a rather clever way, so as to avoid that. Honestly, I think we need to recognize that these people are sadly ill-informed and have been fed the wrong information for a very, very long time.

Imagine tomorrow that someone appears on TV after turning themselves into something 'freakish'. Imagine that they distorted their vocal cords so that they could not speak properly. They had ink put into the soft membrane in their eyes, literally giving themselves 'eye tattoos'. Imagine that they tried to give themselves gills, but they didn't work and they had tons of breathing problems and sounded like they were wheezing all the time. Say they genitically modified their very skin so that it turned green and had dull, flaky scales. Now imagine that these people wanted the right to work anywhere, live anywhere and wanted insurance and possibly tax money to help fund their 'transition'.

This is an example of how the people posting those 'hateful' comments on those sites view us.

Does this make them "bad people"? No. Some of them really, are truly bad people who hate for the sake of hating and who pick on minorities simply because they can, but the truth is, those people are the real minority. Most of the people making the comments are dreadfully ill-informed and have been taught that we are 'freaks' and 'perverts' their entire lives. They have lived around hateful people and soaked it all in. They don't hate us because of who they are or we are, they hate us because they do not understand us. These people are ignorant of what it means to be transgender. Things that you and I see as 'the basics' are completely foreign and inconceivable to them. They have not been exposed to the vast amounts of information that we transgender have had to learn simply to survive. If we want to be angry, we should be angry at the fact that such ignorance exists, instead of at the ignorant people. As Gandhi said, "hate the sin, love the sinner". Let us not fight or argue with the masses, but instead work to educate them.

"Men feel that cruelty to the poor is a kind of cruelty to animals. They never feel that it is an injustice to equals; nay it is treachery to comrades." - Gilbert Keith Chesterton

If someone knew what it is that we go through, how we feel and how we perceive the world- everything that makes us unique- do you think that they would despise us, or treasure us as equal and important human beings? If they truly knew and did their best to understand, would they still think of us as "perverts" and "freaks"? For those that back up their hate with their religious convictions: if they truly knew about us, do you think that it would still seem logical to them for their God- in whatever form he/she/zhe/it (if it is a law, principle or object) may take- to hate us as they currently believe? If these people saw us for who we are, not for how the media portrays us or from their peers' descriptions of hideous creatures with horns and some twisted agenda, then perhaps maybe they would realize that we, like them, are human beings. Nothing more. Nothing less.

"You must be the change you want to see in the world." - Mahatma Gandhi

"Always do right. This will gratify some people and astonish the rest." - Mark Twain

We are but a small minority but we are still very powerful. A single person has the potential to change a community. A community has the potential to change the world. People have fought for equality ever since more than one human being walked the earth at the same time. Countless lives have been lost. Countless hearts and dreams have been broken and shattered. So much blood has been spilt in this seemingly endless war that it is amazing that the Earth can still flourish with trees and greenery instead of turning into nothing more than a big red rock. Let's turn a new leaf while there is still a leaf to turn- let's put down our swords and spears, wash off our war paint, and extend our arms outward to embrace our enemies instead of challenging them. History shows us that war and bitterness will get us nowhere, so to all those who feel hurt, discouraged and angry at your persecutors: please, don't return their hate with your own. Offer them yourself in your entirety. Give them your hand and lead them into the archive of information that we ourselves live in. Open their eyes and teach them about us, and with time your worst enemies may become your closest allies. Many will continue to condemn you and to despise all of us, but don't let that discourage you. Every tiny change that we make results in a chain reaction. Progress is progress, and though it may take awhile, it won't be long before we see the fruits of our efforts. Especially if we all work together to enlighten the world of who we are.

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it." - George Santayana

"Human history becomes more and more a race between education and catastrophe." - H.G. Wells

If any of this post strikes your fancy and remains in your heart, simply remember this: If we are going to make a difference, then we must befriend those who would call themselves our enemies so that we may educate them as to who we are. We will always be plagued by injustice and discrimination if the people remain ignorant of ourselves and of our plight. Fighting has never worked before, and it isn't working for them now- so why should it work for us?

"We must learn to live together as brothers or perish together as fools," - Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.

愛 Eth