inner transphobic intrusive thoughts and how to deal w it?

[Orvo]

So when I first even thought I could be trans, I had a terrible period of time where I kept having thoughts like "do not rush this" and "what if it isn't true and you're lying". And it was Bad. But I managed to get through that and feel like nothing is wrong and I'm pretty happy as myself. However, it was the start of the pandemic, I was stuck at home, not going anywhere and having to introduce myself as my passport name and gender.

 

Now it's all back and worse than ever. I suddenly realise that used to be much more open-minded, completely okay and welcoming of people's Selves, but now I look at other trans people and something in me thinks "this isn't okay" and other thoughts that are straight up transphobic, like "this is actually a-" and whatever gender a character or a person was assigned at birth. I know it's not nice and I don't want to have those thoughts, which at this point manifest in a very similar manner to my other intrusive thoughts (mental health thing, basically unwanted non-conscious thoughts that i can't stop and that make me disstressed). I keep having random intrusive thoughts about people calling me by my deadname or gender and it makes me furious, yet here I am. I feel guilty and like I don't acutally belong with my own people now, but in my head I know that it isn't how I feel or what I want in this world.

 

I feel like trying to explain myself to my mom made it significantly worse too, bc she doesn't believe me and tries to low-key infantilisingly push me into being "cis again", and that messes me up so much. I keep trying to share my thoughts with her and that only ends in her insisting she doesn't get and cannot accept the concept (of being trans), but loves Me anyway. Maybe that's where it's coming from? I live and grew up in a very transphobic place so yeah

 

Does anyone have the same "trans but transphobic" experience? I wanted to share and ask, if anyone has a similar experience and is comfortable sharing it, how do others deal with this problem? I'm not exactly asking for an advice, it's more of a "but if you say what to do, out loud, i won't stop you" situation. I want to know how others face this and not feel like I don't belong with other trans people just because this is something I'm struggling with.

 

I find great comfort in looking at other people's content (trans-related) and my own art and characters that are trans, and expressing my feelings throught them, but when it comes to real people and myself this stuff happens. Help..?

[Jackie C.]

I think a lot of us have or had internalized transphobia. Especially us older gals. Society was (and in a lot of places is) hard and unforgiving for us. You can't help but internalize some of it.

 

As for the intrusive thoughts... well, those suck but you don't have to accept them. My practice is to treat them like a six-year-old who is spouting nonsense. Let it pass through you without acknowledging it. You tell yourself, "OK," and move on. You don't accept the thought, you just set it aside.

 

For me, the path to accepting who other people are is entwined with accepting who I am. The more comfortable I am with myself, the more comfortable I am with my trans siblings. They might not express themselves the same way I do, but they're just as valid as I am. I accept myself as a woman, therefore I can accept my fellow trans people as their gender of choice. This journey is about feeling comfortable in your own skin after all, not making OTHER people comfortable with your skin. If they want to present more masc, fem or androgynous... so be it. That's my friend. That's all that matters.

 

Hugs!

[Cyndee]

5 minutes ago, Jackie C. said:

This journey is about feeling comfortable in your own skin after all, not making OTHER people comfortable with your skin.

 

@Jackie C.Great quote above, and so true....

 

Be you, be real....

 

Hugs

 

C

 

 

[Heather Shay]

Ditto on Jackie's comments. You need to feel comfortable with who you are.

[Ticket For Epic]

@Heather Shay

Took the words right out of my mouth!  I can identify with so much of that. 

On 1/20/2022 at 9:02 AM, Orvo said:

"do not rush this" and "what if it isn't true and you're lying".

This!^  I also have this weird... I don't know, guilt... maybe?  or perhaps mourning the loss of allyship or disappointing those I'm an ally to?  I have been an "ally" for a long while and so many members of the community have appreciated my allyship, stating that 'they often forget that true allies exist'.  I have also had more than a couple of Trans men tell me that I have in some ways been a sensitive male role model, a example of healthy masculinity.   I feel like I will be letting people down.  How do you tell a trans man that the "man" they've been looking to as an example of masculinity is in fact, a woman.  Than no, I'm not an ally, only a lost an confused member of the community.    

On 1/20/2022 at 9:02 AM, Orvo said:

but now I look at other trans people and something in me thinks "this isn't okay" and other thoughts that are straight up transphobic, like "this is actually a-" and whatever gender a character or a person was assigned at birth.

Oddly, for me,, this doesn't happenbwith trans men and this never...okay...rarely happened in regards to trans women before but now that I've acknowledged what is going on inside? 

I've really never had a hard time seeing past secondary characteristics to the woman inside.  But recently it's been a little different and I feel so much shame about it!  Sometimes, just before I see the beautiful, valid and fantastically courageous woman before me, and just for a moment, I will see a freak.  It's fleeting but it's there.  and then I find myself thinking.  Well, if this is my reaction, being who and what I am, knowing what I know, and beliveing what I do.  How can I expect the world to SEE me to not see just a man in a dress.   

 

So yeah, you are not alone in this.  Thanks you for sharing.  I would never would have the courage to "vocalize" these, frankly,, abhorrent thoughts.  Having read your experience helps me to think that I may not be the moral monster my unprompted thoughts might suggest. 

[Ticket For Epic]

@Heather ShaySorry, I tagged the wrong person!  I don't know how but I did!  SMH. I'm going to go find a rock to crawl under now

[Zelaire]

I'll second the seconding of what Jackie said. And I like this strategy: "My practice is to treat them like a six-year-old who is spouting nonsense. Let it pass through you without acknowledging it. " It sounds a bit like the practice of letting thoughts pass through you as you meditate. I have to imagine we all have these intrusive thoughts to some degree, and it's not just transphobic thoughts (just that for some of us here those ring out especially loudly). All kinds of thoughts fly through a brain on an average day--I tend to think the key is which ones you choose to act on and which ones you tell to "keep on moving along." We're all a product of the big jumbled bucket of people, experiences and ideas that surrounded us our whole lives, and I guess part of being human is learning to deal with the hodge-podge in our heads (whether we're transgender or anything else). 

[Ticket For Epic]

So true!  It is not our thoughts but actions which are judged.  We can't control unwelcome thoughts but we can chose which to give weight.  

 

Thanks, so easy to forget!

[Jackie C.]

17 hours ago, Zelaire said:

And I like this strategy: "My practice is to treat them like a six-year-old who is spouting nonsense. Let it pass through you without acknowledging it. " It sounds a bit like the practice of letting thoughts pass through you as you meditate.

 

Like 80% of witchcraft is spicy psychology. I find my practice very grounding. It improves my focus and helps guide me to better decisions. The aesthetic is just gravy.

 

Hugs!

[Zelaire]

I wish there was a "like" button here. There are at least two t-shirt worthy quotes in that post, Jackie

[Saoirse 2]

On 1/20/2022 at 9:10 AM, Jackie C. said:

 

For me, the path to accepting who other people are is entwined with accepting who I am. The more comfortable I am with myself, the more comfortable I am with my trans siblings 

YES! I started out thinking I couldn't have internalized transphobia, since that would mean I directed those feelings at myself.

 

Of course that's nonsense. Of course I can direct negative feelings, fear, and even hatred at myself. My goal is to stop that.

 

And as you note, the more I accept myself, the more open I am to accepting others.

 

Simple in concept, but I life of bad habits yet to unravel!

[Orvo]

@Ticket For Epicit's nice to know i'm not alone as well. Obviously very sad that you have these moments too. But if *i* am not a terrible person for having these thoughts, then neither are you.

 

I have these moments as well, when one moment i look at people on the internet happily discussing transition and gender affirmation, and i feel like it's happened to Me, and it makes me so happy, but the next moment i can't get myself to speak in a masculine (or other) way in a converstion with my friends who are accepting, because i feel like it's not allowed and weird. I have to mask myself while with my relatives, but it creates a shell i can't break when i'm with friends, even though in my spare time i dream of days when i will physically transition, and it makes me happy. So it's not just you.

 

I have been giving it more thought and here's what I came up with. Thing is, it all changes with time and inner toughts, like I read a post on types of dysphoria and how sometimes they manifest in a different order and someone who only ever had social dysphoria can develop physical one after accepting that they are trans. So i think these thoughts are somewhat the same. For me it's internalized Whatever and a little bit of dysphoria, which is clearly more social than anything, as i've noticed that it got worse after trying to speak to my mother who doesn't accept that i am not who she's used to seeing me as.

My native language is also very gendered, which brings another layer of pain to being nonbinary and not wanting to settle for "the opposite" pronouns, even though i use it in personal speech, if it makes sense. Which only fuels the whole thing, as nothing fits.

 

I hope both you and i can find peace of mind.

[Vidanjali]

Hi @Orvo . I think there's only so much one can process at any given moment so it makes sense that as one digs more deeply into the question "who am I?" unexpected things come up. It can fool you into believing that your mind is just a chaotic mess and that you're your own worst enemy. But, it's only natural. Just because you're processing internalized phobia doesn't mean you're a hateful person or invalid. It just means you have some layers to sort through before you can get a clearer glance at what shines in you. 

 

Coincidently, I was thinking about Russia recently. I spent a month in St. Petersburg years ago and it made a deep impression on me. It occurred to me that gender normative appearance/behavior is quite entrenched in Russian culture, and I wondered what it is like for trans folks there. I remember when I learned that the Russian language has neuter gender, that I experienced a surge of delight at the idea. Interestingly, this was many years before I came to understand I'm nonbinary. And, the surge was short-lived after my professor explained that very few nouns are neuter, and the neuter gender is very rarely used. Still, it fascinated me that some Russian things were neither masculine nor feminine!