Mississippi Gov Vows to Sign Bill Outlawing Trans Health Care for <18 Y.O.

[Carolyn Marie]

https://www.yahoo.com/now/mississippi-senate-passes-limit-transgender-192442906.html

 

 

Carolyn Marie

[Charlize]

The south has fallen again to new lows.  The claim of sterilization is absurd.  Slowing puberty so a person can decide is far from abuse but then again those folks have not dealt with the additional challenges faced later when puberty is finished.

 

Hugs,

 

Charlize

[Ivy]

It continues…

[Marcie Jensen]

Frankly, the government AT ALL LEVELS needs to stay out of this. It's a conversation between the child, their parents and doctors. What more needs to be said ?

[Ivy]

53 minutes ago, Marcie Jensen said:

It's a conversation between the child, their parents and doctors.

Exactly.

[VickySGV]

Where the purpose of dad's pornography stash is to get him excited and insist his wife (ideally) have unprotected sex with him specifically for creating a new human life, the idea that some child may not wish to go that pattern of life is unthinkable and not understandable.  The rate of long term regret and de-transition creeps lower and lower with each new study that comes out, but still, the Cis politicians consider their condition to be "the way of <deity name> and 'natural law"".  It is ignorance that they consider to be the height of knowledge and expertise.(Dunning / Kruger Effect).  Our feelings and internal workings on gender are so foreign to them that it gives them upset stomachs.  THEY honestly feel they are the saviors of humanity I am afraid. In their minds they are not villains.  

 

It is the conflation of sex and gender, and the idea that sex is ONLY for creating human life, and that sex for non procreative purpose is the greatest evil to their "natural order" that drives them in this. 

[Ivy]

7 hours ago, VickySGV said:

THEY honestly feel they are the saviors of humanity I am afraid. In their minds they are not villains.

Unfortunately I believe this is true.  And when you truly believe you are doing "God's Work" nothing is off the table.    (Look at what was "God's will" in the Old Testament)

[Marcie Jensen]

2 hours ago, Ivy said:

Unfortunately I believe this is true.  And when you truly believe you are doing "God's Work" nothing is off the table. 

Sad but true. There's an old adage about the devil quoting Scripture when it serves his purposes that I think applies. And so does what Jesus said  in Matthew 7:22=23,  "Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you workers of lawlessness!’…" They may think they're doing God's work, but I'm not so sure.

[awkward-yet-sweet]

10 hours ago, VickySGV said:

It is the conflation of sex and gender, and the idea that sex is ONLY for creating human life, and that sex for non procreative purpose is the greatest evil to their "natural order" that drives them in this. 

 

Kind of an aside, but I really wish that the so-called conservatives would look in their own KJV Bibles for teaching about sex and procreation...since it is pretty clear to me that the purpose of daily, barrier-free marital sex is to keep a relationship together, in addition to the obvious reproduction aspect.  Science has actually affirmed Scripture regarding dopamine and oxytocin being useful for marital bonding.  Since these hormones were created with a purpose, you'd think the obvious conclusion is that marital pleasure is part of God's will and natural law.  🙄  I find it frustrating when people want to make laws supposedly based on a book they haven't read. 

 

3 hours ago, Ivy said:

Unfortunately I believe this is true.  And when you truly believe you are doing "God's Work" nothing is off the table.    (Look at what was "God's will" in the Old Testament)

 

I firmly believe in the will of God as expressed in the Old Testament... gory parts and all.  There's definitely a place for warfare in His name.  Even a place for theocracy.  But politicians seem to ignore the idea that the disciples didn't overthrow the Roman Empire by getting elected to the Senate and passing laws.  They undermined the empire from the ground up internally over 300 years and broke it apart.  

 

While the USA was intended to be a nation of faith (primarily Christian faith), it wasn't intended to be governed in the way the conservatives are attempting to do it. 

 

[Carolyn Marie]

45 minutes ago, awkward-yet-sweet said:

While the USA was intended to be a nation of faith (primarily Christian faith), it wasn't intended to be governed in the way the conservatives are attempting to do it. 

 

 

There seems to be quite a few far right ideologues who are convinced that America must be turned into a theocracy, and only for fellow like-minded Christians.  They have been quite outspoken about laws and government following scripture, rather than anthropocracy (laws of man).  It's a bit funny to me that, by theocratic biblical standards,, a great many Republicans would have long ago been stoned to death for violating the Laws of God (in particular TFG).

 

Carolyn Marie

[Marcie Jensen]

6 hours ago, Carolyn Marie said:

 

There seems to be quite a few far right ideologues who are convinced that America must be turned into a theocracy, and only for fellow like-minded Christians.  They have been quite outspoken about laws and government following scripture, rather than anthropocracy (laws of man).  It's a bit funny to me that, by theocratic biblical standards,, a great many Republicans would have long ago been stoned to death for violating the Laws of God (in particular TFG).

ristian theology 

Carolyn Marie

Interesting. I know of no politician--Republican, Democrat or other party--that is calling for a theocracy. If anyone does, please enlighten me with what was actually said, and by what politician. And if they are, they are violating what Jesus said in Matthew 22:21, where He said, "Render unto Caesar that which is Caspar's and unto God that which is God's." In fact, He clearly stated his kingdom was "not of this earth numerous times. Additionally, in Christian theology, there is no place for stoning anyone, as is clearly shown in John 8:18, where Jesus prevents the woman caught in adultery from being stoned. 

 

Now, if the point here is that people are hypocrites or twist Scripture for their own purposes, YES! ABSOLUTELY! Ot, if the point is that self proclaimed messiahs have been a major part of history, the answer is a resounding YES! Hitler, Stalin, Lenin, et al are prime examples. I can even see where Trump could considered in that category. I will even stipulate that this country was founded along Christo-Judaic lines, or principles. But, despite the shrill rhetoric, this country is nowhere close to to being a theocracy, or becoming one. For modern examples of theocracies, look at the governments of Iran or Saudi Arabia.

[KathyLauren]

2 hours ago, Marcie Jensen said:

I know of no politician--Republican, Democrat or other party--that is calling for a theocracy.

 

You are right: elected politicians are not "calling" for it.  Not openly, anyway.  But these evil anti-trans bills that are being introduced in state legislatures are being written not by elected lawmakers but by unelected far-right "think tanks" whose agenda definitely is theocratic.  The conversation is something like, "Here is a draft of some legislation we'd like you to introduce in the legislature.  If you introduce it, we'll back your re-election campaign financially and at the polls."

[Ivy]

23 minutes ago, KathyLauren said:

Not openly, anyway

But there has been talk about "Christian Nationalism."  

[Marcie Jensen]

1 hour ago, KathyLauren said:

 

You are right: elected politicians are not "calling" for it.  Not openly, anyway.  But these evil anti-trans bills that are being introduced in state legislatures are being written not by elected lawmakers but by unelected far-right "think tanks" whose agenda definitely is theocratic.  The conversation is something like, "Here is a draft of some legislation we'd like you to introduce in the legislature.  If you introduce it, we'll back your re-election campaign financially and at the polls."

First, and for the record, I stridently disagree and disapprove of the anti-trans legislation being promulgated in the USA and anywhere. I, too believe it to be evil. I do not believe it to be theocratic in nature, unless you are referring to Sharia. (The Bible, as used by Christians and Jews, makes no mention of transpeople in either Testament.) Thus, I have several questions for you @KathyLauren:

 

Can you prove these unnamed think tanks have a theocratic agenda? (Similar to that of bona fide theocracies such as Saudi Arabia, Iran, Mauritania, Sudan, Afghanistan, Yemen and the Vatican city. These are the only theocracies in the world.)

Can you cite any names of these think tanks?

How do you know the content of the conversations between them and the politicians? 

Here's an article from Christianity Today that demonstrates how Christian Nationalism differs from Christianity and is in fact dangerous to both the church and the nation as a whole:

https://www.christianitytoday.com/ct/2021/february-web-only/what-is-christian-nationalism.html

 

This begs the question, is it Christianity that is offensive, or Christian Nationalism, which are two different things?

 

I'm willing to admit I'm wrong here, but, show me some facts to prove the point. If this can be done, I will joyfully concede, but I doubt that there is any hard evidence that supports this take. And, op-ed pieces aren't hard evidence; they are by definition opinions. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, and I will always support that. But accusing any person, group or political party of something without proof is not only wrong, but only inflames the situation, which is the last thing we need right now.

[awkward-yet-sweet]

@Marcie Jensen I agree that Christianity and Christian Nationalism are two different things.  I have noticed that the calls for theocracy are much more strident from pulpits than from politicians.  Neither source uses the actual word "theocracy" but there are days where I wonder how many people might actually want a Christian version of sharia law. My own community of faith tends toward "lets take over and run the nation" kind of thinking.  

 

The nearly 50 year campaign against abortion was almost entirely led by those who wanted it banned for religious reasons.  

[VickySGV]

Administrator Hat and Flack Jacket on here, but we are going off the topic and getting a bit too personal on demands for personal positions.  Lets cool it down.

 

This link is to the Southern Poverty Law Canter list of 9 Anti LGBTQ Hate organizations.  

 

https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/extremist-files/groups?f[0]=field_ideology%3A181 

 

All of them have at some point drafted the proposed legislation (and provide campaign funding.  Most are related to far right conservatism as practiced by some groups who appropriate the term Christian and who do want to impose their moral law on others.  Whether Theocracy or Christian Nationalism is a debate that has gone on since the Protestant Revolution in the 1500's.  Please each read the information and make your own decision on the fine line of discussion but do not attack a person of idea.

 

Lets get back on the topic which is about a singular and single governor of a single state. 

[awkward-yet-sweet]

Referring to the SPLC?  I think that's just a suspicious partisan group of another variety. 🙄. I'd rather get our information elsewhere, even if what they list is relevant at the moment.

 

Like most issues, this one has more sides than the dice in a fantasy boardgame.