Don't fall for the 'groomer' slur - it's an old trick used to stir hatred of LGBTQ+ people

[Mmindy]

Aoife Gallagher and Tim Squirrell of ISD look at the worrying rise of misinformation and dangerous narratives around people in the LGBTQ+ community.

 

https://www.thejournal.ie/readme/lgbtq-issues-in-ireland-6038700-Apr2023/?utm_source=shortlink

[VickySGV]

A very good analysis and history of the problems there.  Missing from it though is the motivation for the claimants of the child abuse which I have observed to be NOT personal belief that the abuse happens, but the inebriation of seeing the effects of their manipulation materialize in those who the perpetrators have "led to war" as heroes.  

[Mmindy]

@VickySGVI always love your take on these news reports.

 

Thank you,

 

Mindy🐛🏳️‍⚧️🦋

[Ivy]

2 hours ago, VickySGV said:

to be NOT personal belief that the abuse happens,

I think most of the people promoting this realize it's all just bull.  But it does advance their agenda.

[Betty K]

As someone who works with trans children this slur chills me to my bones. It seems calculated to be the most hurtful possible thing anyone could say about me. Worse, it makes me scared to do my job. But not so scared I’m going to stop doing it. 
 

What really galls me is the idea that older trans people are somehow all about “transing” young people, when it has always been the parents of trans kids who have pushed for gender-affirming care for minors. 

[VickySGV]

18 minutes ago, Betty K said:

it has always been the parents of trans kids who have pushed for gender-affirming care for minors. 

 

This is the problem for the H8ers, the "grooming" that is in fact responsible parenting is being done TO the child FROM the parent's ego's, and the accusation is that it is the Parents' desire for the trendy social status of having a Trans Child.  I have several IRL friends who was Intersex children who had infantile external sex organ surgery back in the 50's and 60's to conform the child to what the parents and the doctor felt would be the best direction for the ambiguous genitalia to be reformed.  The theory at the time being that it was the nurture of the child by the parents that would create the desired gender alignment.  I just was reading where that turned into only a <50% success rate, and resulted in gender tragedies over the years.  It is that theory of parental influence that fits in with simplistic science education today, and is being sent in a 180 degree direction from those who used to say "Well done" to the Intersex interventionist, to "Child Abuser" today if the external organs were seemingly healthy and intact with societal norms..   

[Carolyn Marie]

What infuriates me is that many of the "real" groomers have been members of the clergy, from every denomination. And yet, they are never mentioned by the H8rs, even though their misdeeds are in the news almost every day.  I wonder why that is???

 

I'll answer my own question:  it's because those same evil sorts are part of the conservative base, and so are protected by the right wing media and politicians.  They are "respected members of the community" who shall not be distrusted.  Yes, we can allow our children to spend hours each week with those "trusted" men.  But we LGBT people, we are "the other" who can't be trusted to spend one minute with a child, because our mere presence will make them trans, too  (the Horror!).

 

Just to be clear, I know full well that most clergymen are honorable, devoted people who wouldn't hurt a child.  But far too many are the opposite, and often get away with their crimes for years.

 

Carolyn Marie

[awkward-yet-sweet]

From what I understand about the "grooming" issue, the real problem is authority.  Groomers can be of any gender, orientation, or age, but it seems that profession or position is the common ingredient.  Whether that authority comes from the church, the state, a school, or anywhere else...question it.  And I suspect some of the worst groomers are politicians, regardless of party. 

 

 

[VickySGV]

1 hour ago, awkward-yet-sweet said:

From what I understand about the "grooming" issue, the real problem is authority. 

 

Precisely the issue. 

[Betty K]

4 hours ago, VickySGV said:

from those who used to say "Well done" to the Intersex interventionist, to "Child Abuser" today

I have brought up intersex surgery SO many times in arguments about whether or not gender-affirming care for kids (which very rarely entails surgery) is child abuse. But the TERFs have never once taken up that topic. They are not interested in forced surgery on intersex infants, I presume because it is designed to uphold rather than challenge gender norms. It is infuriating. 

[Betty K]

(I should say TERFs and conservatives, but it’s mostly TERFs I have had that argument with. Call me a glutton for punishment.)

[Birdie]

3 hours ago, Betty K said:

gender-affirming care for kids (which very rarely entails surgery) is child abuse

In my case, yes!

No surgery was performed and 2 years of testosterone was given when puberty seemed to be heading the wrong direction. 

 

Had I been given a choice in the matter, I would have chosen surgery and never touched that nasty T. 

In fact, I would have rather had surgery sometime after birth so I would have never known. 

[Betty K]

3 minutes ago, Birdie said:

Had I been given a choice in the matter,

But isn’t that the whole point? It’s not really gender-affirming care of you are not in charge of it yourself. Gender-affirming care means that it affirms your gender, not someone else’s idea of what your gender should be.

 

I’m sorry if that decision was taken out of your hands.

[Betty K]

@Birdie, what I’m trying to say is that I think many intersex surgeries probably are child abuse, because they generally don’t take the child’s wants or needs into account. So I get angry when the people who claim to be concerned about children only target gender-affirming care for trans kids and not intersex surgeries. Gender-affirming care is all about helping trans kids to become who they want to be, not forcing them to be something they are not.

[Birdie]

19 minutes ago, Betty K said:

sorry if that decision was taken out of your hands.

Yes, me too!

[Charlize]

I perhaps what is a different take on grooming.  As the LGBTQ community came out of the closet children who had similar inclinations saw that the was an actual path to accept their feelings rather than hiding in shame and fear.  We are an example of another way of life.  That seems impossible for some to be comfortable with.  

 

Hugs,

 

Charlize

[Ivy]

29 minutes ago, Charlize said:

As the LGBTQ community came out of the closet children who had similar inclinations saw that the was an actual path to accept their feelings rather than hiding in shame and fear.

This.   

If I had been aware of the possibility of being transgender, maybe I would have chosen that path at the time.  IDK.  But it would hardly have been "grooming" would it?  It would have been the awareness of what was really going on with me.  

If giving people access to information is "grooming" then I guess everything is.  It has gotten to the place where the rightwing's obsession with "grooming" has rendered the term a meaningless accusation.

[Charlize]

 

41 minutes ago, Ivy said:

If giving people access to information is "grooming" then I guess everything is

You hit the nail on the head here.  Allowing a false reality whether it is about global warming, racial history or LGBTQ is the speciality of those who scream "woke" whenever someone speaks anything other than the double think reality of the GOP. Seemingly the old arguments of the GOB are not enough to stir up an enthusiastic  base.  

 

Hugs,

 

Charlize