Ohio Gov. DeWine Giveth, and Now Taketh Away

[Ivy]

10 hours ago, awkward-yet-sweet said:

  If anything/anyone has credibility, it ought to be the voting public - and the real crime is that politicians don't seem to listen to the public. 

Maybe, but…

One supposed reason we (in the US) have a "republic" rather than a "democracy" is to prevent "mob rule".  I think it is also to protect unpopular minorities (like trans people).  

I kinda hate to use this example, since it is so overused, but if the majority of Germans were antisemitic, did that justify the Holocaust?

[awkward-yet-sweet]

2 hours ago, Ivy said:

Maybe, but…

One supposed reason we (in the US) have a "republic" rather than a "democracy" is to prevent "mob rule".  I think it is also to protect unpopular minorities (like trans people).  

I kinda hate to use this example, since it is so overused, but if the majority of Germans were antisemitic, did that justify the Holocaust?

Definitely a point.  The purpose of a republic is to hamper the overuse of government. 

 

Interestingly,  Icky Old Adolf did not have majority support.  But he got power anyway, and his initial efforts were aimed at getting rid of the Weimar Republic and effective representation.  WW2 and the Holocaust likely weren't the will of the majority.  

 

I believe that if there's a parallel between the 30s/40s in Germany and the situation for us now, its that the hate is coming from a minority of people who are very loud, and a minority of others in loud opposition.  The struggle will be to convince a silent majority to speak up.  

[Ivy]

35 minutes ago, awkward-yet-sweet said:

Icky Old Adolf did not have majority support.

True.  But the [unpleasant political party] did not have a corner on antisemitism.

[awkward-yet-sweet]

11 hours ago, Ivy said:

True.  But the [unpleasant political party] did not have a corner on antisemitism.

 

Not to get too far off into the weeds with German history, but I wonder how far we can generalize.  Hard to know now if the majority of the population bought into the hatred.  For sure there were members of the NSDAP who didn't buy into it, but went along because they thought their own goals would be met. 

 

In the USA today, does the majority buy into the hatred?  I really, really doubt it.  And there's plenty of conservative/Republican voters who certainly don't.  And there's plenty of Republican Party members who don't.  But for now the upper leadership is doing this, and so everybody else seems to be going along.  For me, it mirrors the biggest aspect of the crimes of WW2 - people who know something is wrong, but say nothing out of laziness or timidity. 

[KatieSC]

The problem that we are facing is that state by state, we are being legislated against, and these super majorities are making our lives difficult. The average person likely has too much going on to drill down on a small minority like us. Nonetheless, we have become a focused target, and without others coming to our acceptance, it will be much rockier for a while. By the same measure, there have been some things occurring around the country that have eroded the support we had for a while. There are some things that perhaps could be done differently in order to gain more support. Right now we have a lot of them or us mentality forcing people into camps. Unfortunately, we do not have a large swath of folks who are supporting us. 

 

Eventually, things will calm down, but there is likely to be some carnage in the interim. Yeah, there are a great number of parallels in history, and all too often folks easily forget, then repeat it all anyway.

[KathyLauren]

8 hours ago, awkward-yet-sweet said:

people who know something is wrong, but say nothing out of laziness or timidity. 

 

I have to agree with you there, AYS!

[emeraldmountain2]

9 hours ago, awkward-yet-sweet said:

n the USA today, does the majority buy into the hatred?  I really, really doubt it.  And there's plenty of conservative/Republican voters who certainly don't.  And there's plenty of Republican Party members who don't.  But for now the upper leadership is doing this, and so everybody else seems to be going along.  For me, it mirrors the biggest aspect of the crimes of WW2 - people who know something is wrong, but say nothing out of laziness or timidity. 

Yes. What we have here in the US is "minority rule," which also occurred in apartheid South Africa.

[Ivy]

9 hours ago, awkward-yet-sweet said:

In the USA today, does the majority buy into the hatred? 

Hopefully not.  But I think they are kinda indifferent, which in some ways is worse.

 

9 hours ago, awkward-yet-sweet said:

people who know something is wrong, but say nothing out of laziness or timidity. 

And this too.

It's that "it's not my problem" mentality.