Gender Dysphoria, But Not Trans?

[emeraldmountain2]

Can one have gender dysphoria, but not be transgender?

[VickySGV]

Yes, you can have a discomfort and dislike for your assigned gender and never act on resolving it.  It is the resolution action and intention that makes you Trans.  That is why we highly recommend getting a Gender Therapist to see how to resolve the Dysphoria in a way that is right for you which may be to do nothing more than the therapy.

[emeraldmountain2]

Thanks @VickySGV

[AllieJ]

5 hours ago, VickySGV said:

Yes, you can have a discomfort and dislike for your assigned gender and never act on resolving it.  It is the resolution action and intention that makes you Trans.  That is why we highly recommend getting a Gender Therapist to see how to resolve the Dysphoria in a way that is right for you which may be to do nothing more than the therapy.

 

I thought that 'Transgender' was the umbrella term to describe all who are gender non conforming, even drag artists? People who seek medical treatment had another trans term that seems to be disliked in some circles. https://www.apa.org/topics/lgbtq/transgender-people-gender-identity-gender-expression

We really need to standardise these terms to reduce the confusion among our own community, let alone the broader community!

 

By the APA definition above @Emealdmountain2, if you have Gender dysphoria you are gender non conforming and fall under the 'Transgender' Umbrella!

 

I would really like to dump the term Transgender as it is misleading. Trans means to move from one to another, but most gender diverse people don't actively change, and it is accepted that we are born with our gender identity hard wired into us, and it can't be changed, so we certainly can't 'Transgender' to another identity!! I think this misunderstanding is a large part of why our community is misunderstood by society.

 

Hugs,

 

Allie

[emeraldmountain2]

Thanks for your reply @AllieJ!

 

8 minutes ago, AllieJ said:

I would really like to dump the term Transgender as it is misleading.

What term do you think would be better?

[AllieJ]

39 minutes ago, emeraldmountain2 said:

Thanks for your reply @AllieJ!

 

What term do you think would be better?

 

Gender Diverse as an umbrella term, as it doesn't exclude anyone and embraces diversity. For those of us who are Transitioning our Sex, the old  term Tanssexual  still seems appropriate . The current term is an oxymoron and I believe damages our community.

 

Hugs,

 

Allie

[emeraldmountain2]

I also think transsexual is a fitting term for people who medically transition. It's unfortunate the term has become stigmatized. Gender diverse is good, too.

[Betty K]

1 hour ago, AllieJ said:

I thought that 'Transgender' was the umbrella term to describe all who are gender non conforming, even drag artists?

Um no, it’s about gender identity. If your gender identity doesn’t align with your sex assigned at north, you’re trans. This may or may not apply to drag artists; that depends on the individuals.

[AllieJ]

20 minutes ago, Betty K said:

Um no, it’s about gender identity. If your gender identity doesn’t align with your sex assigned at north, you’re trans. This may or may not apply to drag artists; that depends on the individuals.

 

See, this is the problem. Everybody has a different take on what the term Transgender means. It's a nonsense term which confuses and creates division, and the sooner it is abandoned the better off we will all be!

 

Hugs,

 

Allie

[KathyLauren]

29 minutes ago, Betty K said:

it’s about gender identity. If your gender identity doesn’t align with your sex assigned at north, you’re trans. This may or may not apply to drag artists; that depends on the individuals.

 

I am pretty sure that this is the "official" definition, used by most professionals in the field.  Certainly, it is the one I use. 

 

Although a few drag queens are transgender, by this definition, most are not.  Gender nonconforming is a looser term and includes many people who are not transgender.  It might not include all transgender people.  For example, I am pretty gender conforming relative to my gender identity.

[emeraldmountain2]

10 minutes ago, KathyLauren said:

For example, I am pretty gender conforming relative to my gender identity.

Very good point.

[AllieJ]

6 minutes ago, KathyLauren said:

 

I am pretty sure that this is the "official" definition, used by most professionals in the field.  Certainly, it is the one I use. 

 

Although a few drag queens are transgender, by this definition, most are not.  Gender nonconforming is a looser term and includes many people who are not transgender.  It might not include all transgender people.  For example, I am pretty gender conforming relative to my gender identity.

 

But the 'official' definition is different to the APA description I posted in the link above..... and the APA has long been held as the 'authority' in this area. We need robust terms which have universal understanding. 

 

Hugs,

 

Allie

[VickySGV]

And we are up against another problem here as well.  What definition of either term or any term means in the mind of the person asking the question, and how far off from that definition (which we really do not know) is the definition in the mind of the responding person??  In the 14 years I have been on the site here, we do have a rule of thumb that if you are questioning your gender, you are not Cis-gender.  What you wish to take as a definition and identity of who and what you are is up to you and I will honor it without more than just a shoulder shrug followed by a smile of welcome. 

 

it is a little like the 12 step groups that have saved my bottom side, where the term Alcoholic is not used about a person until they make certain basic decisions about themselves and stated those decisions to the group. Then and only then can they take Alcoholic for themselves as a description of where they are and where they wish to go with it, hopefully they wish to go forward with healing.

 

My first statement up above described conditions that a Gender Dysphoric person would encounter and validated those items.  While I have no problem with the idea of an Umbrella Title, it creates a two-fold question;, is it raining or too sunny in the person's life, and does the person wish to stay dry or sun-burn free?    Like my point above, with the help of a Therapist, the person can accept whatever title they wish and go on to make the best of their life.

[emeraldmountain2]

Great conversation about terminology.

 

Going back to the original question, does anyone have any other thoughts as to whether or not it is possible to have gender dysphoria, but not be trans?

[VickySGV]

2 minutes ago, emeraldmountain2 said:

Going back to the original question, does anyone have any other thoughts as to whether or not it is possible to have gender dysphoria, but not be trans?

That was in my first response to your question here.

[emeraldmountain2]

Just now, VickySGV said:

3 minutes ago, emeraldmountain2 said:

 

That was in my first response to your question here.

Yes, thank you, I read it. Was wondering other peoples' thoughts.

[KathyLauren]

55 minutes ago, emeraldmountain2 said:

Going back to the original question, does anyone have any other thoughts as to whether or not it is possible to have gender dysphoria, but not be trans?

 

Gender dysphoria means that you feel something unsatisfactory about your gender "something".  About your gender role, perhaps?  Or maybe about the gender identity you were assigned at birth?  Obviously, the question is a bit fluid.  We need a common understanding of what you mean not only by the word "transgender" but also the word "dysphoria".  With at least two degrees of freedom in the question (and there are no doubt potentially others), there is more room for misunderstanding than for clear understanding.

 

When I hear "gender dysphoria", what it means to me is that they are unhappy with the gender aspect of their social role, or their body, or their self-image.  All of which are manifestations of gender identity.  "I have given my thoughts on the term transgender" above. 

 

Given the way I understand the two terms, I can't see any way that they can be separated.  If you have gender dysphoria, you are transgender, and if you are transgender, you have gender dysphoria.  Bear in mind, that's just how I understand the terms.  This thread is evidence that there are other ways to understand them.

[Betty K]

1 hour ago, emeraldmountain2 said:

Going back to the original question, does anyone have any other thoughts as to whether or not it is possible to have gender dysphoria, but not be trans?

I agree with what @VickySGV said w/r/t alcoholism: the person in question needs to identify as transgender before anyone else should be telling them they are transgender. Maybe in theory you could say that they are transgender regardless of whatever they believe about themselves, but imo that would be a moot point because no-one should ever dictate someone else’s gender identity to them. Following that line, if the person in question suffers gender dysphoria but does not identify as transgender, they are not transgender.

 

1 hour ago, KathyLauren said:

For example, I am pretty gender conforming relative to my gender identity.

Exactly, and this is why most young trans people I know do not recognise the validity of the term “gender nonconforming”. Increasingly, in the circles I move in, it is seen as an outdated and inaccurate term. 
 

1 hour ago, AllieJ said:

But the 'official' definition is different to the APA description I posted in the link above..... and the APA has long been held as the 'authority' in this area. We need robust terms which have universal understanding. 

I would say that the APA needs to get with the times.

 

I also think, w/r/t finding new terms, good luck. Language generally evolves in a way that is beyond any one group’s control. I agree transgender is not a very helpful definition in some ways, since it doesn’t tell us much. But that’s why we have more specific terms. I’m still trying to get cis folks to understand what “transfeminine” means; I don’t really want to have to teach them some other word as well. Where we probably agree is that I think “transgender” is pretty much useless as a diagnosis.

[Betty K]

@AllieJ: Also, w/r/t the APA being the so-called authority on what is or is not transgender, I would like to see a move towards trans people defining what trans identity is, not psychologists. Since the recognised diagnosis is now gender dysphoria, I don’t see the need for trans identity as a whole to be mandated by the medical profession. “Transgender” now describes an identity group, like L, G, B and Q. Do psychologists get to decide who is L, G, B, or Q? 

[emeraldmountain2]

Thanks everyone.

 

For my original question, I was thinking of "transgender" and "gender dysphoria" in regards to the most common understanding of these terms, as well as the APA's criteria for diagnosing gender dysphoria. However, I appreciate all the nuance, which is why I initially posed a simply-worded question in order to spark conversation.

[Betty K]

11 minutes ago, emeraldmountain2 said:

Thanks everyone.

 

For my original question, I was thinking of "transgender" and "gender dysphoria" in regards to the most common understanding of these terms, as well as the APA's criteria for diagnosing gender dysphoria. However, I appreciate all the nuance, which is why I initially posed a simply-worded question in order to spark conversation.

Can I ask why the question is important to you? Maybe if we knew why you were asking the question we could give you more useful answers.

[Kasumi63]

Interesting discussion. Another important point, I think, and I apologize if someone else already said this, is that dysphoria often lessens or completely disappears after transition or gender confirming care. I can honestly say I rarely feel dysphoria any more.

[Betty K]

3 hours ago, emeraldmountain2 said:

I also think transsexual is a fitting term for people who medically transition. It's unfortunate the term has become stigmatized. Gender diverse is good, too.

Oh, I forgot to say, I think both Susan Stryker and Julia Serrano still identify as transsexual, so you’re in good company there. The problem is with some of the term’s biggest cheerleaders, who can have a fairly toxic attitude towards others in the trans community. But I don’t see why the term can’t be reclaimed from those folks.

[MaeBe]

I echo the question regarding why the question is being asked. It's obvious there is a broad interpretation of the question at its most basic level, but understanding the source of the quandary may align people's thoughts. That said, I agree that only the person can assign themselves the label of trans regardless of the indicators they present to others. Psychologically some may differ to that sentiment, but that would be a diagnosis and not a lived identity.

[awkward-yet-sweet]

I would say YES.  One can be uncomfortable with one's gender without being transgender.  Perhaps that's a bit more narrow than the APA definition, but its why I don't exclusively use "transgender" as a description of myself or my gender issues.  Its one possibility, the accuracy of which is questionable. 

 

To me, being transgender incorporates the idea of being sure of one's starting point and one's ending point.  For example, starting life AFAB and moving towards being a man, in order to align one's physical being with the rest of oneself.  It also incorporates a certain amount of expectation of eventual success at that process. 

 

I'm intersex.  AFAB, but not sure what physical pattern my body was supposed to conform to.  Since the pattern of my body is messed up, what was my starting point?  And since my anatomy (as well as faith and personal preference) prevents me from doing significant changes to my body, what exactly is my ending point?  Does simply altering my dress, self-concept, and a few other things make me count as transgender?  I'm not sure.  Since beyond a few issues with my intersex anatomy I don't really need the services of doctors, how much of my experience is relevant to others?  Where do I even belong under the LGBTQ+ rainbow?