Gender Dysphoria, But Not Trans?

[Betty K]

2 hours ago, Birdie said:

Then what you described happened at home!

 

Actually, your story sounds familiar to me too, Birdie. I always remembered very little about my childhood -- only a few scattered images until I was about age 12 -- but recently I realised that, at the same time as my family moved from Tasmania to South Australia when I was aged six, my mother went into full-time work and my father became my primary carer. In Tasmania, I'd gone to a hippy school in the mountains, and no-one seemed to care when I grew my hair long. Dad didn't care either, since he was a bit of a hippy himself and had long hair too. But when we moved to the suburbs, suddenly all that changed. The kids mocked me for my gender presentation and I had to cut my hair. As to my father, I doubt he was as brutal in his gender policing as yours was, but he was violent, a drinker, a drug user, and clearly expected me to deal with bullies the way he would have dealt with them, with his fists. He was also -- and I have known this for as long as I can remember -- a misogynist. So it was pretty clear that to earn his respect I could not be openly feminine.

 

Thank you for sharing your story, Birdie. I am only slowly piecing together mine.

[Betty K]

19 minutes ago, KatieSC said:

While I think that the idea of dysphoria vs euphoria is an interesting discussion, how does it translate to the real world. Most folks do not seek medical care or psychiatric care when things are rosy.

 

Actually I'm not so sure about this. When I think of myself at age 11, for example, when I would probably have socially transitioned if the thought hadn't been so terrifying to me, I don't see how even more suffering could have better motivated me. Had I been socially accepted, I could have lived as a girl for a year or two and then confidently progressed to blockers and hormones with, maybe, no greater suffering than the average teenager. Who knows, maybe I would have done it all even earlier had I been socially accepted, and -- presuming no-one had ever ritually taunted or abused me for gender identity -- maybe I would never have experienced gender dysphoria at all. Or if I did, maybe it would have been vastly outweighed by gender euphoria.

 

But obviously, none of that happened. Instead, at age 11 I decided I could never tell anyone my secret (which I didn't fully understand anyway) and went in the closet for almost 30 years. At age 39, I emerged to go out nightclubbing in girl mode once a week for six months before the thought of transitioning scared me back in the closet. At age 47, on the verge of suicide, a voice suddenly came to me, "But if I die now I'll never know what it's like to live as a woman." After that, I gradually let euphoria into my life again, and it lit the way for me. I was following a light, not just fleeing darkness. It felt so good and right to just let go, at last, and be feminine. Yes, there was still dysphoria, but if that were all there was I honestly don't know if I'd still be alive.

[Davie]

1 hour ago, Betty K said:

While I think that the idea of dysphoria vs euphoria is an interesting discussion, how does it translate to the real world. Most folks do not seek medical care or psychiatric care when things are rosy.

I found my therapist through Fenway Health that is a known supporter of trans mental health. There was no such requirement before therapy could begin. I just was honest about my issues and proceeded to get help—my therapist seemed beyond any prejudgement that way. I give therapists credit—they treat people, not issues in the news. The story of my issues is far too specific to be easily stereotyped. Good mental health requires trust and understanding. She has that.

[Vidanjali]

On 1/15/2024 at 6:34 AM, KatieSC said:

While I think that the idea of dysphoria vs euphoria is an interesting discussion, how does it translate to the real world. Most folks do not seek medical care or psychiatric care when things are rosy.

 

That well may be, although there are contexts within which folks currently seek physical or mental healthcare for support during various transitions such as career change, becoming a parent, during the development of a new romantic relationship, aging, etc. Others seek care for maintenance and performance such as athletes. Preventive and wellness care is encouraged and even rewarded by some employers: annual checkup, cancer screenings, dental cleaning, etc. Some employers also offer a benefit of counseling or life coaching to assist employees in any aspect of their life. Imagine if a paradigm were developed wherein a support team of physical and mental health practitioners, even spiritual advisors when appropriate, were there to support trans individuals who were not necessarily in a state of distress. Imagine seeing a pamphlet at a doctor's office "Are you questioning your gender? We can help!" or "So, you've decided to transition. What's next?" or "Who are you? Let's talk about it." Of course this is a bit of a fantasy at present. So, how indeed does it translate to the real world? Evidently there are trans healthcare clinicians that are doing the work to push the needle in the direction of humane, compassionate support. Change is slow, but it can happen.

 

On 1/15/2024 at 6:34 AM, KatieSC said:

The other aspect of gender transition and combating the dysphoria that we face is that transition does not magically make everything better. While one may feel that boost in finally being on the pathway they want to make them whole, the truth is that most of us face some real struggles in beginning transition, and during transition. This can add additional stress to all of the other negative things going on. We may still have many of the same stressors throughout and after successful transition.

 

Quite so. That being the case, trans healthcare professionals must be prepared to engage holistically with trans patients longitudinally so as to support them physically, emotionally, and even spiritually if the client is amenable. 

 

On 1/15/2024 at 6:34 AM, KatieSC said:

I think we could all use some euphoria!

 

Hear hear!

 

On 1/15/2024 at 8:53 AM, Davie said:

I found my therapist through Fenway Health that is a known supporter of trans mental health. There was no such requirement before therapy could begin. I just was honest about my issues and proceeded to get help—my therapist seemed beyond any prejudgement that way. I give therapists credit—they treat people, not issues in the news. The story of my issues is far too specific to be easily stereotyped. Good mental health requires trust and understanding. She has that.

 

Coincidentally, the research in the article we've been discussing was affiliated with Fenway.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0165178123004912

[Davie]

23 minutes ago, Vidanjali said:

Coincidentally, the research in the article we've been discussing was affiliated with Fenway.

Thanks @VidanjaliGood information to study. Didn't know there was so much information on this subject.

[MaeBe]

On 1/15/2024 at 5:34 AM, KatieSC said:

While I think that the idea of dysphoria vs euphoria is an interesting discussion, how does it translate to the real world. Most folks do not seek medical care or psychiatric care when things are rosy.

I specifically did. My journey started with me feeling joy doing things associated with the feminine. As things built up, I felt I needed to talk with someone who might be able to help me understand what was going on. It was so out of line with my life. During the start of my journey and counseling I swore I wasn't dysphoric, mostly because I didn't have the signs I thought were typical: depression, anxiety, etc. I thought they had to be big and I didn't have any "big" reactions. The more I leaned into the feminine, I started to notice I did have dysphoria. It was far from the soul-crushing kind I know many suffer from. This, from time to time, fuels my self-doubt.

 

I don't think that there needs to be a paradigm shift in the way that psychology works with trans people, but what if the DSM (or other standard) was updated to include euphoric indicators instead of only contra-indicators. What if there was "person feels joy when participating in behaviors typical of another gender" was in there along with "A strong desire to be rid of one’s primary and/or secondary sex characteristics". Language is key, even though some of the "indicators" have room for interpretation to include gender euphoria, they are still harsh and questioning such as: "A strong conviction that one has the typical feelings and reactions of the other gender (or some alternative gender different from one’s assigned gender)".

 

You can feel euphoric about having girl talk, while being dolled up, over tea while not having a "strong conviction".

[Betty K]

On 1/15/2024 at 11:53 PM, Davie said:

There was no such requirement before therapy could begin.

The way I accessed care was a bit less smooth, but it needn’t have been. I told my GP I had realised I was trans and was considering transition. She had known me for eight years and trusted my self-assessment immediately, and referred me to a sexual-health specialist at a prominent lgbtqia+ clinic. Unfortunately that so-called specialist, after interrogating me with about 15-20 minutes worth of invasive and largely irrelevant questions, told me I wasn’t suffering “real gender identity disorder” because I did not have enough dysphoria. (I have always felt this happened at least partly because I was not presenting femininely enough.) Only once I broke down crying did she grudgingly refer me to a psychologist. But, unknown to me, I had not needed that specialist with her antiquated views anyway. When I next spoke to my doctor I asked if she could prescribe HRT and she said yes, and when I was ready to proceed I did so with her support. Obviously, with a bit of research, she could have referred me to the psychologist as well. 
 

 

[awkward-yet-sweet]

12 hours ago, Vidanjali said:

Imagine seeing a pamphlet at a doctor's office "Are you questioning your gender? We can help!" or "So, you've decided to transition. What's next?" or "Who are you? Let's talk about it." Of course this is a bit of a fantasy at present. So, how indeed does it translate to the real world? Evidently there are trans healthcare clinicians that are doing the work to push the needle in the direction of humane, compassionate support. Change is slow, but it can happen.

 

While not that overt, that was relatively my experience.  I knew I was different, and I knew my anatomy was different.  I already kind of identified as genderfluid, so I looked online and found this forum.  Later on, a really basic internet search for LGBTQ+ friendly physicians found me the doctor I went to.  I had to go to a much bigger city, but it was within easy driving distance.  The testing and scans I went through were a bit intense, but mostly due to my unique anatomy and making sure nothing was actually wrong with me.  Once that was over, the doctor gave me options for basically everything I wanted (well, within the boundaries of safety and what was physically possible for me.)  Had a prescription that day, and only had to get a checkup later on to keep it going.  While I didn't choose HRT or surgical options, I didn't get the feeling that the process to get those things would have been too awful. 

 

I'm not sure how the coming years will change that experience, but this wasn't even in a liberal state.  I hope they don't implement mental health or therapy requirements, because that seems to be the bottleneck.  I have wanted a therapist to talk to, and I have yet to meet one who I get along with.  The ones I've met have been patronizing, unaccepting of my life and family, or just plain cold.  I suppose if it really became a problem, my husband could quickly grab a master's degree in counseling and then I'd probably be covered. 

[Mirrabooka]

On 1/15/2024 at 9:50 AM, Betty K said:

I have also heard of trans folk who only experience gender euphoria, but I have not met any of them. 

 

On 1/15/2024 at 10:01 AM, Vidanjali said:

I recall seeing at least a couple folks who have posted intros here who reported only positive experience being trans.

 

On 1/15/2024 at 10:34 PM, KatieSC said:

While I think that the idea of dysphoria vs euphoria is an interesting discussion, how does it translate to the real world. Most folks do not seek medical care or psychiatric care when things are rosy.

 

Time for me to belatedly contribute to this thread. As someone who is not transitioning, I do so in an attempt to pimp myself as a reference point for y'all.

 

@Betty K, I consider myself as somewhere on the trans spectrum/rainbow, but I am not transitioning. Well, no more than I already have. I am not trying to pass, I am not interested in wearing a dress, I am not considering HRT or GRS and I am not even seeking a feminine name. I don't need to. I'm growing my hair and nails, but I am not growing my femininity more than what it presently is. That said, I think about gender constantly, and everything that I do that is not quintessentially or stereotypically masculine is due to my inner woman, who I am head-over-heels in love with. I love the way she makes me think and the emotions that she imparts on me. I love the jiggle of my untamed moobs and also the snug feel of a bra to contain them, as if it's meant to be. I love that panties fit me better than jocks. I love wearing matching sets! I love standing in front of the mirror last thing at night in my nightie, brushing my hair out. I love catching my reflection during the day and noticing that I might be displaying a limp wrist. I love the contact that I have with women in my life, being 'one of the girls' in social settings, and I deplore toxic masculinity. Even though if I see a pretty woman I want to be her rather than be with her, I am not unhappy being me. If society dictates that I have to display my male mask for certain situations, it's fine with me, I can do that. I don't feel bad at all, I just feel my normal old self.

 

@Vidanjali, I'm not pretending that I was one of those people that you referred to, but maybe I was. 

 

@KatieSC, you are absolutely correct. For a long time, I pondered whether I needed to get a referral to see a gender therapist or not, but it would have only been for the purpose of coming up with a label. I am currently under the guise of transfeminine on my profile here, but who knows! But in reality, that's not as important as what it seems. I am happy at my level, whatever it is. For me, things are rosy, and no professional assistance is needed. it's amazing how powerful, how pure, self-acceptance is!

[Betty K]

54 minutes ago, Mirrabooka said:

If society dictates that I have to display my male mask for certain situations, it's fine with me, I can do that. I don't feel bad at all, I just feel my normal old self.

 

That's amazing, Mirrabooka. Let's say I've met one, then.

[Vidanjali]

@Mirrabooka reading what you wrote brought joy to my heart. I love the self love you exude. 

[Mirrabooka]

@Vidanjali, how sweet of you! Thank you! BTW, what brings joy to my heart is the love and support from this community. Even for someone like me who is only 'a little bit trans' and found the pot of gold only partly along the rainbow, and often feels like an imposter, the community acceptance here sustains my self acceptance. I am in total awe of all of you lovelies who have gone much further than I ever will. ❤️

 

I've written previously about dysphoria and euphoria and how, to me, they are at opposite ends of a scale, with feeling 'normal' as the mid-point. Yes, I am lucky that the only way that I could be described as suffering from dysphoria is in relative terms, if I drop from a state of euphoria to 'normal.' So, it's not a dangerous or desperate situation for me and doesn't need fixing. I'm sure that the euphoria I often feel by obeying my inner woman isn't just a state of arousal from doing certain feminine things either. It is much deeper than that, and physically, the fire is well and truly out anyway IYKWIM.

 

So yes, it is possible for someone to be trans (even if only partly), feel euphoric (not aroused) and not dysphoric. I know this is inverse to the thread title, but I think that it is a complementary situation.

 

[Timi]

On 1/20/2024 at 2:59 AM, Mirrabooka said:

@Vidanjali, how sweet of you! Thank you! BTW, what brings joy to my heart is the love and support from this community. Even for someone like me who is only 'a little bit trans' and found the pot of gold only partly along the rainbow, and often feels like an imposter, the community acceptance here sustains my self acceptance. I am in total awe of all of you lovelies who have gone much further than I ever will. ❤️

 

I've written previously about dysphoria and euphoria and how, to me, they are at opposite ends of a scale, with feeling 'normal' as the mid-point. Yes, I am lucky that the only way that I could be described as suffering from dysphoria is in relative terms, if I drop from a state of euphoria to 'normal.' So, it's not a dangerous or desperate situation for me and doesn't need fixing. I'm sure that the euphoria I often feel by obeying my inner woman isn't just a state of arousal from doing certain feminine things either. It is much deeper than that, and physically, the fire is well and truly out anyway IYKWIM.

 

So yes, it is possible for someone to be trans (even if only partly), feel euphoric (not aroused) and not dysphoric. I know this is inverse to the thread title, but I think that it is a complementary situation.

 

 

On 1/19/2024 at 3:51 AM, Mirrabooka said:

...  I consider myself as somewhere on the trans spectrum/rainbow, but I am not transitioning. Well, no more than I already have. I am not trying to pass, I am not interested in wearing a dress, I am not considering HRT or GRS and I am not even seeking a feminine name. I don't need to. I'm growing my hair and nails, but I am not growing my femininity more than what it presently is. That said, I think about gender constantly, and everything that I do that is not quintessentially or stereotypically masculine is due to my inner woman, who I am head-over-heels in love with. I love the way she makes me think and the emotions that she imparts on me. I love the jiggle of my untamed moobs and also the snug feel of a bra to contain them, as if it's meant to be. I love that panties fit me better than jocks. I love wearing matching sets! I love standing in front of the mirror last thing at night in my nightie, brushing my hair out. I love catching my reflection during the day and noticing that I might be displaying a limp wrist. I love the contact that I have with women in my life, being 'one of the girls' in social settings, and I deplore toxic masculinity. Even though if I see a pretty woman I want to be her rather than be with her, I am not unhappy being me. If society dictates that I have to display my male mask for certain situations, it's fine with me, I can do that. I don't feel bad at all, I just feel my normal old self. ...

 

@Mirrabooka So much of what you wrote resonates with me. Not all, but so much. 

 

I can remember exactly where I was when I first learned what trans and transition could mean and truly felt like it applied to me (actually, it was a feeling of tentative certainty ... "could this be me? it feels like me! but it's soooo scary. NO! it can't be me!!! Yet .... It is me.")

 

I was sitting in the waiting area of the immunization clinic waiting for my flu shot, scrolling through my phone after Googling "transgender" (because of course isn't that what *everyone* does when they have a spare moment? LOL) I read the APA's pamphlet on transgender https://www.apa.org/topics/lgbtq/transgender-people-gender-identity-gender-expression and was stunned by things that resonated with me. I then read Planned Parenthood's web pages on the topic.  One of the points was that social transitioning may include "coming out to your friends and family as transgender or non-binary." Arguably, I had already done that (albeit by using terms like "lifelong feminine soul and spirit" to my wife and close friends, and as I said when I reconnected with my high school girlfriend after 40 years of no communication, "If I had to use one word to describe myself, it would be "feminine.")

 

Again, I was stunned. I'm thinking, "By merely talking about this, am I socially transitioning??? It sure feels like it! I'm actively doing something to change my gender identity in the world."

 

I get lost sometimes in dealing with the stereotype of "transition" - diagnosis and therapy, HRT, passing, real life living, GRS. I feel sometimes like an imposter because from where I stand now, my desired endpoint seems different. The therapy is something I very much need, but not for a predetermined goal of having HRT or passing as female.

 

(I mean, I'm still figuring this out. Elsewhere here I posted a photo of myself in a black sweater dress. It is not something I would want to wear out, *except* I could absolutely see myself wearing it if I were doing an EDM DJ set at night -- which is something that I have skills and experience to believe that is actually within my grasp. I mean really. What else would DJ Timi Tim wear?) But that isn't "passing" - it's gender expression plus artistic expression. In public, I want to dress androgynously. Just enough femininity to shake people up and make them question their sense of certainty regarding gender. 

 

(Me away from home with a very limited wardrobe about to go out walking and shopping in the mountain village. I can't believe I spent over an hour deciding what to wear and putting on light makeup, women's undies, and a single earring! LOL It was so much fun interacting with the women shopkeepers!)

 

I want to feel like I am living and expressing my authentic self without feeling shame. I am not living in that state now. I also do not want to feel dysphoria and pain about my body's physical sexual characteristics. 

 

Earlier, @VickySGV wrote, "It is the resolution action and intention that makes you Trans."

 

I am taking action. By that definition I do think I can say that I am Trans and in Transition.  

 

Thank you for listening to my ramble!

 

-Timi

 

P.S. DJ Timi Tim "in the closet" (LOL) doing a set at last New Year's Eve family party:

 

 

[MaeBe]

1 hour ago, Timi said:

I am taking action. By that definition I do think I can say that I am Trans and in Transition.  

Random question: how hard was that to write? How long did you look at that sentence on your screen? That is huge and something that I'm just getting comfortable saying myself. I'm super happy you're finding yourself!

 

💜Mae

[Timi]

27 minutes ago, MaeBe said:

Random question: how hard was that to write? How long did you look at that sentence on your screen? That is huge and something that I'm just getting comfortable saying myself. I'm super happy you're finding yourself!

 

💜Mae

Hey Mae! I did not look at that sentence very long -- the rest of what I wrote I read and re-read. 

 

In this space, really, the difficulty for me in writing  "I do think I can say that I am Trans and in Transition" was that I did not want to dishonor my sisters who are going the distance and living wonderful new lives in the bodies that they are meant to have!

 

Now in other places - let's just say with family members I'm not out with, or on social media .... let's just say I would be terrified and horrified and scrambling to hit the backspace key. 

 

I want to get past that fear --- but it's soooooo hard with the way things are going in our country at the moment. 

 

I'm beginning to see that it is so important for me and people like me to identify publicly as trans - without being disrespectful to our sisters who are going the distance (I'm sorry - I just don't have a better phrase - I don't want to open up another can of worms by saying "fully transition"). And to present as we want to present. I think it's important for people in our social worlds to know us and love us or at least like us as we are. It might make them think at the ballot box. 

 

Thank you soooo much for your support! I'm so happy that you are getting comfortable! It's sooo hard!

 

-Timi

[Owly]

I agree with you @AllieJ about Trans being sort of a misnaming. There is that dilemma about enby being or not being trans.  I think of transformation as in rebirth when i think of Trans and I'm not sure I categorize myself as trans but when I think about the fact that i'm on HRT, that kinda means i'm Trans (forming) into something different as in both masculine and feminine presenting (well more feminine now than before). 

I don't want to sweat it so much because i don't want to fall in the heteronormative rhetoric of having that obsession with categorizing everything and putting people in boxes. I don't want to spend so much time finding a label as much as what makes me happy most of the time, and to me right now that is being able to express myself any way I want to and not feel like I have to make a decision about being all masc or all fem. 

I rambled. Sorry