Anyone else a "Logical Mind" struggling?

[UnknownReality]

Hey,

Background Story (Skip if you just wanted to help with the Logical Mind statement in the title)

I've been on these forums before not really sure what was going on with me.  Had some supportive comments etc but ultimately ended up being forced into making a choice between leading a Zombie like state of mind, sleeping all the time and basically not dealing with the issues at all or facing up to them and working out how to move forwards.  I decided both were not really a life worth going on with for various reasons and tried to take my own life.  Long story short I took an overdose 30 minutes into a 36 hour shift doing security in a remote location, knowing full well I would not be found for at least 35 hours and woke up 30 hours later with a massive headache and pain for over 2 weeks.

So I ended up spending the last few years in a vegetative state, sleeping most of the time and effectively numbing myself to a point where I didn't have to think about anything.  This reached a bit of a crisis point with parents helping out and ended up being referred to doctors then community mental health teams etc and am now diagnosed with a long list of various symptoms, some of which are:

• Attention Deficit Disorder
• Depression
• Anxiety
• Gender Issues

Yep that was copied from a letter sent to my doctors.  I've been on Strattera, Methylphenidate and now on Dextroamphetamine.

Dextro has been awesome to help with focus and getting me to wake up from the zombie state I was in, however, it also allows my mind to think clearly again and thus the Gender Dysphoria is now worse than ever.

 

The Issue I have

So referring to the title and if you read the back story the decision I made regarding not moving forwards was because I am an extremely logical thinker.  Whether this was through a self defence type mechanism against emotions or I was just born with a talented mind I do not know.  But this brings in massive issues.

I cannot go more than 5 minutes at the moment without feeling pain, distress and emptiness along with the crippling dysphoria but my brain just cannot process and understand it due to processing everything logically.

The meds I am on are allowing me to think clearly and suddenly everything starts to look like a facade.  Every action I take or do is a result of over 20 years of writing logical routines into every part of my life.  Any situation I don't have logic to deal with I shut down or become anxious due to suppressing my emotional side.

Basically I know I was born with the wrong character and my gender does not match my body, however, I have written logic routines to deal with every situation in life I might come across and built a huge facade to fool everyone including myself.

The logical mind just won't accept that it is possible that I was born with the wrong body and instead try's to figure out how to reprogram itself and write these routines, very modular and code like to deal with everything.

I'm now back at the same crossroads.  I can either stop taking the meds and revert to zombie like state, sleeping and just numbing out my reality or try and work out how to overcome an extremely logical mind and actually work out what the hell I am supposed to do.  I broke down in tears in my therapy session today and bought this up again as it was an issue I was trying to put off.  They were aware of it but every time it was bought up I just said "I want to deal with my focus issues first".  Well now the focus issues are kinda fixed with the new meds and the jokes on me, because I have no choice but to deal with it and I just can't accept it due to being too logical.

Just looking for some advice on how I can break this logical mindset or use it to my advantage.

Thanks and sorry for the long read.  I'm just back at the point where the road splits either side of a massive cliff and last time I decided to just jump and messed that up. 

[Charlize]

I know we all travel the same paths in one way or another.  One of the things i think is universal is the difficulty with accepting the difference between what we see, our bodies and how and what we feel are our true selves.  I am not sure what force finally helped me get over a" logical mindset".  Somehow i let it go, allowed myself to step forward and in time am finding comfort in my present position.  Logically i know i will never be the woman i have felt i am but i am able to be myself, living and accepted as a woman but with so much of what constitutes male as well.  63 years of living a male life with a male body hasn't disappeared but today i am content.  Perhaps it is a gift from a force that logic can't unravel.  I am simply me and as irrational as it is i can accept in fact i see no other alternative.  Keep coming, writing and reading here.  That helped me.  Hopefully that will help you as well.  You are not alone.

PS.... you might want to post in the introduction forum as well.

 

Hugs,

 

Charlize

[MarcieMarie12]

Logic, reasoning and such here were mine:

1. Did I want to continue as a him. No I did not.

2. Was denying myself hurting me in anyway. Yes it was.

3. Would it hurt anyone? Yes, my ex-wife, possibly family.

4. Would she be hurt anyway, yes as #1 precluded me from being happy with the status quo. Therefore I would eventually take it out on her. Either by just shutting down, which I was already doing or getting angry with her because she was limiting what I could do.

5. Work would probably be ok with it. Place was L&G friendly, and apparently T friendly as well.

 

Question, given answers above, what are likely out comes:

1. Not transition: Unhappy marriage and unhappy life. Possibly leading to doing something stupid.

2. Transition: Loss of marriage, possibility of happier life--but no guarantees. Plus, I always dreamed of being a girl.

3. Transition and then detransition due to either losing my nerve or external factors, or not feeling right about it. Then an unhappy life.maybe, or at least some more knowledge about why I am depressed.

The decision to detransition would be after transitioning to some degree. So option 3 was really not a factor. It was really a choice in maintaining the status quo (option 1), or trying to transition. Not transitioning would lead to the worst case outcome, transiitoning would give me the chance, and transitioning then detransitioning would mean I'd at least learn something about myself for once. So transitioning was my best option. .

Hope that helps!

[Timber Wolf]

Hi UnknownReality,

When I was a kid, I learned I could enter 1134 on a calculator, turn it upside down and spell "hell".  One word is not much of a vocabulary. A calculator just wouldn't work for spelling words.

 

In life, there are things that just can't be rationalized out through logical formula any more than using an old calculator to spell words.

I've struggled my whole life with drug addiction. I've tried to quit on my own my own way uncountable numbers of times. I never had one success. I finally came to the realisation that my way just will not work. I had to try a new way, a different way. To do so, I needed help from someone else. I had to accept that I was unable to figure it out. I had to try somebody elses way. So I went to a drug treatment center. I had no idea if it would work. But I finally admitted that I couldn't keep trying my same old methods, because they just wouldn't work.

Sometimes we just have to accept that what we've been trying won't work. I've spent my whole life hiding from being trans. It didn't work. It wasn't until I faced my issues with being trans that I was able to begin to find self acceptance, and healing. And I wasn't able to do this on my own. Once again, I needed help from others. I couldn't figure it out on my own.

 

I don't know of any way to "logically'" calculate being trans. Who can calculate emotions? And emotions are so involved with being trans. I've found that numbing them never worked, denying them never worked, and rationalizing them away never worked. Emotions are a part of everyone's life. There are no Mr. Spock's in this world. I had to face what I was feeling. That's the only way I was able to deal with it.

 

This is what I have learned through my journey, anyway. Good luck on yours.

 

Lots of love,

Timber Wolf?

[Aanzinaago'Stephanie]

Hi there. First, I'd like to empathize with your struggle, leading to an attempt to overdose. It makes me a bit sad, because I recognize I have been there during my deepest and darkest region of my depression; my suicide failed and I was left with a lethargic feeling and a splitting headache (I also had to get blood tests done, pumped out the drugs).

I can relate to some of the logic-building, but Charlize captured rather well how I struggle with seeing one thing but feeling another. I like to use the word, rationalize. As in, I can rationalize a person's reaction, so it's okay if they are upset with me (my therapist has helped me overcome a lot of this "rationalizing" by asking me about what I feel rather that how I can rationalize the event/situation).

[VickySGV]

OK, what the hell is illogical about being Trans??   With new ways of looking at the human genome, and just figuring out the combinations that the amino acids in DNA/RNA can combine in the cells, and doing some math, it works out that there should be about triple the number of Male To Female Trans* Folk that have reported the  phenomena based on ordinary statistics.  0.06% is the best number we have at the minute and 1.8% is the statistical probability.  Instead of two sexes or genders, the number 46 comes up based on known variations of the X and y (which is a busted X in reality) chromosomes.  It is enough to make your head spin to be sure.

I tried the logic wheel myself and it was not until I decided to accept illogical things as more common than the others that it finally became a new and better reality.  Bad logic with bad assumptions about life based on the "good logic" of people who knew less and talked more than those who's "bad logic" was good reality.  Life on Life's terms may not be logical, but it hurts a lot less in the long run.

[MarcieMarie12]

Nothing is illogical about it, accepting that I was transgender was the hard part. The reasoning I mentioned was about what to do about it.

[Guest Alicia Rose]

16 hours ago, UnknownReality said:

Basically I know I was born with the wrong character and my gender does not match my body, however, I have written logic routines to deal with every situation in life I might come across and built a huge facade to fool everyone including myself.

The logical mind just won't accept that it is possible that I was born with the wrong body and instead try's to figure out how to reprogram itself and write these routines, very modular and code like to deal with everything.

For Trans* individuals, Acceptance is a very difficult obstacle to overcome. For many, we feel like we're fooling ourselves and often question ourselves. Early on, it's GOOD to challenge yourself and have doubts about whether or not we are honestly transgender. Knowing we're transgender is something that we discover about ourselves and hopefully with time can accept and love.

Trans* is a very real thing but why am I, out of everybody else, transgender? That is the hard part. Once we know what makes us happy in life, what we want if we could do anything, we must learn to accept the answers and make ourselves happy. If you do just one selfish thing in life, and you're transgender, I strongly believe it should be putting your happiness first and finding a way to live your life to the fullest. We all deserve to be happy, loved and accepted for who we are.

You know you were born as the wrong character and your gender does not match your body, and you mentioned you do have a therapist. So, you are already on a good path. Maybe try putting your gender stuff first and see what your therapist says.

Personally, acceptance has been and continues to be a challenge I face every day. From everything that triggers my dysphoria or never feeling good enough, I continue to fight because to me, being my true authentic self would be the best thing for me. Better than life itself. So it's important. Being myself is the most important thing I'll ever do in life, and it will be my entire life. So if you are transgender, logically, how could you reach your ultimate goal to transition? Set goals and challenge yourself to be happier. Obviously we all want to be happy..

Hopefully you can find something here on LP that helps you, and keep asking questions if you have any. 

 

 

 

 

[tracy_j]

I think things are a little reversed with me. I revert to the logical mindset when my brain cannot cope with normal life.It is a technique I have found can help me survive. I am as I am now because I got to one of those points. There were so many bad things happening in my life a few years ago that I just could not cope and falling back on logic, realised that I was on a downward terminal spiral. I had to break out and there was nothing to lose by being myself. Whether or not true there was no difference if I was injuring myself or someone else was doing so because they did not like what they saw (my thoughts at the time were morbid and very depressed). I had a chance though and took it. I have not looked back!

Tracy

[Ravin]

I tend to logic things out and all of that to the nth degree as well. For me, I had an "aha" moment, where it was like a switch flipped in my brain, and shifted the paradigm with which I looked at everything (THAT's what my issue is!!!), and from there the logical sequences that followed all changed. Instead of trying to slap on emergency overrides to something "acceptable" I went down paths that were right for me.

From what you are saying, I get the impression that it's not logic so much as a "does not compute" and subsequent stagnation that is holding you back. It may be that you just need to do more reading/pondering on gender, what gender is, what gender identity is, and how the mind/body go together, and give yourself time. I had a good two years in between that "aha" above and actually taking concrete steps other than the most superficial. I no longer try and force myself into gender norms. My logic circuits are all wired for just being myself, whoever and whatever that turns out to be. 

[UnknownReality]

Thanks for the responses, I know a lot of my struggle at the moment is just accepting.  It feels like I've spent 20+ years building these logical/self defence mindsets etc and it's just become too much.

I read a blog post yesterday which was titled "That was Dysphoria" which opened my eyes a little.  It's basically 8 symptoms that were only linked to the gender dysphoria after transition.  I got to point 7 which was:

"Attempting to fix this on your own through various coping mechanisms"

And ended up in tears.  I feel like my whole mindset and logical thinking and pretty much everything I do was just revolved around coping mechanisms.

This is probably the first time in over 8 years I've actually cried and was unexpected.

I don't know what the immediate future holds but I think this time I need to just start being myself and stop using logical rationing to try and fix something that doesn't need fixing.

I'm over to post on the intro forums again, I have a feeling this journey is only just beginning for me, again...

[VickySGV]

My crystal ball sees a Gender Therapist in your future!!  Get your ball rolling!!

[UnknownReality]

20 minutes ago, VickySGV said:

My crystal ball sees a Gender Therapist in your future!!  Get your ball rolling!!

I already have one, 2 years ago when my family kinda forced the situation into getting help I came out to them as transgender with the other issues I was having but said at that time I thought it could be reprogrammed or managed (haha!)

But I always maintained throughout my treatment up until Tuesday that I wanted my focus issues, anxiety etc fixed first, then come back to the gender issues.  Obviously trying to fix the issues caused by GD without actually fixing GD doesn't work.  Broke down in my therapy session on Tuesday hence ending up here and trying to come to terms with the logical mindset and how to overcome it...

Guess I'm starting to find out that actually this isn't something my coping mechanism can deal with if I have any chance at a normal life!

[VickySGV]

You will get better than a normal life if you accept yourself for who you are.  I am fully transitioned and life is great and ever-changing and I accept who I am normally and that is great. 

 

[UnknownReality]

On 10/02/2017 at 9:04 AM, VickySGV said:

You will get better than a normal life if you accept yourself for who you are.  I am fully transitioned and life is great and ever-changing and I accept who I am normally and that is great. 

 

The sad thing is I know this is true but I end up going through thousands of arguments and picking out the wrong ones. I need to stop thinking and figure out where in the last 27 years I've left my emotions!

 

Ems x

[MarcieMarie12]

I looked at it as choosing to be miserable as the least logical. My happiness and willingness to live to live were more important than how others felt about my transitioning.  

[UnknownReality]

Another Tuesday and another Psychotherapy session that I managed to mess up

Long story short, I know I need to be myself but everytime I think about it or try and switch my thought process my brain locks down and firewalls.  I'm in constant conflict with myself.

I was asked whether I had reconsidered suicide after last time and replied with;

There is a certain attraction and beauty to it and the instant relief it would bring.

So now I've made things worse.

I feel like the people that knew about this 3 years ago accepted it, yet I'm still putting up barriers and reasons not too.

They've advised dropping the ADD meds for the moment. While it's allowing me to think clearly, they are concerned it's too much at once.

Funny thing is, I feel like if I could accept this or just move past the firewalls for a moment things would get better.

Sometimes I really thing I did a number on myself over the 20 years of building walls and defences...

Sorry for the not so awesome news, just feel like I need to write this down somewhere where someone who has experienced this before could relate.

Ems x

[Jani]

Ems, 

I'm sorry about the conflict but you really need to understand that suicide is not beautiful and any relief you think it would bring is false.  You would be transferring your pain to others that care for you and would be left wondering why they couldn't help more.  

You are correct in that accepting yourself and moving beyond what's gone on in the past would be a huge relief and things would be better, much better.  You are there.  You are ready to take this step.  You've said it yourself.

11 minutes ago, UnknownReality said:

Funny thing is, I feel like if I could accept this or just move past the firewalls for a moment things would get better.

I know you were being honest with your therapist but you need to think in positive terms.  Life is attractive.   I'm glad you wrote today.  Thank you.  We are here for you.

Jani

 

[UnknownReality]

13 hours ago, Jani423 said:

I know you were being honest with your therapist but you need to think in positive terms.  Life is attractive.   I'm glad you wrote today.  Thank you.  We are here for you.

Jani

 

Hey Jani,

I don't feel ready to end this journey I just wish the journey had a few signposts and hints and less Indiana Jones style puzzles and traps!

I've been where I am now before, and the 3 choices only 1 has a life, I just can't seem to overcome my own mind.

I'm waiting on a few calls and my Dad is aware or everything. I feel like in the session yesterday he wanted to kick me... He must have said 15+ times to just accept and lay it all on the table so the Psychology team there can work on the future. I was just too damn conflicted to listen

Another day today, reading up and trying to apply logic to fight logic...

Ems x

[Sander]

On 2/12/2017 at 11:51 AM, MarcieMarie12 said:

I looked at it as choosing to be miserable as the least logical. 

This makes perfect sense to me.  You basically have two choices when gender dysphoria is making you miserable.  You can A) assume that your body is "wrong" and your mind is "right," and look at living a life that feels more authentic to you, or B ) assume that your mind is "wrong" and your body is "right," and try to change how you think and feel about things.  If you've already tried option B and it didn't work, what's wrong with option A?  Opting out of the whole thing by committing suicide seems like the ultimate illogical act to me.  

Just out of curiosity, what do you think would be the worst thing that could happen if you started looking at gender in a different way?  It seems like your family is supportive of you stepping out of a locked-in, binary mindset.  

[MarcieMarie12]

Sander, ultimately for me it became clear where I was on the gender spectrum. I was not non-binary. I was kind of hoping to save the marriage if that was the case. I needed to know for sure. Here was the problem,  every time I went back to "boy mode", I was upset and disappointed. Work (before I came out) became torture.