Thats Obviosly Discimination

[Guest Melisa]

I tried to get life issurance a few months ago. they set up an appiontment for there nurse to come down and check my heigh and weight, and give me a blood test and so fourth. A little while after that one of there representatives called me up and anked me a million questions, all good and fine. A couple of weeks after that I got a letter from them saying that I was refused life insurance because in the reports from my primary physicians records it says that I'm opting for upcoming surgery. Now, in my doctors reports it stats exactly what Im opting for, and I didn't set a date for SRS yet, heck, I'm not even on hormones quite yet(though I hop to be soon) but none the less, how would they know when Im going to start what. It's obviosly disrimination, but how am I going to fight a big insurance company?

Melisa

[Guest Donna Jean]

Well, Honey...

My understanding is that they wouldn't cover SRS anyway, so why would that be a problem?

HUGGS!

Donna Jean

[Guest Melisa]

Well, Honey...

My understanding is that they wouldn't cover SRS anyway, so why would that be a problem?

HUGGS!

Donna Jean

No thats not what I was saying,

It's a 100,000-doolar insurnce policy, you know, where my kids are the benificiary's for when I die.

Melisa

[Guest MrAwesome]

It's life insurance Donna. Surgery can be risky, they want to keep you away because if you're opting for surgery, that means there's a risk of you dying from it, they want you to be alive as long as possible so they can charge you out the butt for life insurance now, and make a profit off it. So I'm not sure if it's so much discrimination - but business.

[Guest ChloëC]

Hi Melisa,

It sounds a little strange to me since you have no dates set anywhere. Can you call them and ask them for a complete explanation? And maybe call your doctor's office and check to make sure their records are correct? It sounds possibly a little like it could be just mis-communication.

I wonder what the world would be like if every time someone was told they had a chance of developing some devastating illness (say, because of heredity), the insurance companies pounced on it and denied insurance on that chance. I understand there are always risks, but that's why there are vastly different rates.

(to me, insurance policies are a gamble by the buyer that he/she will get sicker. requiring more care then the price they are paying - or else why buy? - and a gamble by the companies that the buyer won't. And the odds are in favor of the companies. Which they think were increased by denying you a policy.)

Hugs,

Chloë

[Guest Melisa]

Well, Honey...

My understanding is that they wouldn't cover SRS anyway, so why would that be a problem?

HUGGS!

Donna Jean

Or to give you somewhat a more acurate description: my kids are ages 4 and 5, so my ex-wife is of course the beneficiary because they live with her.

[Guest Donna Jean]

LEWIS!

Thank you, Honey....

Somehow I thought it was "Health Insurance" and that was what I commented on...thanks for setting me straight...

(Dang, That's embarrassing.....)

Huggs

Donna Jean

[Guest Melisa]

It's life insurance Donna. Surgery can be risky, they want to keep you away because if you're opting for surgery, that means there's a risk of you dying from it, they want you to be alive as long as possible so they can charge you out the butt for life insurance now, and make a profit off it. So I'm not sure if it's so much discrimination - but business.

It doesn't matter if its business. they can't disriminate, if someone has a teminal illness thats one-thing. Thats not what I'm talking about here though, they can't give life insurance to one person thats totally heathy and deny the other person thats totally healthy for some disriminatory reason that is just not the way the system is supposed to operate.

Melisa

[Guest julia_d]

I have life insurance and no questions about upcoming surgery or anything were asked.

Try a different company, and file a discrimination complaint against this one.

[Guest Melisa]

I have life insurance and no questions about upcoming surgery or anything were asked.

Try a different company, and file a discrimination complaint against this one.

Thanks'

Yeah, believe me I will file one, I don't know what will come of it beause they have many more lawyers and financial resourses then I do, but I'm going to try anyway. I did also go to another company and went through all their procedures, I'm just waiting to here back from them. Hopefully there won't be any problem.

Melisa

[Guest ~Brenda~]

All surgery's have a degree of risk to them. SRS is no exception. An insurance company evaluating whether to issue a policy to you or not will calculate the expected probabilty of you surviving the surgery. Prudence on their part will most likely cause them to deny the policy.

It is not discrimination. It is buisiness.

Brenda

[Guest julia_d]

No dates booked.. it doesn't even come into the equation.

To try to use it as a method to evaluate risk is as ridiculous as saying "you walk across the road, we refuse to cover you because you might get hit by a car"

MIGHT.. being the operative word. IF you had a definite surgery date they could possibly have some point, but people have insurance and then have surgery for other things.. how about having your appendix out.. or breaking your hip playing sports? All those possible needs for surgery are just as much guesswork as your some time in the future (unspecified) srs.

I call discrimination.. based on pure logic.

[Guest yvonne]

Melisa,

First off, it's not discrimination, it's a decision of the Underwriters. It's their job to assess potential risks.

You need to do 2 things: First off, contact your primary physician and ask them to remove the statement that "you're opting for surgery". You're not opting for anything if you don't have a date set and that's a completely true statement. Tell the Doctor that just because you're thinking about getting it done some day, you're not making a firm commitment on it, so it's not really proper for it to be on your record. Explain the insurance thing to them and I'll bet they'll be helpful and remove it. A lot of people think about a lot of things and that doesn't mean they'll actually do them. I've been thinking about buying that cute little house next door to Tiger Woods, too....

It's like getting engaged--if you don't have a ring and a date, then you're not really engaged. There's no reason to have that on your record.

Second, contact the original company, tell them you've changed your mind on the surgery and ask them to reconsider. If they won't, ask them if you can withdraw your application like it never happened. The idea here is not that you want to do business with them, but rather that you want to be able to answer "no" to the question on the application that asks "have you ever been declined for insurance?"

Finally, apply to a different company and be totally upfront with the new agent about what happened before, so it's no surprise. They can frequently make a quick call to underwriting to ask about that aspect of the risk before completing an application.

A lot of things can happen during surgery and it wouldn't surprise me one bit for a conservative company to want to delay the assumption of risk until you've been through it and are OK.

For those out there who might say this isn't right, try buying flood insurance in Florida when a hurricane is headed toward land... That's the same perspective an insurance underwriter will have regarding an applicant about to have surgery.

Best of luck,

Yvonne

[Guest Melisa]

All surgery's have a degree of risk to them. SRS is no exception. An insurance company evaluating whether to issue a policy to you or not will calculate the expected probabilty of you surviving the surgery. Prudence on their part will most likely cause them to deny the policy.

It is not discrimination. It is buisiness.

Brenda

Brenda;

I just thought it would or could be classified as descimination against trans-gender people for the simple fact that it would be protected under the laws against discimination. Regardless of any upcomming surgeries, I mean as I stated before I don't have any specified date at the moment, and as far as the issurance companies know the surgery is all here say or it would not necessarily happen, even though we know better. why do they have the right to deny me on what they know or what information has been provided to them, which is,nt enough for them to make a determination like that , at least thats the way I see it.

Melisa

[Guest julia_d]

They might be looking at it from another angle.. how many trans people get violently assaulted and murdered every year?

In the UK the figures are..

chances of violent assault in any 12 month period -

transgender/gender variant 1 in 12

rest of society 1 in 18,000

quite telling figures (source pfc/gires annual stats 2007)

Does your doc have a prospective surgery date they aren't telling you about?

Again.. go somewhere else.

[Guest NatalieRene]

It doesn't matter if its business. they can't disriminate, if someone has a teminal illness thats one-thing. Thats not what I'm talking about here though, they can't give life insurance to one person thats totally heathy and deny the other person thats totally healthy for some disriminatory reason that is just not the way the system is supposed to operate.

Melisa

Their lawyers will tell the judge that you where high risk because of a known surgery that is pending. Regardless of the fact that the date is not set it's a valid enough reason for the insurance company to deny you. When you ask the next life insurance company to give you a policy don't mention anything about srs especially if you haven't even started hrt or the real life experience. They don't need to know that at this time.

[Guest Melisa]

They might be looking at it from another angle.. how many trans people get violently assaulted and murdered every year?

In the UK the figures are..

chances of violent assault in any 12 month period -

transgender/gender variant 1 in 12

rest of society 1 in 18,000

quite telling figures (source pfc/gires annual stats 2007)

Does your doc have a prospective surgery date they aren't telling you about?

Again.. go somewhere else.

I'm sorry;

If I'm going to look like a total girl after my trasitioning; just look like any other women. Then why would I be violently assaulted or kiiled as you put it.

Melisa

[Guest Melisa]

They might be looking at it from another angle.. how many trans people get violently assaulted and murdered every year?

In the UK the figures are..

chances of violent assault in any 12 month period -

transgender/gender variant 1 in 12

rest of society 1 in 18,000

quite telling figures (source pfc/gires annual stats 2007)

Does your doc have a prospective surgery date they aren't telling you about?

Again.. go somewhere else.

To add to what I was saying, I would be totally fine with being a totally ugly women, just as long as I looked like an ordinary rveryday women. Whh y would I opt. for looking like something that is not toally that. and subject my self to constant ridicule and violence. That would be much worse then what I'm going through now. So I don't really understand were you're comming from?

Love

Melisa

[Guest ~Brenda~]

Melisa,

Admittedly, this thread is going off topic, and this post is certainly not helping to bring it back on topic, but you asked a very important question that I think everyone needs to undestand.

To help answer your question regarding hate crimes against transgendered people I give you this link to the hate crimes forum here at Laura's. Read the topic about Angie Zapata. If you have not seen her photograph, I can tell you this, she was a real looker. Beautiful beyond comparison. She passed with perfection. Someone outed her to her boyfriend and he then killed her.

http://www.lauras-playground.com/forums/in...hp?showforum=73

Brenda

[Guest julia_d]

Thanks B

It was something that came up when I applied for my life insurance. That's why I thought I would mention it.

Risk of death from srs is in the same or less than any surgical procedure. I don't believe it is a valid reason, especially as no date is booked, for refusal. My insurance company were told in a vague sense that mine could be anywhere from 3 months to 5 years.. and they were happy with that.

I just get the feeling they are using the srs as an excuse to cover a more blatant discrimination against the trans community in general. We are "high risk" because of who we are.. and that IS discrimination.. figures show it time and time again, and all of us have learned it from bitter personal experience. As you transition you will discover this discrimination and hate for yourself. This is your first experience of it.. many more to come.. what doesn't kill us makes us stronger.

Where is Joe on this one?

[Guest Melisa]

No dates booked.. it doesn't even come into the equation.

To try to use it as a method to evaluate risk is as ridiculous as saying "you walk across the road, we refuse to cover you because you might get hit by a car"

MIGHT.. being the operative word. IF you had a definite surgery date they could possibly have some point, but people have insurance and then have surgery for other things.. how about having your appendix out.. or breaking your hip playing sports? All those possible needs for surgery are just as much guesswork as your some time in the future (unspecified) srs.

I call discrimination.. based on pure logic.

Thanks for your replies,

I went with another company, and no problems this time.

[Guest julia_d]

See what I mean? .. now you have proof they are making blanket assumptions and using them in a discriminatory way. I would write and make a complaint ot the overseeing govt department which deals with these kinds of discrimination cases.

Life insurance is a purchase which everybody has the right to make, regardless of age or colour or creed or gender or anything..

[Guest AshleyRF]

It doesn't matter if its business. they can't disriminate, if someone has a teminal illness thats one-thing. Thats not what I'm talking about here though, they can't give life insurance to one person thats totally heathy and deny the other person thats totally healthy for some disriminatory reason that is just not the way the system is supposed to operate.

Melisa

I believe they can my dear. There are very few states where transgendered people have any anti discrimination laws set into place for them. I know of several cases where insurance companies have dropped trans clients for just that reason. You are talking about insurance companies here. This is the same industry that pays people tons of money to find a way to deny their dying clients coverage for a surgery that could save their life.

I hope you find something. Next time I suggest not mentioning anything about you being transgendered. Just a thought.