Religion And Gov't Control

[Guest Vere]

I really don't know what to consider myself as far as politics go, but I think that Organized religion today is all crap.

No offense to anyone else, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs and opinions, that's what this country (the US) was founded on

But organized religion today has been twisted and contorted into basically this one big corporation pretty much used to control

the masses, and tell us how we absolutely have to live our lives, according to societies standards and 'Normalities' as defined

by the government. Does anyone else feel this way? Church isn't what it used to be, going to learn about whatever deity or higher

power said religion believes in. Now it's all about how people should act and live their lives, with a few scriptures here and there.

I don't know, maybe I'm crazy and have no idea what I'm talking about, but this is how I perceive church and state today.

[Guest KimberlyF]

I don't fully agree. With any big org. there is going to be corruption. My LGBT health center almost closed after 35 years because of questionable bookkeeping. Luckily they raised the money needed to keep it open. That is a bit of the human condition I'm afraid. There is some truth to the saying "Power tends to corrupt, and absolute power corrupts absolutely." The bigger the Gov or Religion, the bigger the corruption it seems.

But Gov and Religion don't work together to define normal. They aren't even always close to in sync.

First there are numerous religions and they're not centrally located in one country. Most were against the Iraq war for example and some were doing things like helping the underground railroad and were used through history as a place where people would go to find sanctuary from Government.

And recently Govs have been moving to make changes socially that are leaving a lot of org. religions in the stone ages.

But I have attended many services in both Catholic and Lutheran churches and I have never been given any message on how to live my life in a hateful or intolerant way during those services and I have always been hypersensitive to this type of thing. What the people up top issue as statements about things are totally different. And I am also aware that my experiences are not the same as everyone elses. But if religion were one big corporation in tune with Gov and used to control the masses, there should be a central message that is the same in every church regardless of which religion and which Gov or this conspiracy theory starts to crumble.

Now if you said the big religions were out there and showed more interest in sucking money from the masses than pushing actual religion at times, I could buy that. But that would go back to the power tends to corrupt saying.

Kim

[JJ]

The church I attend is part of a mainstream denomination. It has a policy of accepting and welcoming all who come. I have heard few sermons condemning behavior but one I did that stands in memory was about people who come to church and speak of love then treat people badly outside of church. I do hear all the time that we are supposed to live our faith in showing the love and kindness toward others that we show each other in church.

I was amazed when I found this church. But even more amazed when I told the minister about my beliefs in a Christian form of reincarnation that there are many, many paths to the creator and I was still accepted and welcomed. Still take communion with this church.

This is the second church of this large denomination that has accepted me and my beliefs. It is a refuge in this very narrow minded bigoted area. Most of the people who volunteer in helping programs in the area attend there. Another unbelievable thing is that they don't ask for money, although in this poorest state in the nation money is scarce and things are sometimes difficult. There will be a little note with the amount of the shortfall tucked into the church bulletin once in a great while. But it is never mentioned. For them church is not a place to harangue people about or beg for money.

I was raised in 2 other denominations that were the polar opposite. Plus I heard the voices of those denominations who believe in using their wealth to amass power and purchase a voice in the media and I once shared your views. The truth is that there are good churches out there that teach the real message of Christ which is love. The only group He attacked according to the bible after all were those who made money from religion and those who used it to harm others. Sadly those churches believe in using their money and power for doing good and not for shouting hate in the media so increasingly people have an ugly distorted view of religion in this country as those who are the worst get all the media.

There is both incredible good and indescribable bad in people. In each of us and I believe the true purpose of religion- real religion-is to bring out the good and control the evil and anything else may call itself religion but isn't.

[Guest Vere]

I must have gone to some messed up churches when I was a kid then O.o

I grew up between non denominational christian churches, and the catholic church, I never noticed it when I was younger, but as I got older,

I noticed how everyone would sit there and judge one other, being completely and totally blatant about it. It was like a house of gossip

more than a place to learn about God and Jesus. My Dad used to be the worship leader at one of these places, and when him and my mom divorced,

he literally was not allowed to go back to the church because divorce was looked down upon highly by everyone else. I'm different, and was

always open about it, and accepting of others for it, but when I was there, I was constantly under fire from others because I didn't

dress or act, or look a certain way. And this is why I believe that all church is, is the a fore mentioned.

[JJ]

I know well that those churches exist. I was raised in 2 of them. Where people were constantly attacking differences and threatened with hell for not thinking exactly as they were told. There are plenty of churches like that. And plenty of churches that are more narrow minded and rejecting than others in their denomination. But you cannot extrapolate that all churches, all organized religion, is bad from that.

There is a tendency among people to take a couple of specifics and use them to draw a general conclusion about hundreds even thousands of others. I have know people who believed every horrible stereotype about African Americans because they met one person who was bad. I have know people who hated and distrusted all Jewish people and the entire nation of Israel because they ended up getting cheated by a Jewish owned business. It is the same thing as condemning all churches, all Christians because you have known bad ones.

It is ironic that those who are called Fundamentalists are the most guilty of corrupting the real fundamentals of Christianity. It's like calling North Korea The People's Democratic Republic of Korea.. If you get all your ideas about democracy and the republic style of government from that you won't really get a true picture but it would be understandable if it wasn't exactly positive.

I am just saying there are both good and bad churches as there are both good and bad people within them. Perhaps saddest of all is that there are good people who believe bad things because they were born and raised that way.

[Guest KimberlyF]

I must have gone to some messed up churches when I was a kid then O.o

I grew up between non denominational christian churches, and the catholic church, I never noticed it when I was younger, but as I got older,

I noticed how everyone would sit there and judge one other, being completely and totally blatant about it. It was like a house of gossip

more than a place to learn about God and Jesus. My Dad used to be the worship leader at one of these places, and when him and my mom divorced,

he literally was not allowed to go back to the church because divorce was looked down upon highly by everyone else. I'm different, and was

always open about it, and accepting of others for it, but when I was there, I was constantly under fire from others because I didn't

dress or act, or look a certain way. And this is why I believe that all church is, is the a fore mentioned.

And how does this experience reinforce your theory in the OP of religion that is 'this one big corporation pretty much used to control

the masses, and tell us how we absolutely have to live our lives, according to societies standards and 'Normalities' as defined

by the government' when the gov you live in allows the divorce your father and mother had. So who defined these normalities that Religion, Inc is pushing

on the people since one church is different than the next and as obviously demonstrated by your own example they're not all following the Gov's lead?

Kim

[Guest TracieV3]

I really don't know what to consider myself as far as politics go, but I think that Organized religion today is all crap.

No offense to anyone else, everyone is entitled to their own beliefs and opinions, that's what this country (the US) was founded on

But organized religion today has been twisted and contorted into basically this one big corporation pretty much used to control

the masses, and tell us how we absolutely have to live our lives, according to societies standards and 'Normalities' as defined

by the government. Does anyone else feel this way? Church isn't what it used to be, going to learn about whatever deity or higher

power said religion believes in. Now it's all about how people should act and live their lives, with a few scriptures here and there.

I don't know, maybe I'm crazy and have no idea what I'm talking about, but this is how I perceive church and state today.

This twisting of religion in the U.S. started sixty years ago when organized religions make a faustian pack with government. In exchange for tax-free status, the organized religions of this nation would stay silent and give cover to the abuses and crimes committed by government.

Now in the U.S., organized religions are just corrupt industries of hate that accuse red-herrings, such as us, as scapegoats for the problems of this nation. All the while they give cover to the real group responsible for creating the problems of this nation, that being government.

[Guest TracieV3]

Hi Tracie,

Not sure if I can agree with your statements - I've never heard of the pact that you refer to.

But, I do feel that some churches are more aimed at mind control than the spiritual. Some of these institutions are really frightening!

Much better to have your own beliefs and build your moral structure for yourself.

Love, Kat

Look up "tax free status". It was a bill that was make law in D.C. in the 1950's. Any time a religious organization under tax free status states a political view that is counter to the current policy of the Federal Government, the IRS is sent after them to revoke their tax free status and bankrupt them.

It makes sense if you think about it.

This and the "Fairness Doctrine" (which was anything but) in the press (which was revoked by Reagan) paved the way to a lot of the bankrupting and crushing regulations we have now in the U.S.

As a lot of things in life, to those whom created such policies, it is about insuring power over other people and stealing other people's wealth.

[gennee]

I understand your feelings, Vere. Everyone is entitled to their own beliefs. Any group or organization that demeans or keeps a group from living their lives is is a group that has to be taken to task for. It can be a church, government, school, or civic group.

Gennee

[Cyndee]

Hi Tracie,

Not sure if I can agree with your statements - I've never heard of the pact that you refer to.

But, I do feel that some churches are more aimed at mind control than the spiritual. Some of these institutions are really frightening!

Much better to have your own beliefs and build your moral structure for yourself.

Love, Kat

Kat is right on here.

I will simply add many people in religious organizations attempt to utilize guilt as a method to enforce compliance with their beliefs (my observations). Having endured this, I left organized religion.

We all do what feels best for ourselves nothing wrong with that.

In exercising my individual spirituality, I have found a much greater sense of inner peace. Less noise from others, I hear more clearly now.

Cindy -