My Pastors Efforts

[Guest Karen K]

In his effort to "cure" me, my pastor has loaned me a couple of books, given me hand outs and suggested I attend a one-on-one retreat.

Books:

1) Perry: A Transformed Transsexual by Perry Desmond

2) When Hope Seems Lost byDenise Shick and Help 4 Families

Hand Outs:

1) What Should Christians Think About Homosexuality

2) Is Homosexual Orientation Inborn?

3) Homosexuality and Love

4) Homosexual Practice and The Scriptures

I have attempted to read the books but find it difficult to proceed further into them. I suppose my pastor would say that satan is holding me back. Be that as it may, In Perry, the poor soul whose autobiography this is had an unhappy and quite disturbing childhood. Abusive, alcoholic father, sexually abusive friends, a dissaproving mother and a doting aunt.

Perry, says from an early age he felt trapped in a boys body but should have been born a girl. I got as far as the sexual abuse at the hands of his shool mates and had to put it down. To summarize this book: Perry when on to be, first, a somewhat famous female impersonator and later a transsexual. It was well after the GCS that Perry came to Christ and is now full of regret but hopeful that his book will disuade others from make his mistake.

Interestingly, When Hope Seems Lost has something to say about Perry's case. With an abusive, alcoholic father, Perry never learned what it means to be a male. Ms Shick has her own demonds to face: she learned in college her dad was trans, he came out to her in a somewhat shocking way. He just showed up on her doorstep dressed as a female and proceded to tell her his needs.

This apparently started her crusade; as she put it: God impressed upon my heart to help those who suffer from this. She has researched transgender, gender identity disorder, gender dysphoria etc. Guess where she got some if not most of her material. You got it: John Hopkins. And we very well know whose opinion cared such heavy weight over there.

I have not completed this text and I am not sure I will. It is clear from the beginning that the author believes that satan has control over those "afflicted" with gender dysphoria. This book contains contribution by both regretful transsexuals and relatives of those who under go transitioin.

I am wondering if anyone of you have read either of these books? I do not intend on read the hand outs as I am not gay.

Laura Jane

[Carolyn Marie]

Karen, perhaps you can return the favor and give your pastor a copy of "True Selves," and insist that its only fair for him to read it.

It won't change his mind, but then it doesn't appear his selections are changing yours, either.

Now, where did I leave my copy of "Chariots of the Gods?"

Carolyn Marie

[VickySGV]

LJ--

The thing holding you back in reading the books is simply GOOD SENSE and not satan. I could not finish the Perry book either. Both books are pity parties gone overboard on the self pity re-inforced by their church communities where they are pop heroes. For some reason the people who can moan and groan about something "they did wrong" become examples of what God wants us to do. People whom God has made miserable are better believers than those God has healed and made joyful.

I would agree with Carolyn Marie that giving your pastor (after thoroughly reading it yourself) True Selves by Mildred Brown, AND She's Not There by Jennifer Finney Boylan and then the handout Injustice At Every Turn which you can download at this site here http://transequality.org/. These may wrinkle his pulpit gown a bit though.

For a great web site for him (and you too) http://www.soulforce.org/ . I recently met one of the founders of this group, and my pastor's daughter was part of one of their major group events a few years agol

[Guest heatherf]

I found this site useful for checking out ex-trans sites: http://www.transchristians.org/

If I may ask, what started your pastor's attempts to cure you?

[Guest Amanda Whyte]

Sis, stay strong. You know what you need to do and you know it is good in God's eyes. Message me or call me if you need.

Luv'ya

Amanda

[Guest amanda_s]

Karen K why do you need to be cured may be you should ask him that and does he need to be cured. People who think we should be cured should go first. At 14 doctors told my parents they could cure me at The Clark instute in toronto i'm still me just took 30 years to get here.

Amanda

[Guest Elizabeth K]

So he thinks you are homosexual (handouts) - that shows how well he understands - grin.

My sisters are self defined Fundamental Christians. I have other names for them that sometimes includes adjectives like 'unforgiving, judgmental, bigoted" And yes, they pray for my soul and call me an abomination in the eyes of God. Nice people otherwise but if there was a devil, he would be residing in their brains.

But the good part? According to them transsexuality does not exist. Neither does the transgender condition, homosexuality - and apparently those conditions where a person is born with indeterminate genitalia . Also ALL therapists do the devils work. So no problem. we all are binary, and are assigned our gender and appropriate sexual orientation at birth. That's it - accept it.

Some people are like that.

Lizzy

[Guest Karen K]

I came out to my pastor over two months ago. He had asked for a meeting with me for unspecified reasons. I assumed the worst and it did come to light that one of his congregation had seen me out in town, and had brought it to the chior misstresses attention. Who in turn, took it to pastor.

I went prepared and gave him a copy of my "coming out" letter I sent to my sister and brother. He read it with interest. He confessed his lack of understanding what transsexualism was. He then proceded to tell me that God is not the God of confusion and he made man and made woman.

Since then he has been talking to other pastors trying to get some education on how to-----deal with me? he also told two of the church council. All three wanted to meet with me. BTW, they were all male. They want to come to my home. I did not think this would be appropriate and said as much. We met at pastors office.

It was all very cordial, and yet I felt their reluctance to accept me or my information on the facts, I am well educated in this condition and it's treatment. Pastor continues to encourage me to read the literature and look into this retreat. Which he says they take me back to my childhood to discover why I feel the way I do.

He does not understand that I had a happy childhood, two loving and supportive parents who were neither abusive nor addicted to anything.

Laura Jane

[Guest Elizabeth K]

I would say that there is a reason you stay with him that we don't understand.

He is a person to shun. He wants YOU to conform with HIS beliefs. I would have nothing to do with this as it will only cause you a lot if misery. You are what you are - you cannot and should not try to change that for ANYONE's preconceived ideas.

Just be a 'lost soul' to him, and let GOD explain things to him when he goes to the next level.

Lizzy

[Guest angels wings]

Aww Karen follow ur heart my dear don't let him confuse you. I was told by my pastor yrs ago that I wasn't reading the bible enough or praying enough and that why my child needed surgury :/ I left thy were playing with my mind and my sanity. Do thy have handouts on cerebral palsy ,heart disease , and all the other medical conditions????? What you have is a medical condition not a choice . No one on this planet has nothing everyone u meet has some form of condition there is no one walking this planet that is perfect .

[JenniferB]

Laura,

This concerns me in that I don't believe your pastor has any desire to truthfully understand transsexuality. His mind in on how to find a way you can repent. He won't listen to logic or facts. I'm afraid it will be like talking to a brick wall. I'm not sure what options you have, but ultimately if you don't detransition, I strongly believe this won't go over well. I was Mormon and I know they won't accept me, and I'm guessing your church will be the same.

I am really sorry that this is happening. I hope you can find some resolution that you can accept, even if you have to go to a different church.

Jenny

[Svenna]

Laura,

Reading this ALMOST makes me want to finally share the stories of BOTH my ex-communications and the EXORCISM that I endured to 'cast out' the demon that was torturing my soul. I was a born-again, apostolic disciple of Jesus and an actual evangelist, who dared to confess my 'sins' of transgender 'thought' openly with my brethren in fellowship. I was taught that only through dead-honest confession of one's weaknesses and failings, could one keep a clean slate with the Spirit. The teaching was true, but my brethren were not...and they did the best they could to destroy me...

I know I shared some of this with you via PM in the past, and I am sure you know how I feel about what you are going through right now...

And I also don't know what holds you to this course, either, where you are now puts you at great risk of deep emotional harm, but I trust you do know why?

Please, be as wary as a fox AND as gentle as a lamb, but know that Satan is well-reputed to disguise himself as 'an angel of light'...

When all is said and done, this is just another human, trying to make a complex world fit into a neat package, a package that reflects his own opinions and biased views...

Love and TRUTH for ALL!

NOBODY owns the TRUTH..

Svenna

[Guest Krisina]

It concerns me when I read that others want you to live the life that they want you to live. There are different churches with different slants and views on the teaching. One saying the other isn`t teaching or the followers are not living in the true light etc I think the united universalis church from what I have read is very loving and accepting. A church that a few of our members here, are in.

Those are my personal thoughts, Only you can make the decision for yourself

Just my personal belief that others shouldnt be forcing you to believe what they believe. You are a good person! You aren`t doing anything wrong. What you have is a medical condition and it cannot be cured by reading some books, or reparative therapy. Be true to yourself. Stay away from those who would rather you were miserable so you can continue to make their life normal and uncomplicated. Ask yourself, will this actually help me or hinder me with my happiness. Do I actually believe the books I have read suggested from the church?

Krisina

[JJ]

Laura Jane

While I know it can be very difficult I think sometimes for our own continued mental health we have to find new spiritual homes where we are accepted and respected at the very least. It doesn't sound like this pastor is really open to changing his views but dedicated instead to changing you. The homosexuality material alone indicates a fundamental lack of understanding of who you are.

There are churches out there that will accept you for yourself and see the person and not the condition. My pastor said to me that it was a little awkward for some people and difficult to understand-I agree wholeheartedly-but that they still loved me and wanted me in the church. They accept a range of beliefs as well concentrating on God's love rather than dogma. It was at a church function that I first heard people talking about me and using correct pronouns. This is a Methodist church and Methodists also have had transgendered ministers and ministers transition while leading a congregation. My pastor wasn't aware of that but wasn't surprised either. Not that you need to go to a Methodist church -just that there are supportive churches out there.

This is such a deeply personal issue that all I can do is say for me the relationship to God is what is important and I don't think that I could continue to grow with a pastor who feels as yours does.

I wish you all the best in this

Johnny

[Guest Karen K]

I thank you all for your words of support and encouragement.

You should know that I have been a Catholic for 48 years, when my mom, with God's help introduced me to the United Methodist Church. She came for a visit (Feb 2011) and asked to go to the UMC instead of my Catholic church. We did and immediately felt a spiritual awakening. I should tell you that this was 2 years ago and before I made it know that I was trans.

I continued to go after her visit. I was asked to join the chior and the praise team, which I gladly did. When I found out the pastor was leaving for another church far away, is was as if God was telling me to get off my a** and Join. After all, we know the Vaticans position on Transsexuality.

Earlier this year, I was forced to come out to the pastor. The powers that be dismissed me from the chior and praise team and the rest I have posted above. I truly believe that God had called me to this church, the UMC slogan is: "Open Minds, Open Hearts and Open Doors", and I often refered to it as my "spiritual home". The two high points of my week were Wednesday even fellowship/chior & praise team practice and Sunday services. I still attend the fellowship and Sunday services.

My music was a big segment of my worship and that has been taken away. I do have hope to be asked back in as time goes on (the tenor section is weak) but the church has a policy against "people like me" serving in a leadership role, which includes the music ministry.

I am undecided as to what to do. There are a few accepting people in this church but many have expressed their dismay, confusion etc over my transition, the pastor told me as much. One of the concerns was, of couse, the bathroom issue. Rather than be militant about it (I have not used a mensroom in several months), I agreed to use the unisex restroom in the fellowship hall rather than the womens restroom in the sanctuary. I wish to cause as little discomfort as possible and with this decission, I took away the concern parents had of their children using the ladies room while I was in there, I also reassured them, the pastor and the two church board members, that mo manner of dress would remain casual, nothing outlandish or flambouyant, that's just not me anyway.

A neighbor, at my former residence, introduced me to her pastor who accepted me from the beginning. I am a Child of God and a servant of the Lord. this pastor said I am welcome at his church, Grace Community. But I am not one to turn tail and run, as I said, I feel God called me to the UMC. What reason is now a mystery as I first thought it was for my music contribution, now I don't know. My current pastor has let me know that he is concerned with the individual but also has the larger concern for the whole congregation.

I continue to pray for God's wisdom, strength, courage and patience; for me, the pastor and the congregation.

Thank you again.

Laura Jane

[Guest Elizabeth K]

My current pastor has let me know that he is concerned with the individual but also has the larger concern for the whole congregation. Pure bigotry, he's going to hell! (joking - you know what I mean*)

I do want to add, being raised as a Methodist, the way you were treated in that Methodist Church is not typical. Many Methodist Churches accept us.

But I would NEVER stay where there is bigotry and prejudice, no matter what denomination.

I found a home in the Uniterian Universalist Church. There is also a good Methodist Church here in New Orleans, First Grace UMC, that I would have joined. It's unusual as it is a predominately Black and predominately White church that had to merge after the exodus for Hurricane Katrina cut the cities population in half. Now it also includes the Mexican Heritage people that came to help rebuild our city. It is an amazing church of true DIVERSITY! You would LOVE that choir!

Lizzy

(^what I meant is the Creator is going to have a looooong talk with this guy after he passes on)

[Svenna]

Karen,

I wish you the best where ever you are called to serve...

Remember, though, Jesus once departed his own people in Galilee because he could work no miracles there due to their 'lack of faith'. To me, this illustrates how difficult it is to good works amongst those that doubt and deride...

If Jesus left such people behind without accomplishing much, how can we expect to succeed under similar circumstances?

Hopefully, you already know the odds of success and are well-equipped for the realities that will likely follow...

Best to you as you sort it all out..

Svenna

[JJ]

Your pastor is going against church policy as I understand it and bowing to members of the congregation instead. If it were against policy for people like us to serve in leadership roles then why allow them to be ministers? Unless there has been a change I am not aware of since the transman minister got national attention and I never heard that there was negative fallout within the church.

Is there another Methodist church anywhere near you? Even if you somehow convinced the pastor or got him corrected for his attitude you would still have the situation with the congregation.

So sad that this is happening.

You have my thoughts and prayers

Johnny

[JenniferB]

I attend a reconciling UMC. They are very accepting of me.

Jenny

[Guest kelise]

So much unnecessary stress. I really feel for you. You clearly know what's right in terms of the trans issues. Why do you accept nonsense from this pastor? Why do you allow him to hold this power over you?