Time for a reality check. What you can expect from the Mormon church.

[Guest (Lightsider)]

1. A good level of tolerance if:

a. You have never married and don't have children and come out as trans.

b. No one knows you previously as your birth gender.

2. A good amount of disdain should the following occur:

a. Have been married. Especially in the temple.

b. You have children

c. Have the priesthood especially the office of Elder.

d. Been on a mission and taken out temple covenants.

e. You try and transition in a "Ward" people previously knew you as male. (Or female if you are FtM)

Now if you do happen to present well as your chosen gender, that will work well in you favor. Why? Because it is one thing less the bishop has to deal with.

Now here is the best case scenario.

Say no one knows you and no one sees your transition and you move into a new ward. This was my case. I was accepted by my local leadership and was treated with love. I presented very well as the gender I was meant to be. Here are the restrictions placed on me. 1. Could never attend the temple. 2. Never allowed to work with the youth. 3. The church in salt lake city refused to update my records to reflect my updated birth certificate. That meant their records continued to reflect my birth gender and name. That means I would have to tithe in my birth name or anonymously donate.

Simply put even in the best case you will have restrictions. And every new bishop and every new Stake president will be apprised of your situation. If you move into a new ward you will be required to RETELL your story to a new bishop. Which can and will lead to off base questions that are really none of the bishops business. You will be constantly reminded that you are not really a woman or man in their eyes because of this process. You will never be allowed to serve in a position in the church working with youth because as far as they are concerned you are no better than a child molester and a risk. You will never be allowed to hold a position in the priesthood or Relief Society because you are not really the gender you claim to be.

You will be constantly reminded of this and there will be no real progress for you as a person. A person can sit there and claim they have a testimony but the truth of the matter is a testimony is simpler term for "Been Brain Washed" into believing the whole church story is true. There is more scientific evidence backing up how people become transgender than there is the church is some one and only TRUE CHURCH. You have to accept on FAITH the church is true yet reject who you really are in order to fit in %100 into the church. You have to create a testimony that God the Father and Jesus his son visited some farm boy with a burning in the bosom.

If this was some true church you would be allowed to be who you really are with out all these UNLOVING restrictions that creates more mental stress and pain.

Now here is the worst case scenario. Say your transition creates a divorce and there are children involved and you attempt to transition in the same ward every one knows you in.

1. Church court (of Love) This can result in excommunication.)

2. Church members will not be loving and accepting

3. The church will never even meet you half way and address you as the gender you feel you are.

4. Your family will most likely turn on you.

And it can get worse...The bottom line is ..do not fool yourself into some idea you will be accepted at any point 100 percent. It simply will NOT happen. Now if you decide to live this life of being trans and an active member of the LDS church that is your choice. I wish you the best. But I will plainly tell you...you are deluding yourself and can live a far more richer life with out churches restrictions if you have the courage to leave it. The church is not the center of the universe and there are other sources of truth. At best a testimony in GOD and Jesus Christ is far better than have a testimony in some "CHURCH" that has a very questionable back ground of oppression."

I may update this post as time permits as I wrote this early in the morning.

[Cyndee]

I could not agree more with my friend Nicole. Having endured their programming growing up. You can have the faith and not be subjected to all this mental abuse. There are good things about the mormon church and they teach good values. It's the social structure of this church that allows for little variance when it comes to gender (binary extremism). Participating in the LDS church and being out would be like dropping a battery on your toe, over and over......

C -

[Guest]

Ah...Yes. I have always had problems with my Mormon neighbors living next to me for many years. None need to be stated here. As I began to transition, their view is apparently that Satan has arrived. It's so sad that they and the people all around my city from that church, constitute the bulk of the "Hating Eyes". Loosing my house and moving away may be a very good blessing for me from God. I will be glad to leave LDSville.

I wish you all of God's love. Hug. Jody

[Guest Evalyn_G]

I was raised a member of the RLDS which is a branch off of the LDS church. My family came out of the RLDS church and rejected its teachings when I was 8. My uncle has a ministry aimed at members of the RLDS church and has written several books in a critical view of their history and belief systems. If you are questioning your faith in the LDS church you may find his resources helpful in analyzing some of your concerns. His website is http://help4rlds.com/index.htm

[Guest (Lightsider)]

Hi, Evalyn you would be the first RLDS I have actually met. We should get together in email and compare notes as I really do not know much about the RLDS and always wondered what happened way back when to cause a split. Thanks for the link. :-)

[Guest Dana R.]

My understanding of the reasons for the RLDS split is as follows:

The death of Joseph Smith, There were some who followed the quorom of the 12 and Brigham young as president and prophet. These became what is the mainstream LDS faith.

Another group, including Emma Smith, and others, believed that the prophetic line should pass to the eldest son of Joseph remained in illinois and formed the RLDS church.

As an aside, I know that if I choose to transition that having any connection at all to the church will be difficult at best. and conceivable volatile and poisonous, however I am not yet ready to turn my back on these things, not sure if I will be, I was trying to express that before. I am not trying to offend or harass, I am trying to sort through my own feelings on the church as opposed to my identity. You have not been able to find a balance, I probably won't be able to either, but I feel like I must try.

The attacks on the church here if phrased differently would not seem so harsh and make me feel as if this isn't a safe place for a believing member to come to explore their feelings. The Church and its members can be intolerant, I knew this long before I knew what I was.

I am trying to be respectful and hope it is coming across that way, some of the rhetoric against the church that I have come across in the mormon subforum has felt like a personal attack against me as a believing member, I know what I am does not mesh with the churches teachings, and trying to come to some balance may be an exercise in futility, but I feel like I have the right to make that journey, and while I would love to receive your support as I make it, it feels as if some would rather attack my intelligence for even making the attempt.

[Guest Dana R.]

What I am trying to do or be I guess here, is a source of knowledge on doctrines and church history, as I was an active member until the age of 23 and still attend occasionally. I did serve a mission.

I fell into inactivity as I entered into military service around the same time as my feelings of dysphoria began to surface heavily and I recognized them for what they were for the first time.

I don't know where I am going right now, I'm trying to figure it out, and was hoping this would be a safe place to work through my issues.

At the same time I hesitated to "come out" as a mormon on here because I have read the backlog and have seen some of the more heated discussions, I really am trying to avoid that, I just need help to sort through the disconnect with what I feel emotionally and religiously.

[Guest (Lightsider)]

Hi Dana, please understand what I say about the church is not an attack on you. I know how you can feel that way because I was once there. But that journey is behind me. I see over and over the same things said and I have a strong knowledge of the church and how it sees and treats people like us. I am not here to candy coat what they do or why they do what they do. I am not going to pretend that they do not brain wash their members, because they do. And part of your struggle whether you see it now or not is a fight against that programming they forced upon you. When you break down how they teach their members it is brainwashing. Take for example the little child who bounds up to the podium on Fast and Testimony and says "I know the church is true and that God Lives and that Jesus is my savior and that Joseph Smith was a prophet of God." All in the name of making Mommy and daddy proud is a form of brain washing through repeating a belief as proven truth over and over. Take note of the use of the word KNOW. The word "BELIEVE" is not an accepted word to use in the church because it leaves room for critical thinking to occur.

If you go back through all my posts as far back as 2008 you will read about my journey and where I am now. It might even save you a world of pain. But then again you might be the type of person who needs to suffer before you truly understand what is going on here. And trust me, I do not want to see that happen to you.

You have the right to make the journey. I did. But when all is said and done, just know that I warned you. And do not question why you lost many valuable years getting to get to your end point because you tried to live who you are and please the church at the same time.

In case you were wondering....I don't smoke, drink, do drugs, and I am celibate. I follow my own moral code that is on par with the Mormon churches. The buzz that often happens when some one "LOSES" their Testimony that some one has fallen into a life of sin is a way to control the masses. "Oh did you hear that Brother Jones left the church? Yeah I heard he started smoking." is all too common of a judgement made by members to come up with a REASON some one would abandon their testimony.

Any way. Please do not think I dis-like you. I am just going to be point blank with you on things.

[Guest (Lightsider)]

"Dana: What I am trying to do or be I guess here, is a source of knowledge on doctrines and church history, as I was an active member until the age of 23 and still attend occasionally. I did serve a mission.

I fell into inactivity as I entered into military service around the same time as my feelings of dysphoria began to surface heavily and I recognized them for what they were for the first time.

I don't know where I am going right now, I'm trying to figure it out, and was hoping this would be a safe place to work through my issues.

At the same time I hesitated to "come out" as a mormon on here because I have read the backlog and have seen some of the more heated discussions, I really am trying to avoid that, I just need help to sort through the disconnect with what I feel emotionally and religiously."

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You are safe here. Like I said in the other thread I am just not going to candy coat things. I have been there...done that....have the t-shirt. I have a deep concern for you and your welfare.

[Guest apostate79]

I was raised a member of the RLDS which is a branch off of the LDS church. My family came out of the RLDS church and rejected its teachings when I was 8. My uncle has a ministry aimed at members of the RLDS church and has written several books in a critical view of their history and belief systems. If you are questioning your faith in the LDS church you may find his resources helpful in analyzing some of your concerns. His website is http://help4rlds.com/index.htm

The only thing worse than Mormons are other "christians" who feel that they need to save Mormons from "going to hell".