On Trans Fakers

[Guest Bellexia]

It is possible... them faking could also be them trying to hide it completely out of shame.

They could also be pedos or chasers.

They could be trolls or sociopaths.

When the internet was created, all the drama came with it. Double edged sword. If someone RP's as a trans it might be different than making this huge persona on a forum etc. Some people are bored, who knows why people do what they do, personally I do not care for their reasons or if they choose to spend their free time with this. That list however is very very very vague, many things there could be applied to others without them actually being "fakers" I for one pass 100% even if I am not a pretty girl so to speak, I think I am, the amount of times I was hit on says so. *shrug* my best friend is incredibly beautiful and passes 110% I am online 100% of the time, no job means lots of downtime. What else do I do with my time when I am not spamming applications and doing interviews and my exercising? I do enjoy this forum, enough so that I like to see what people are posting, even if I am a complete tard sometimes I do like it here and many times I have been helped through my issues. BUT I can see it being useful in it's identification overlap.

There was one person I can think of, they claimed they were a girl the entire time, for an entire year on this one forum. Then they were finally caught about it, turns out it was an inside joke between them and some friend. *shrugs* To each their own.

[Guest Maria_B]

I try to give everyone the BoTD, even if I hold some reservations personally.

I've probably met a faker or two, but none of them have been outed to me, I think. I met some girls through mutual friends who I had a hard time believing, but they just sort of faded away without a sound, rather than the emotional build up listed in the ''spot a faker'' list.

I was skyping with them way back when, and they looked gorgeous, sounded perfect, had full well developed breasts. But then again, I think I sound good (Think being the operative word here), I know a transgirl who is absolutely gorgeous (by that I mean, thin, tall, social stereotype irresistible), and know more than a couple with full well developed breasts.

Suppose its alien enough being Australian that I never will meet anyone (except for the few aussies representing us! Woo! *high fives*) that I don't really need to go ostracizing other people based on suspicion.

Also, I'm so beyond way off topic now.

[Guest Lauren W]

It's EXHAUSTING pretending to be someone else. I attempted an online persona as a female for about a year on WoW in college, and by the end of it, I just felt like an incredible faker.

I actually have years of experience with this exact kind of thing. Throughout my earlier teenage years - from around 12 years old until I stopped really playing WoW - I played the part of a female on WoW. It was never anything malicious or to get jollies off or whatever. It was actually quite simple and is the very reason I'm more likely to give someone the benefit of the doubt and let them be who they want to. The reason was the following:

The internet has always been the only place in this entire world where I've been able to actually be myself without fear of judgement or ridicule. In day to day life - going to school, at home, with friends and so on - I've always had to wear a metaphorical mask and repress aspects of myself that would get me ridiculed. Until very recently due to a mixture of denial and just sheer ignorance I didn't even considering being trans an option. It probably sounds cliche or stereotypical or something, but I've known for years that I wanted to be a girl, and online in games like WoW were where I got to express that and actually be who I felt I should be.

Having been what some would probably consider a "faker" and knowing my own reasons for doing it, I'm probably more likely to give someone the BotD and/or get duped by them. With all that said, though, I never once created some huge persona for myself to play. I was simply myself, with only two small differences: instead of being seen as a male, I was seen as a female, and instead of hiding aspects of myself in fear of ridicule, I just acted like myself. But yeah, that was just my two cents on the whole "pretending to be female in WoW" thing, although for me it was never really pretending and I was never really being anyone but myself.

In regards to people pretending to be trans, I can't possibly fathom why they would want to do that, but then again I can't fathom why a lot of people do a lot of things that seem stupid to me. I suppose that, just like with everything, it requires either being careful and trusting very few people, or trusting those you feel deserve it and running the risk of being hurt in the process.

[~Nova~]

Way back when when the net was new I would join chat rooms as a girl. I was terrible at it, maybe because I was being real and that's the exact opposite of what they wanted. They wanted fakes and pretenders. I'll never know.

The oddest part of this whole thread... IMO is that we are all really just fakers. PLEASE DON'T TAKE THIS WRONG, but we will never actually be the opposite sex we were born. We can have surgery, we can dress and talk and live as the opposite gender, but in reality, truth, we are just pretending. I know that's a hurtful statement and it's truly not meant to be. I'm in the same little boat as all of you and trust me, I mean no malice. I live as a woman. I have BF's (Finally) coming out of the woodwork. I go out with the girls and group with the girls when the larger group separates.

I'm completely comfortable in my role, but that's what it is, a role.

Again, please do not take what I'm saying as bad, it's not. I'm happier today than I have ever been in my life. I smile, I laugh, I do everything I always wished I could, but deep deep down inside I can't change what I was...

Back on topic. Some people are just hurtful pathetic humans. Why choose this tiny little group? very sad.

[Guest Maria_B]

Was just going through these thoughts today, Nova.

Doesn't matter how close I get to who I am, I'll never be there. There will always be some government or legal issue that demands me to out myself. Its inescapable.

But, I'm happier. I'll never be what I should, but at least I can be happy. I can live with being happy.

[Guest KimberlyF]

The oddest part of this whole thread... IMO is that we are all really just fakers. PLEASE DON'T TAKE THIS WRONG, but we will never actually be the opposite sex we were born. We can have surgery, we can dress and talk and live as the opposite gender, but in reality, truth, we are just pretending. I know that's a hurtful statement and it's truly not meant to be. I'm in the same little boat as all of you and trust me, I mean no malice. I live as a woman. I have BF's (Finally) coming out of the woodwork. I go out with the girls and group with the girls when the larger group separates.

So we are of course fake prior to transition, and its your opinion that we're fake after? So someone born trans can never be real?

And again, people who make up fake personas do not do it just on boards like this. They do it on any board on the net. Coincidentally just a few days back I read an article on the most popular cartoon in the history of the New Yorker mag which was made 20 years ago.

http://m.washingtonpost.com/blogs/comic-riffs/post/nobody-knows-youre-a-dog-as-iconic-internet-cartoon-turns-20-creator-peter-steiner-knows-the-joke-rings-as-relevant-as-ever/2013/07/31/73372600-f98d-11e2-8e84-c56731a202fb_blog.html

[Guest DianeATL]

Obviously there are some who are predators or evil and that is a bad category.

But this thread reminded me of a section in Warrior Princess where Kristin had to go to group therapy at the VA and was totally put off because she thought a lot of the Vietnam era guys were faking their war stories.

The author was kinder to them noting, their stories may be fake but the pain and PTSD could be real.

The non predator fakers could fall into that category. They have confusion and dysphoriia of some type but can't express it geniunely because of a number of reasons, fear of being outied, not understaninding it well, shame, or others. They may even have a deep admiration for the trans communitiy because of the strength to step out and do something about their issues, something this faker can't do in real life.

And yes, I have been duped before on the internet and it makes your feel violated. I have gotten better at vetting a person on line.

[Guest Jenni_S]

Way back when when the net was new I would join chat rooms as a girl. I was terrible at it, maybe because I was being real and that's the exact opposite of what they wanted. They wanted fakes and pretenders. I'll never know.

The oddest part of this whole thread... IMO is that we are all really just fakers. PLEASE DON'T TAKE THIS WRONG, but we will never actually be the opposite sex we were born. We can have surgery, we can dress and talk and live as the opposite gender, but in reality, truth, we are just pretending. I know that's a hurtful statement and it's truly not meant to be. I'm in the same little boat as all of you and trust me, I mean no malice. I live as a woman. I have BF's (Finally) coming out of the woodwork. I go out with the girls and group with the girls when the larger group separates.

I'm completely comfortable in my role, but that's what it is, a role.

Again, please do not take what I'm saying as bad, it's not. I'm happier today than I have ever been in my life. I smile, I laugh, I do everything I always wished I could, but deep deep down inside I can't change what I was...

Back on topic. Some people are just hurtful pathetic humans. Why choose this tiny little group? very sad.

Then why bother? If I'm wrong before transition, and only playing a role afterwards, what is the point of it all?

[Guest Bellexia]

The oddest part of this whole thread... IMO is that we are all really just fakers. PLEASE DON'T TAKE THIS WRONG, but we will never actually be the opposite sex we were born. We can have surgery, we can dress and talk and live as the opposite gender, but in reality, truth, we are just pretending. I know that's a hurtful statement and it's truly not meant to be. I'm in the same little boat as all of you and trust me, I mean no malice. I live as a woman. I have BF's (Finally) coming out of the woodwork. I go out with the girls and group with the girls when the larger group separates.

So we are of course fake prior to transition, and its your opinion that we're fake after? So someone born trans can never be real?

And again, people who make up fake personas do not do it just on boards like this. They do it on any board on the net. Coincidentally just a few days back I read an article on the most popular cartoon in the history of the New Yorker mag which was made 20 years ago.

http://m.washingtonpost.com/blogs/comic-riffs/post/nobody-knows-youre-a-dog-as-iconic-internet-cartoon-turns-20-creator-peter-steiner-knows-the-joke-rings-as-relevant-as-ever/2013/07/31/73372600-f98d-11e2-8e84-c56731a202fb_blog.html

That's the weird thing, in the time I posted on a well known image board, I wonder how many serial killers, or criminals, famous people, stars, politicians perused those chans all the while hiding their identity. What is identity? Is it what we make? to appease others? How often do we see drag queens adopting this role of what they believe to be female, just over the top stereo types. How many fakers are out there, we are all fake in some way, we wear this mask to hide our truths. I have somewhat cast aside my mask in lieu of being me. That is why many people here just dislike me, I make no qualms or care what others think of me. I was at a time afraid but truth be told nobody will care in years to come.

I was at a meeting the other night, tg obviously, probably the last one I will ever go to, I sat there, taking it all in, taking in the cross dressers and others, this over the top female persona they adopted to replace their own. This utter falseness, the irritation I felt like this was so alien to me, I have never been anything but me, even my "mask" there was a lot of truths to it, the cracks revealed so much. Back to the point, for the first time ever, I didn't want to be around people, I had to get up and get a smoke because I genuinely felt like I was going to profusely vomit in self defense. The assault upon my senses as I realized, just coming to the meeting I myself was being fake. I would never be caught dead in one before, so why now? Were the words of the therapist this important to me, her advice, go to a meeting. I did. Was it so important to me that I would risk my ego?

In the words of Marilyn Manson's song Organ Grinder.

"I wear this -------- mask because you cannot handle.

here is my real head."

[~Nova~]

Way back when when the net was new I would join chat rooms as a girl. I was terrible at it, maybe because I was being real and that's the exact opposite of what they wanted. They wanted fakes and pretenders. I'll never know.

The oddest part of this whole thread... IMO is that we are all really just fakers. PLEASE DON'T TAKE THIS WRONG, but we will never actually be the opposite sex we were born. We can have surgery, we can dress and talk and live as the opposite gender, but in reality, truth, we are just pretending. I know that's a hurtful statement and it's truly not meant to be. I'm in the same little boat as all of you and trust me, I mean no malice. I live as a woman. I have BF's (Finally) coming out of the woodwork. I go out with the girls and group with the girls when the larger group separates.

I'm completely comfortable in my role, but that's what it is, a role.

Again, please do not take what I'm saying as bad, it's not. I'm happier today than I have ever been in my life. I smile, I laugh, I do everything I always wished I could, but deep deep down inside I can't change what I was...

Back on topic. Some people are just hurtful pathetic humans. Why choose this tiny little group? very sad.

Then why bother? If I'm wrong before transition, and only playing a role afterwards, what is the point of it all?

Because WE are what we are. People wear different masks all the time. Some never take them off. Women put on make up, wear garters, they wear whatever to mask they need to fit their real selves. We have no choice. WE have to play the role to be happy. Why do we do it? Simple, because the genetic role we were given isn't real either. We have a choice, play the genetic role and be miserable, or play the TG role and be happy. I'm in TG mode and always will be.

We all have different roles we play in life. At work, I play the strict scientist... woooo. But let me out of the office and take off that lab coat and watch out.

Please don't take what I'm saying as a negative, it is NOT meant that way. Be happy. live your life as you want and play the role you want, whatever it is.

[Guest KimberlyF]

Maybe this is how all TGs think? I don't presume to speak for all of them myself, and am not one, but it is an interesting theory.

[Charlize]

I love the truth in saying we are all a bit fake. it is certainly true in many ways. Look at me(but not too closely). I wear a wig to hide my baldness, take hormones to do all their magic, dress as a cis female. Fake! perhaps to a great extent but for me it is my life and i'm growing to accept it and whatever joy i may be given. I don't see the harm except where and when i have hurt those closest to me, like my wife and son. I am on a path over which i have what seems to be no real control. Whether i was born in the wrong body or just can't accept it is beside the point. I'll go on pretending. There is a great saying in a group i belong to....."fake it till you make it". For me at this point that is my motto. It gets easier each day to feel less like i'm faking and more like this is just me. The rest of the world seems to be convinced so maybe it's time for me to accept as well.

I can't fault anyone who is posing as a female, male, or whatever. We even have a new pope who just said he could not be the one to judge. Maybe i can learn to follow his lead and be comfortable with others and myself.

Hugs,

Charlie

[Guest Caliana]

Sooo, let me try to understand this seeing as im confused. If someone is young pretty and passable, their a faker? This makes absolutely zero sense to me. im pretty and young, not sure im passable fully so I am seen as a faker? i would be more than willing to show i am who i am anyday, to anyone on here. sounds like their could be some jealously towards younger transitioners to me..

Nikki.

Jealousy,maybe. I know if I could have transitioned when I was in my teens or early 20's, I would have been young , pretty and passable. Instead I covered up my femininity and grew up with a lot of unresolved issues. Now I'm playing catch up.

No, I believe in transition as early as possible. Be young and pretty, Nikki, it's wonderful!!

[Guest Jennifer T]

I brought up the idea of our authenticity in a thread once. Maybe here is a place to discuss it? I think there is a difference between someone who sets out intentionally to deceive others by pretending to be something they aren't. But when a child, who believes he/she has to fit in or behave a certain way to survive dies so, they aren't trying to deceive anyone. And then when they grow up and have lived life a certain way for do long, isn't that person they've become a part of who they are? I think Jennifer and T are both legitimate. T isn't who I'd have chosen to be had I felt I had another option. But he is a part of me and his accomplishments in life are real.

What do you think of your own?

[Guest Jenni_S]

We have no choice. WE have to play the role to be happy. Why do we do it? Simple, because the genetic role we were given isn't real either. We have a choice, play the genetic role and be miserable, or play the TG role and be happy. I'm in TG mode and always will be.

Then this is the fundamental problem. You never see an end, that this can never be overcome. I do. I was born transsexual. I did what was necessary to achieve congruence of body and mind, which is female. I don't have a "mode," that is me. Ask the son that calls me Mom if it's a role, or that's what I am.

What you are doing is taking that away from me, and anyone else that has done the same. No matter what I say or do, you will not accept that I am anything other than a transgendered person playing a role. Ironic, given how much importance is assigned to our right to determine our identity. With what you're saying, I actually don't have that. I am not female, and never will be.

No matter how much you don't mean it that way, taking away my identity and telling me we have no choice but to play a role, is breathtakingly insulting. If you want to live in a role, a series of masks, fine. But don't tell me everyone else is. They're not.

[Guest KimberlyF]

Maybe some of this is tied into how people view themselves?

I was me at 5 and I was me at 16, 25, 35 and 40 before I took my first estrogen pill. I lived in fear of expressing myself all the time but I was always me. And there are MANY ways of self-expression. I think this ties in a bit to the topic because I'm sure a majority have logged into other boards or played games as their identified gender with absolutely no intent at hurting others.

And I don't think a woman who puts on makeup to look nice to present herself is being fake. I also know many women who put on zero makeup. And I have a few friends where if an emergency hit, they'd toss on sweat pants and put their hair in a pony tail and come over ASAP to for example help w/a sick child at 3 am. Wanting to look nice at the appropriate times and places isn't fake.

[Charlize]

Please forgive me if i have offended anyone. It was certainly not my intention.

I am in no way saying that when we transition to be ourselves we are anything other than ourselves. I hope i didn't come across with that thought. For years i hid and many of us have. It has been painful coming to this point of acceptance and change. I wish i was without any doubts as many seem to be and maybe that will come with time. I've never felt more right than i do now. It may be a role but perhaps as Shakespeare says "all life is a stage and we are but players". At the same time this is me and i am a woman and no longer a man. I played that role and in the end it certainly didn't fit. My life now is literally beyond my wildest dreams. An attempt at real honesty got me here and hopefully will carry me through some of the rougher feelings and spots.

Hugs,

Charlie

[Guest Dillinger]

I've three things to say on this topic as it is something that has really been bothering me lately but not for the reasons it probably bothers other people.
Firstly, I never knew this issue even existed until a few days ago when a possible faker was questioned relentlessly in the chat. This person was subject to rigorous attempts to disclose information about themselves that no one should have to and was openly, yet passively, accused of lying. This to me was very troubling as I go to the chat room for camaraderie and friendship, for a discussion or maybe just pointless rambling, but not to see an entire room of people turn against someone. After all, who are we to question someone's identity. If they identify as trans then maybe it is not our job to try and sniff them out. Maybe even if they are role-playing, a dastardly thing to do here, it is because they are really questioning their identity. Who knows. Point is, we don't. And we shouldn't make it our personal mission to tell someone they are not trans enough to be here if that is what they claim they are.
Secondly, it is very odd that someone would choose to role-play themselves into this situation. I'm not denying it happens because I know it does. People are weird and want attention. But the idea of just boldly BSing people online really confuses me. I am a person who takes everything anyone says at face-value... which gets me into a lot of trouble online. But I only a few months ago realized that people are just straight up liars even about the stupid stuff when I was reading someone's FB profile and it was full of complete lies. Their mother said to me, "Well don't you fudge a few details on you Facebook?" And I said, "What is the point?" And what is the point here? I mean, admittedly, we all or most of us portray ourselves as the person we'd like to be seen on here which may very vastly from what is seen elsewhere on the net, but that is simply because here we are able to be ourselves more so than in social media etc... But does that make us fakers elsewhere? How much do I need to disclose about my personal identity to be valid on the internet? Just a thought.
Thirdly, I live in constant fear that people are going to turn on me for not transitioning, for having pictures of myself as a female, and for not being overly discontent with my physical form enough to do anything about it here and in other trans groups. The idea of being labeled a faker is all to real to me because I simply feel not trans enough and I have no proof that I am who I say I am. If our word isn't binding, than I've nothing to prove myself. And so when I here about fakers and how they are ostracized from the community I feel like it is only a matter of time before someone grabs a pitchfork and runs me out of town on sheer basis of ignorance. Though I never lie about myself and consider myself trans, have told my story and my reasons for doing what I do, I still feel inadequate and can't help but wonder where the line is drawn. Am I trans enough to be here or will I eventually be cast out as a faker? Will a whole room teem up against me with questions I can't answer?

[Guest Sarah Faith]

I really think no one has any business to judge others. We all make mistakes in our lives, and we have all spent a good period of time lying to others, Yes it does hurt to feel like one has been lied too but who truly knows what brings "fakers" to do what they do.. Cruel Trolls? Or lonely individuals seeking attention and some form of validation?

I don't think you can point to someone and claim they are a faker just because they came out of transition completely passable there is not some perfect trans mold that makes us all exactly the same, or have the same life experiences. It is better that we trust people based on what they say, because you can't just stare at every young transitioner, or pretty trans woman and assume by default that they are fakers or really anything else. Does that mean we might get burned a time or two? Sure.. but that's life.

I have seen many fakes, a few here over the years, over time their stories change get so over the top it is a wonder anyone believes them.

I have posted this a few times over the years and for the most part it is pretty accurate especially looking at it after the person is outed as fake.

Twenty hallmarks of fake trans personae

http://www.tsroadmap.com/early/transgender-hoaxes.html

Paula

Some of that is accurate, and some of that is really downright insulting. I personally find number 8 insulting, not all of us are employed or even fully functioning social people which then leads me into finding number 7 insulting... some of us ARE disabled or are struggling with crap and trying to get to normal. That leads me to number 13 being insulting.. I genuinely have lost over 150 pounds to get to where I am at today.

Personally I've been a shut in since I was basically 15, and while I have made great strides towards getting out of that pattern I still currently have no job, and really don't have that much to do until I get moved.. So what do I do? I spent a lot of time Online,on forums, or MMOs.. Furthermore whoever writes that needs to understand that just because its uncommon for them that most trans around my age play games or MMOs quite often.. Infact many of us used MMOs pre-transition to be able to present in some form as our actual gender.

I was also very very overweight, socially crippled, and I could in all rights have been on disability.. I have made huge strides to get to where I was to where I am.. Number 9 is also pretty damn insulting too.. While I my self am not a huge fan of anime, the majority of people I know my age are.. and I know many "furries" my age as well..

I have to say that the more I read that article the more I feel it can be with out a doubt be labeled as ageist garbage. Yeah some of those may be pretty good warning signs, but many of the others just make snap judgements based on behaviors that the author has no actual experience with... and clearly since the author and their social group are not active in such things then clearly this means that their own behaviors represent the rest of us. No.. Just no..

I love the truth in saying we are all a bit fake. it is certainly true in many ways. Look at me(but not too closely). I wear a wig to hide my baldness, take hormones to do all their magic, dress as a cis female. Fake! perhaps to a great extent but for me it is my life and i'm growing to accept it and whatever joy i may be given. I don't see the harm except where and when i have hurt those closest to me, like my wife and son. I am on a path over which i have what seems to be no real control. Whether i was born in the wrong body or just can't accept it is beside the point. I'll go on pretending. There is a great saying in a group i belong to....."fake it till you make it". For me at this point that is my motto. It gets easier each day to feel less like i'm faking and more like this is just me. The rest of the world seems to be convinced so maybe it's time for me to accept as well.

I can't fault anyone who is posing as a female, male, or whatever. We even have a new pope who just said he could not be the one to judge. Maybe i can learn to follow his lead and be comfortable with others and myself.

Hugs,

Charlie

I think in transition we are actually trying to achieve being genuine and true.. I personally feel like whenever I had to don the male mask that I was lying, I often refer to it as "the lie".. Now that I am out and full time I personally feel like for the first time that I am being truthful with everyone in my life.. Really though almost everyone in this day and age is fake somehow.. That is all modern beauty is.. a lie. Look at the hollywood celebrities we all try so hard to emulate, they usually have hair extensions, extensive plastic surgery, make up any time they leave the house, they have caps put on their teeth to give them the perfect smile.. Being "fake" is not a trans trait.. It's a human trait.. So in truth I feel that all we are doing is attempting to be true to who we are. You wearing a wig is absolutely no different then a hollywood starlet wearing hair extensions to achieve big thick beautiful hair.. I think you have a lot to be happy about Charlie, you really are a great lady.

Hugs,

Sarah

[Guest KimberlyF]

Some of that is accurate, and some of that is really downright insulting. I personally find number 8 insulting, not all of us are employed or even fully functioning social people which then leads me into finding number 7 insulting... some of us ARE disabled or are struggling with crap and trying to get to normal. That leads me to number 13 being insulting.. I genuinely have lost over 150 pounds to get to where I am at today.

Personally I've been a shut in since I was basically 15, and while I have made great strides towards getting out of that pattern I still currently have no job, and really don't have that much to do until I get moved.. So what do I do? I spent a lot of time Online,on forums, or MMOs.. Furthermore whoever writes that needs to understand that just because its uncommon for them that most trans around my age play games or MMOs quite often.. Infact many of us used MMOs pre-transition to be able to present in some form as our actual gender.

I was also very very overweight, socially crippled, and I could in all rights have been on disability.. I have made huge strides to get to where I was to where I am.. Number 9 is also pretty damn insulting too.. While I my self am not a huge fan of anime, the majority of people I know my age are.. and I know many "furries" my age as well..

I have to say that the more I read that article the more I feel it can be with out a doubt be labeled as ageist garbage. Yeah some of those may be pretty good warning signs, but many of the others just make snap judgements based on behaviors that the author has no actual experience with... and clearly since the author and their social group are not active in such things then clearly this means that their own behaviors represent the rest of us. No.. Just no..

Hugs,

Sarah

Sarah,

Im not going to tell anyone how they should emotionally respond to a link, but I think maybe this list is being taken the wrong way. The very first one says trans woman. Just because I fit into that box doesn't mean I take any offense. It is a list of norms for people who are fakes. Just like if the FBI had a profile for a certain serial killer and started with white male. It doesn't mean that every white male is a serial killer. Or all SKs are white males. It's a starting point.

Andrea James is involved with trans kids, and works hard fundraising for them year round, and at one point I know that she was in the market for a PS3 so people my age play video games too. . from what I've seen, I wouldn't peg her as a technophobic ageist.

And speaking of getting older, you didn't pass #2 so 7,8, 9 and 13 aren't even about you. Nor are they about anyone else with any connections within the community (#6).

Again, the list isn't a proof. It's just things to keep ones eyes open for. I should take offense that nobody wants to fake being my demographic.

But honestly, people have. Just not as often.

[Guest Sarah Faith]

Playing Video games, spending a large amount of time online, is indicative of absolutely nothing beyond the authors preconceived ideas of what is normal, or not normal. People in their 20s in general spend pretty much all of our time online even not at home.. Sitting in a restaurant what are people usually doing? They have their smart phone within reach playing games, chatting with people, browsing websites. The author by using these as warning signs has basically just labeled almost an entire generation as fakers. The author can work with young trans as much as she likes, but that doesn't mean she understands them either doesn't mean she is even remotely interested in understanding them. I know many members who come to this very site who fit that mold and play MMOs, and video games alot.. It's not a sign of being fake, its an escape MMOs especially because of being able to socialize as female its like the chatrooms of the early internet but with an actual avatar. My therapist who works with people of all ages looked down on my hobbies because the simple fact is she couldn't understand them and couldn't step away from her own perceptions of what is normal or healthy.

World of Warcraft has attracted such a broad and diverse people from many different ages, social groups, backgrounds.. That saying that someone who plays World of Warcraft could be a faker, is like saying someone who likes lasagna is a faker. Its really not a very good sign at all and it just makes younger folks feel ashamed of their hobbies.

And I picked out several others that I thought were insane "red flags" I have a very well known post op friend that could meet even more of those "Red flags" and is one of the most aggressive pvpers in MMOs that I have ever met, and if I went by that list then I sure better be suspicious. I showed her the article and she too felt very offended! I'm sorry I'm sticking with my assessment that it is garbage, instead of keeping a check list to determine fakers and making judgements of people lets instead take what people say at face value.. If they are a faker they'll slip up eventually, and even if someone is a faker that is their problem and their issue not ours.

[Drea]

In my experience, those trying to ascertain if someone is fake or not end up getting subjected to seeing what they expect to see. Taking a statement to mean one thing when it could mean a few other things or just be bad phrasing and then saying it contradicts something else they said when it may be consist when one of the other interpretations are used. Except in specific circumstances it is hard to establish and no matter how unlikely some story may sound sometimes unlikely things do happen.

It is far easier to establish someone is not fake.

What I find interesting in this discussion is it almost sounds like some are saying fakes are okay. Am I hearing that right? Let me pose the question, if an online identity is proven to be fake, should that person still be welcome to continue in their fake persona? Giving out advice based upon supposed experience? Telling people to come out? all the sorts of stuff that one might see on a support site all the while bolstering the perception of any expertise based upon some fake experiences they have talked about?

[Guest Jennifer T]

Dillinger, I just read your response. Ive also witness an on line group, not trans related, single someone out and turn on them because they chose not to believe that person's story. I couldn't do that. To this day, I do not think that person was lying. Could I be wrong? Certainly. But it really must suck to put your heart out there and have people step all over it. I can't do that.

Like you've said of yourself, I'm probably not trans enough for some. But I know my own heart, and I know who lives in there. And she's beautiful.

Peace to you this day.

[Guest Bellexia]

I am going to agree with Sarah on the list. The list as a whole is too vague, over reaching and likely made by some old person who is completely out of touch with the youth. It's almost something that was made in the early 90s. I could take that list, scan over any particular person, let's say I choose anyone here, and half of that list will apply. That list is so broken and insulting that I almost wish I could tell the person who made it what an inept waste of bandwidth they have created.

[Guest Lauren W]

Furthermore whoever writes that needs to understand that just because its uncommon for them that most trans around my age play games or MMOs quite often.. Infact many of us used MMOs pre-transition to be able to present in some form as our actual gender.

I think a lot of people underestimate just how true that is. For a lot of younger transitioners, the internet serves as a place where we can just go and be ourselves without fear of ridicule and hate. I'm speaking solely from personal experience here, but for me playing and identifying as my preferred gender in WoW was the very first step on my road to fully understanding and being myself. Where in real life I had to put on that male mask and be a person I didn't want to be and deep down knew I wasn't, on the internet I could remove that mask and just be myself.

A lot of people are wondering why "fakers" do it, and it is quite simple. I'm sure a few of them actually are predators of some kind, and those ones do in fact deserve the treatment they get, but the majority aren't predators of any kind. They're just sad, lonely people looking for a place they can belong and be happy. I know that for me, World of Warcraft and whichever online boards I visited back then - if any - were the places I could do that. Although I had friends in real life and was very rarely bullied, I never truly felt I belonged, whereas online, where I could simply be me, I was actually happy. Sad as this sounds, it was the only place in the entire world where I actually was happy. It still is to some extent. I'm sure it'll change once I actually begin transition and eventually go full time, but even to this day the internet is the place where I am truly happy, simply because I can be myself. The idea that people get shunned, ridiculed and hated for that is an abhorrent and disgusting one in my opinion. I'm honestly of the belief that if someone wants to identify as a particular thing, let them. As long as they're not harming anyone - and they very rarely are - there are absolutely no issues.

I could go in to detail about the list you mentioned in other parts of your post, but I don't feel I need to. You summed it up perfectly, in my opinion. I will say this one last thing about supposed "fakers", though. If anyone is wondering why they continue to hide and don't tell you their physical gender, it is because they are absolutely terrified of the repercussions of doing so. Back when I played WoW I had some wonderful friends. They knew me as a woman and never knew any different. At times I felt terrible and felt like I was lying to them. I wanted to tell them the truth, but I was so terrified of losing this safe, happy place I'd created for myself in a world of unhappiness and depression that I never ended up telling them. And I think that is a completely reasonable thing to do. The fact is that the moment people find out, the majority of them are going to freak out and shun the person who has been identifying as a gender they physically are not - despite whether or not they are mentally that gender - and most of the time will no longer allow that person to be their friend.

And that is why people do not tell those they get close to most of the time. It is a choice between keeping up this "lie" - although I don't consider it a lie because most of the time they're just being themselves - and actually being happy, or telling those they've befriended and losing that feeling of safety, community and happiness.

My final thought before ending this post is this: you don't know the kinds of issues people online have in their real life, and you probably never will know if they don't tell you. I had a whole bunch of issues in my real life; issues that I just wanted to escape from. So much of my time as a school kid from age 11 or 12 onward was spent finding ways to escape reality and sink in to a different world; a world where things weren't so screwed up and terrible. Reading fantasy novels, playing online games like World of Warcraft, writing creatively. All of it was simply to escape reality for a few short hours before having to face the world again. I'm not saying this looking for sympathy or anything; I'm using it as an example. As I can only speak of my own experiences, I am forced to use my own experiences as examples.

I'd strongly suggest that the next time any of you come across someone you think might be a "faker", don't get out the pitchforks and torches. Instead, just let them be, because you don't know the kinds of issues they may have or any of their motives for doing what they're doing. If they do prove to be a predator or some other kind of person with malicious intent, then you can feel free to get out the pitchforks, but until you know for sure, don't create some kind of witch hunt. I'm sure the last thing anyone wants is for the community they enjoy to turn in to the Salem of 1692.