Judge: Religious Freedom Says Drs Can Deny Care to TG Patients

[Carolyn Marie]

http://www.teenvogue.com/story/judge-ruled-doctors-can-refuse-patients-transgender-abortion

Taken to an extreme, a Christian cardiologist could deny me emergency care if I had a heart attack.  Freedom in that case might mean the freedom to die.  Perhaps that's the message being sent.

Carolyn Marie

[Charlize]

My first cardiologist was just fine until i transitioned.  I had told him about it during the exam prior to my first visit as myself.  When he saw me he said he'd thought about it and would care for me regardless.  Thanks?  I started to look for someone else but it took a long time to find.  He was a good catholic and a decent cardiologist.  My new doctor is better, both as a doctor and human.  Who knows how it will be for others but fortunately more decent medical facilities are finding acceptance and compassion even for folks like me.

 

Hugs,

 

Charlize

[MarcieMarie12]

Well, I hope the Catholic church looses its case in New Jersey. That will make things interesting for the courts....I also think professional organizations like the AMA should condemn medical practices that decide to refuse treatment based on religion.

[Jani]

21 minutes ago, Charlize said:

He was a good catholic and a decent cardiologist.

I have to disagree with your opinion that he was a "good" catholic.  I was raised in that faith and was never taught to discriminate.  More to the point, if he was only a "decent" cardiologist that would be cause to move on and look for another doctor.  

The other day in a support meeting a member described their family as "decent" then processed to tell us of their homophobia, transphobia, racism.  I spoke up saying they need to reevaluate their definition of decent because these people did not sound like decent to me.  Upon reflection they agreed.  This imbalance added to the stress this person was experiencing.  Life is not always black and white but I believe in calling things as they are.  

Jani 

 

[Tejana]

2 hours ago, Carolyn Marie said:

http://www.teenvogue.com/story/judge-ruled-doctors-can-refuse-patients-transgender-abortion 

Taken to an extreme, a Christian cardiologist could deny me emergency care if I had a heart attack.  Freedom in that case might mean the freedom to die.  Perhaps that's the message being sent.

Carolyn Marie

It behooves me to state that the commentary that follows the link in the above quoted post is inaccurate.  I've spent most of my life around hospitals.  Not since at least the early 1980's has it been permissible, or even acceptable, for a hospital emergency-room to deny care to anyone who entered their doors, regardless of whether the individual possessed insurance or not, regardless of whether the individual was here in the US legally or not, regardless of whether the hospital was a children's facility & the patient was an adult...or vice versa, regardless of whether the hospital was a public or a private faciilty.... A patient who comes to a hospital emergency-room must have their condition stabilized before discharge from said emergency-care facilty.  If the particular emergency room cannot meet the emergent-care needs of a particular patient, then that patient must be transferred to another facility if at all possible through a formal, Federally-mandated, process known as a Memorandum of Transfer (a process which prevents hospitals from "patient dumping", among other things).

Yes, an individual medical practitioner could refuse to accept someone as a private/ambulatory/non-emergent patient, but never could an emergency room or any of its staff legally refuse to provide at least stabilizing treatment to any patient.

I am hopeful that my reply to this thread's initial post might perhaps allay at least one of the extreme fears that may arise from this particular federal judge's ruling, in this particular case.

[Guest]

OK, what does this tell me? As a people, we are totally moving backwards due to religion. Wow........

[Guest]

The problem is people have no problem violating the constitution, they know most people can't afford to fight them.......

[Briana]

20 hours ago, Carolyn Marie said:

Taken to an extreme, a Christian cardiologist could deny me emergency care if I had a heart attack.  Freedom in that case might mean the freedom to die. 

That WOULD be the extreme.  However, they'd also loose their license to practice, get sued, and possibly face a criminal charge.  ...And should. 

Looking at this from the other side, one might want to consider who they see for healthcare if that's the practitioner's attitude.  While it's hard to choose your care providers in an emergent situation, in other situations you have a choice. 

[Briana]

...And what Tejana said.  She explained it very well.  While not a perfect mandate, the EMTALA act is pretty clear in the requirements for emergency treatment.  It's been good at ensuring people in need of emergency care receive appropriate treatment in some form.   Prior to it being fully enacted, in some hospital ERs there was a lot of 'NIMER' & 'GTFOH'* patients.  Unfortunately, we humans are very good at manipulating and twisting and sometimes dragging out feet - even those that treat fellow human beings.  

*Not in my ER & Get the beeeep out of here

[Guest]

22 minutes ago, Briana said:

That WOULD be the extreme.  However, they'd also loose their license to practice, get sued, and possibly face a criminal charge.  ...And should. 

Looking at this from the other side, one might want to consider who they see for healthcare if that's the practitioner's attitude.  While it's hard to choose your care providers in an emergent situation, in other situations you have a choice. 

Oh please, just like a job, they won't admit the truth, they will lie and get away with it.  

[MarcieMarie12]

One of the problems is that in some hospitals, transwomen are roomed with men and vice versa--and if they can pull out a religion card on that well..... It is interesting to note that about 1/3 of transgender persons in the recent study had felt discriminated or harassed by medical professionals.

[Guest Alicia Rose]

3 hours ago, Fiona said:

OK, what does this tell me? As a people, we are totally moving backwards due to religion. Wow........

Yep.

[Jani]

Isn't it ironic that we're fighting religious zealots (ISIS) overseas yet this argument of religious freedom is raging in our country.  Granted they're not suggesting loping off heads but one thing can lead to another, first discrimination then incarceration.  Sounds eerily like a scenario that played out in the early 40's. 

Jani 

[Briana]

Maybe Fiona, but unlike most jobs if your actions lead to harm there's usually some pretty serious consequences.  Not just "you or you and a handful of people" would know what happened.  Everything we do in healthcare is documented...or at least should be.  The presence of, or lack of documentation gets things started.  Case mangers go over it to make sure care was appropriate etc.  Add to that, at least every week patient outcomes are reviewed by a group of peers and "discussed" to make sure best practice/evidence based practice was followed.  And all moralities are specifically reviewed. 

And most importantly, there's the patient and family.  When things don't go the way they think it should have - what they expected, usually the complaint and accusation bell starts ringing.  Start with hospital admin and add a simple quick and easy phone call to your state health department and let the games begin.

Just like in a criminal case, it's sometimes it's hard to specifically prove that someone's actions caused harm so yes, someone can get away with some inappropriate care.  However, even barring something specific hospitals, state boards, and practice groups can still restrict privileges.  Regardless of life outlook, values, and beliefs, few healthcare people want to work around or with someone that truly discriminates against patients to the point where there's patient harm.

[Guest]

Well, Briana, you may be correct. however, I suspect that they could if they chose to.