Confussed

[Guest Gates]

i feel confused in weather i am an Androgyne or not

i feel that i not fully female and that i want to bind my breasts but am unsure if that because i hate the fact my breasts are big but i dont want to be fully male either

but i like wearing dresses as long as i have trousers on underneath it . most of the time i wear trousers with a hoodie over it

to hide most of my top half

some times i feel i want to cut my breasts to make them go

i don't understand what i am

please can some one help me

Gates

[Sally]

Oh, Gates,

I would love to be able to just tell you right where you are in the gender spectrum and then just what to do, but I can't.

I am not a trained therapist and you are in the most difficult (in my opinion) area of the spectrum, being neither and both genders at the same time.

It is a balancing act that I'm not quite sure how to pull off.

But soon some of our androgynous members will come by and offer some advice and a little help, we'll all offer our support and understanding.

I always suggest seeing a therapist trained in the transgedered area, but for you that is imperative most therapist will have a clue to how to hwlp an MTF or an FTM, but Androgyne is new to most of them.

I hope that you can find someone to help you find your true self.

Love ya,

Sally

[Guest Elizabeth K]

Sally has that one right. You would need to have a gender trained specialist give you advice... but

WHATEVER you are - you are perfectly fine - so don't worry too much about labels. You really only need a diagnosis so you can see what options you may have.

We have many androgynous people here at Laura's and they do just fine - and i wonder if it's actally harder to deal with Androgyony than Transsexuallity - i mean I am transsexual and i have a definate direction of transition and I am pursuing it vigerously. It seems a contridicton to say, but sometimes i feel it is much easier to change gender, that to balance somewhere in-between.

But - DON"T CUT! Not on your own. I won't work and you might mess up a really good future male chest.

Hope this helps...

Lizzy

So strange - I am working so HARD to get what you cannot abide! go figure...

[Guest androgynous]

Suffice to say that I'm not therapist either, but my personal view about the idea of having thoughts about physically changing your body permanently is something notably to pay attention to, because I too have sporadic ideas of growing breasts as male, but I know deep within me that I would never do that, it stays with a mood swing dreaming about having a nice set!

Of course, sometimes when I fit woman's clothes, I sometimes wish that thing that gets in the way -or in plain view- was gone, but again it never crosses my mind to actually make that change a reality. It stays with an idea, or better: mood swing.

So personally, my idea is that one has to find out if that idea is occurring just in a whim of thought, or if it is seriously bothering (haunting) oneself. because that could give some more clues on whether or not you are androgynous in thought.

As always, take good care of yourself!

LOVE!

[Guest Gates]

Thank you for your replies

i try and not cut but the feeling to do it is strong at the moment

i will try and talk to my dr about this and see if they refer me to see a Therapist

i will try not to label my self as i think that what is confusing me so much right now

Gates

[Guest Ryles_D]

You might be something else, too. People have started graphing gender on a graph that looks something like this:

As you can see, there are a lot of choices. Everywhere that isn't one or the other is considered "genderqueer" or general non-binary, so don't feel like you only have one option. And not everyone fits on the graph, either, some people dont' feel they have a gender identity.

I am not a trained therapist and you are in the most difficult (in my opinion) area of the spectrum, being neither and both genders at the same time.

I don't think therapists know how to deal with non-binaries. My ex-therapist hadn't even heard the term "neutrois", and plenty will force you to be one or the other if you want to transition. I know someone who's also neutrois and was forced into an MtF trnasition that they now have to figure their way back out of to get what they actually want.

Being non-binary is different, definitely, and it might be harder to pinpoint- but it's not a bad place to be. I'm not sure if anyone is neither and both genders at the same time- I imagine you could be, though, a type of genderfluid- maybe?

[Guest Elizabeth K]

GATES!

Darn it - DON"T CUT!

It's addictive - it's stupid, it labels you in a way you don't want to be labeled

Just don't do it...

And look - I started this journey a long time ago - I wanted to do some work - get rid of some things - well... I even had the stuff - stolen from a hospital. I just wanted to show up at the ER - ooops, giggle - look what I did! quite by accident you see... had that all planned.

TONS of blood and I had just started! I WAS GONNA DIE - pure and simple. I didn't but I sewed up with unsanitary suture - I survived.

I never tried again, it's too violent - and slice and dice - ha - what does that get you?

DON"T CUT!

Lizzy

[Guest Gates]

i am a self injurer so i do have times were i do cut and some times were i have an urge to cut but there are time were don't do it at the moment am not wanting to cut my breasts and if i get the urge to do so i will post about it and seek help

thank you for your replies there is a lot i need to think about and i will take my time over it

my husband said to me to choice something and see how it goes at the moment i am going to be known as a bigendered female

Gates

[Guest Cazz333]

You might be something else, too. People have started graphing gender on a graph that looks something like this:

As you can see, there are a lot of choices. Everywhere that isn't one or the other is considered "genderqueer" or general non-binary, so don't feel like you only have one option. And not everyone fits on the graph, either, some people dont' feel they have a gender identity.

I don't think therapists know how to deal with non-binaries. My ex-therapist hadn't even heard the term "neutrois", and plenty will force you to be one or the other if you want to transition. I know someone who's also neutrois and was forced into an MtF trnasition that they now have to figure their way back out of to get what they actually want.

Being non-binary is different, definitely, and it might be harder to pinpoint- but it's not a bad place to be. I'm not sure if anyone is neither and both genders at the same time- I imagine you could be, though, a type of genderfluid- maybe?

I am that do right in the middle of the graph.

Wearing female and male clothes helps to balance out the female part and male part in me. e.g. male small- medium shirt and two sizes big skinny female jeans. I was looking through some random articles the other day and came across some weird terms the other day: masculine- energy grown up and feminine energy grown up man.

According to the article, the masculine energy grown up man takes charge and like to protect and lead. The feminine energy grown up man likes someone else to take the lead and prefers to be taken care of mostly. A bit of a follower really. It got on my nerves because neither man sounds attractive to me.

"THERE'S A BIG DIFFERENCE BETWEEN "SENSITIVE" MEN.

There's a man who's "sensitive" - meaning

he's sensitive to US.

There's a man who's "sensitive" - meaning

he's primarily in touch with his own feelings,

looks to us for support, and basically appreciates

our strength.

And there's a man who's "sensitive" -

meaning he's all about his own feelings and

couldn't care less about ours.

Let's call the man who's sensitive to US a

masculine energy, grown-up man.

Let's call the man who's in touch mostly

with HIS own feelings, but appreciates our

support, a feminine energy grown-up man.

And let's call the man who's all about his

own feelings and couldn't care less about ours a

"narcissist." Or, "boy-man" for short.

IF YOU'VE EVER BEEN INVOLVED WITH A FEMININE

ENERGY GROWN-UP MAN, you know what it's like to

feel incredibly frustrated.

Because, as sweet and sexy as he is, if he

really wants to be the "girl" in your relationship

- all the time - you're going to feel very stuck

taking charge and being the "man" all the time.

Unless you like being in charge and

responsible like the kind of "man" you want him to

be - all the time - and I mean all the time (in

crisis - he'll look to you to lead the way), you

may find yourself demanding, over and over, that

he step up and "act like a man."

But he doesn't want to.

He wasn't drawn to you in the first place

so he could step up and act like a man.

He was drawn to you for your strength,

organizational abilities, smarts, and

decisiveness.

He wants YOU to take charge and do the

THINKING - so HE can FEEL.

And, if that appeals to you - that can

really work.

If you have good communication going, you

can even negotiate enough that he'll agree to take

charge of some things so you can relax for a bit.

But, for the most part - it'll be YOU

rowing that relationship boat.

Still, a feminine energy grown-up man is a

grown-up, and a good guy.

He's not totally self-centered.

He's fun and engaging, and is capable of

being a good partner - as long as you don't ask

him to row the boat when he doesn't feel like it.

WHAT ABOUT A BOY-MAN?

With a boy-man, you never know what you're

getting from one moment to the next.

A boy-man not only wants you to row the

boat and take charge and THINK so he can FEEL, he

wants to take charge, too - all at the same time!

So, if he doesn't want to row, he won't

let you row, either!

You'll be stuck, dead in the water in the

middle of the lake.

Now, with a feminine energy grown-up man,

if no one's rowing the boat, you could still be

having fun.

You could dangle your feet in the water,

or play cards, or laugh and look at the scenery.

But with a boy-man - he'll pout.

He'll tell you it's cold out there, and

he's hungry, and he wants to go home. Then he'll

stare at you to row the boat. And get angry with

you, or go cold and withdraw, NO MATTER WHAT YOU

DO.

And when you finally agree to pick up the

oars, he'll push you away because he doesn't like

the way you row.

He'll spend the whole trip telling you how

to row.

He won't touch an oar, but he'll tell you

how to do it, and why he can't.

" Rori Rye - she's a dating coach/ writer but it stuck to me.

I guess why it did was because it was opposite to what I want. I suppose she for got a 4th category: the masculine AND feminine man. It's probably because I'm in the 4th catergory as a woman. I like to lead and follow in equal measure. Sensitive and tough is best how I can describe myself.

[Guest androgynous]

@Cazz333

I find that piece you posted from that writer way too stereotyped, if it was written for the late '30ies I would agree. But things have changed, surely some parts are correct, but often you will find that both genders like to switch roles, or even lead where the other will follow. So I find it a bit too black and white, that said I never thought that a male is 100% male and a female is 100% female, alas, gender is mostly a social construct c.q taught behavior.

[Guest androgynous]

i am a self injurer so i do have times were i do cut and some times were i have an urge to cut but there are time were don't do it at the moment am not wanting to cut my breasts and if i get the urge to do so i will post about it and seek help

thank you for your replies there is a lot i need to think about and i will take my time over it

my husband said to me to choice something and see how it goes at the moment i am going to be known as a bigendered female

Gates

Gates, I hope you'll take it a bit easy. I have no experience with what you talk about, so I can't say anything about it to comprehend it. Though, my hunch is that if you are toying with such ideas, the best idea would be to find help. Set aside the activities, and focus on yourself. You are important.. Take some time off and loosen up those thoughts.

[Guest Angel21]

thank you for your replies i am trying not to think about this at the moment

untill i see my PDoc next month as i need refeered to a therapist.

Angel

Moderator note - GATES is now using ANGEL as the profile name - and this defaults on earlier posts.

[Guest Valentine]

You might be something else, too. People have started graphing gender on a graph that looks something like this:

As you can see, there are a lot of choices. Everywhere that isn't one or the other is considered "genderqueer" or general non-binary, so don't feel like you only have one option. And not everyone fits on the graph, either, some people dont' feel they have a gender identity.

I don't think therapists know how to deal with non-binaries. My ex-therapist hadn't even heard the term "neutrois", and plenty will force you to be one or the other if you want to transition. I know someone who's also neutrois and was forced into an MtF trnasition that they now have to figure their way back out of to get what they actually want.

Being non-binary is different, definitely, and it might be harder to pinpoint- but it's not a bad place to be. I'm not sure if anyone is neither and both genders at the same time- I imagine you could be, though, a type of genderfluid- maybe?

Where did you find that big chart thingy?