Just venting. Scientific paper.

[DonkeySocks]

I accidentally came across a paper when I was searching for something else. It was from 2020 and actually posted on the nih website, a site I have gotten good information from before, and I skimmed it, knowing from the title I probably shouldn't do so, and I was furious. I'm venting here. The whole premise was that transgender persons are hiding from something else, and that their therapists are also hiding from various other issues which they then project onto their trans patients, and everybody makes a huge mistake together by going through with trans treatment. It looked like it tried to sort of weasel out of saying that being tg doesn't exist--but it implied it. You know what it thinks ftms are hiding from? Homophobia! That we would be normal, healthy, female girl woman lesbians if it weren't for homophobia on the part of both the tg person and their therapists! I'm a gay man! I wondered decades ago, back in high school, before I knew being a ftm could be a real thing, whether I could be a lesbian, and it never felt right. This published scientific paper implies I don't exist, and/or that if it's not homophobia I'm hiding from by being tg, it's one of my other issues. But that just--I'm practically foaming at the mouth. I only look straight because I was afab! If I could "push the button" to be male I would, and then I would appear gay to everyone! If homophobia is my problem then I shouldn't be trans at all, yet I am!

 

Okay, I just--it just really ticked me off. Since the writer was Freudian, I suppose that means I'm really getting defensive because  I'm wrong.

[DonkeySocks]

Okay one more thing because I can't say it to the author of the article, and if I could it wouldn't be worth it: this entire argument sounds like a different kind of phobia. Transphobia. I don't think you need to look deeper for any other thing to be hiding from. This paper makes it so incredibly complex--first someone has to have a problem, then they have to sublimate it into their gender, and also their sexual organs (again, author is Freudian), then they have to seek to fix it, and they figure out tg would be the answer! That's right, it's easier to be trans than to be gay! And then their therapist also has to be dismissive and unconsciously phobic of the real, secret, hidden, sublimated problem, and go along with the tg diagnosis. That's right--let's turn everything to do with being trans into sex-phobia, mother issues, and homophobia. There is one encompassing word for this convoluted approach in this article: Transphobia. Just admit it. Grrrr. I'm sure they got angry letters, but they were certainly very patronizing about them--after all, anyone who disagrees is sublimating something into their genitals. (Also--this is another one of those writers who thinks all trans persons want to have surgery and meds. Otherwise their theory doesn't work.)

[Guest]

Hello,

 

I would not be too wound up on this article. Much of the literature like this depends on qualitative research which can be interpretive and frequently has trouble coming up with anything concrete. Opinion pieces pervade the literature. There are ample studies demonstrating the legitimacy of what we go through, our challenges, and our need for care. Being transgender transcends multiple generations and multiple races, religions, and cultures. That does not stop anybody from shooting from the hip saying whatever they want. Many of us had the overwhelming that we were the opposite gender/sex/entity at ages so young that there is little to no likelihood of sexual awareness. We just knew. I would just shrug it off. Be your most genuine self and let the chips fall where they may. 

 

Sincerely

Katie

[DonkeySocks]

5 minutes ago, Katie23 said:

Much of the literature like this depends on qualitative research which can be interpretive and frequently has trouble coming up with anything concrete.

Katie, everything you say is true. I should calm down, and your reply helps. I actually was going to post another mini-rant about the article. It has an instance of that extremely insulting approach of using quotes around the chosen gender. I won't go into detail on that because your post putting this into perspective has helped and I'm going to go cook dinner.

[Guest]

DonkeySocks, 

 

Have no fear, we are on solid ground. As long as people breathe, there will be a little kid somewhere who realizes that their soul is in the wrong wrapper. We may never know why this happens and that is okay. There will always be haters. Have fun and enjoy the journey. Do not let anything trip you up on your journey. It is your journey and nobody else's journey. Good Luck!

[VickySGV]

My first question is when the paper was actually written, and what age its footnotes and references gave to it.  You say the person was a Freudian believer, and by now that puts their ideas one and a half centuries ago.  Freud did make a try at understanding human behavior in a way that was a first, and needs credit for that, but like all things scientific changes have occurred, and some of his ideas proved just plain wrong.  You do not say who the author of the infuriating piece is, but if they have not kept up with developments in regard to his patron saint (sarcasm) then the opinions and thoughts you read are no longer valid except to that individual and some people who are not effective scientists either -- ok, they are H8ers.   One of the new events that is very helpful is that Trans people are now in the ranks of Science and Medical Care, both physical and mental, and they are the ones finding out we are not "SICK" but very normal and very much part of the human race as we are.  They are looking for ways to help us live in society as we are, proud and HEALTHY which the other side is fuming about because they consider us Sick and in need of a CURE.  So far they have a perfect record of NOT finding a cure. 

[DonkeySocks]

3 hours ago, VickySGV said:

My first question is when the paper was actually written, and what age its footnotes and references gave to it.

Vicky, it was a 2020 paper and it used the word "woke"--in sense that it is used when the writer fears "woke" people. He also trotted out the "protect the children" refrain that has been popular. The more it kind of filtered back up through my mind while I was doing other stuff, the more it proved to be so ironic that it was pathetic. The way the writer twisted himself into knots trying to justify his transphobia, while accusing other therapists of other phobias of their own. He had one section that was: "So this study said most trans people are satisfied with the outcome of their treatment"--and then he spent a paragraph saying more or less, "but I'm sure that study is wrong". What upset me was that I ran across it on the NIH website, where I've found a lot of good info before. I do not know what the requirements are for publishing what amounts to an opinion piece as a scientific paper. Yes, he had about a million references, but every conclusion he drew amounted to "because Freudanism" and "I knew this one trans person who was my patient once."

 

4 hours ago, Katie23 said:

As long as people breathe, there will be a little kid somewhere who realizes that their soul is in the wrong wrapper.

So true, I love that thought, Katie. Not that I want kids to feel dysphoric, but rather that sense of awakening it implies.

 

4 hours ago, VickySGV said:

Freud did make a try at understanding human behavior in a way that was a first, and needs credit for that, but like all things scientific changes have occurred, and some of his ideas proved just plain wrong.

Yes indeed, it's a very interesting school of thought, and some of it holds true, and some of it needs to be thrown out instead of clung to. The author of the article was very threatened by the medical treatment of trans people to affirm gender--but he worded it as if he was afraid for the safety of the trans kids. You are probably familiar with the style of "concern" he was displaying. It caught me at a very dysphoric and vulnerable moment and I got mad.

[VickySGV]

31 minutes ago, DonkeySocks said:

You are probably familiar with the style of "concern" he was displaying. It caught me at a very dysphoric and vulnerable moment and I got mad.

"Concern Trolls" are a royal pain in the hemorrhoids to be sure.  Another site I am on is a frequent target of that type of person.  Freud's Psychoanalysis approach is not used by my friends in that group who are various types of doctor (medical, PhD Psych, Med Science etc.) and who at the minute are ganging up on one Concern Troll who is consulting with many politicians in places where laws against the treatment of pre-adults for being Trans are being pushed, against the statistics of harm that failing to treat them produce.  

[DonkeySocks]

5 minutes ago, VickySGV said:

"Concern Trolls"

That is a useful term that I had not heard before.