Florida: "Misrepresenting" Gender On Drivers Licenses Is Fraud, Changes Now Banned

[KymmieL]

3 hours ago, Ashley0616 said:

 possibly search the car. My concern is they would be dirty and plant drugs or something else illegal in there. 

They would have get a judge to issue a search warrant. We would be waiting a long time as I would demand a lawyer and a paper warrant. I can be a real b!tch when I get mad. But don't plan on getting pulled over in FL. anytime soon. LOL

 

Kymmie

[Mmindy]

I use to do new employee training for a major tank truck company in North America. Our advice and company policy was to comply with the officers requests. There are so many simple causes for a reasonable stop by an officer. Lane management, slower than minimum posted, speeding, lights out, license plate obstruction. The key to a successful encounter with an officer is your own attitude. Be polite, have control of your paperwork, license, proof of insurance. Remember that an officer enforces the law as they understand it. They are not the point of argument. Court is set up for hearing your argument. Arguing or debating an officer or officer's supervisor is only going to delay your moving forward on the road. Take the ticket and move on. If you feel like you were wronged? The only place to complain or argue is with the Judge in Court. This means you'll need to have legal representation. In some cases a lawyer can work out your situation, without you being there. Another thing to remember if you get arrested on Friday, the Judge will see you on Monday. Truck-stop and bar-stool lawyers will cost you more money and time that just following the law. Are there officers out there enforcing the law incorrectly? Yes, however the only place set aside for you to debate the law, is in the Courtroom. Here in Indiana one of the most overlook traffic violations is an obstructed license plate. If that little plastic license plate ring you put on you plate that says have a nice day. If it covers any part of the State ID or Renewal Sticker? You are in violation and subject to a traffic stop. Remember the most important thing to set the tone of the traffic stop is your attitude. 

 

Be safe,

 

Mindy🌈🐛🏳️‍⚧️🦋

[Vidanjali]

15 hours ago, Ashley0616 said:

My apologies! 

 

No worries, dear.

[KatieSC]

I lived in Tampa for two years. I moved out in 2005 and have not been back for anything. There are many different hazards in Florida, but who knew it would be the Republicans and their incessant campaign to harass, marginalize, hurt us, and eradicate us that make the Rs the biggest lizards in the state. In coming up on the last 20% of my life, I wonder. Where does all of this end. Once they take us down, the rest of the population better watch out, because once you draft the hate legislation, it only takes a few minutes to search and replace using MS Word, and then print, sign, seal, and deliver the next group for eradication. I wonder when the idea of purity will be taught, and how the elimination of substandard others will foster a stronger race of pure Americans. Will they claim to have developed a blood test that can detect whether a child will be transgender? Would they just terminate a transgender child? 

 

I wonder which R politician will write their version of Mein Kampf. Anybody having any difficulty imagining our unelected dictators walking around in s_nazi, I mean snazzy black outfits with little pins and patches...

 

They use the licenses as another way to target us. What is to say they do not arrest us, and then put us in jail. A few years ago, there was a TV series called The Man in the High Castle. I encourage you to watch the first season or two. It will give you a unique perspective of how easy the rest of the country could just adopt a new normal so to speak. We are in trouble.

 

 

[Ivy]

5 hours ago, KatieSC said:

the elimination of substandard others will foster a stronger race of pure Americans.

Actually, the [unpleasant politicians] in Germany partially used American eugenics programs as a model.

[Vidanjali]

5 hours ago, KatieSC said:

...TV series called The Man in the High Castle. I encourage you to watch the first season or two.

 

This was based on the book by Philip K Dick which is one of my favorite books by him.  So I was interested in the show when it came out, but is much much more brutal and graphic than the book. It was too haunting for me to continue watching. 

 

10 minutes ago, Ivy said:

Actually, the [unpleasant politicians] in Germany partially used American eugenics programs as a model.

 

Moreover the same unpleasant politicians in Germany (can someone explain why the language filter censors that word?) were inspired by American Jim Crow laws.

[KatieSC]

When I watched that series, I saw so many parallels to how we are being treated. I feel a hopelessness that I never thought of before. It is like a slow moving avalanche, and so many in the population are just going along with it like our mere existence is the root of all evil. Does MAGA mean Make America Germany Already? 

 

So many states just keep legislating against us despite any rational thought, or overwhelming medical evidence. It is mystifying and terrifying. What is even more amazing is where all of this is emanating from. They treat our lives as inconsequential and make us into a threat that does not exist. What comes next? 

[Ashley0616]

Just got done with the first episode and wow! Very interesting twist!

[awkward-yet-sweet]

I've seen the Man in the High Castle series and while interesting, I think the applicability is limited.  No idea why the filter wants to censor words related to the political movement in question.  I use the original German acronym NSDAP (Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei) for it, which is only one letter longer and means the same thing. 

 

Our American attempt at totalitarianism has similarities to both the NSDAP and the Soviets, but is unique in its own way.  For one thing, we've got a two-party system that presents a grand illusion of choice.  It neither requires the awkward coalition system of the 1920s that the NSDAP benefited from originally, nor the in-your-face bludgeon of the single party that the NSDAP became later, which is also the characteristic of the Soviet system.  The two-party system is more insidious, as they play people off against each other.  Align mostly with the Republicans?  The Democrats are your enemy.  Align mostly with the Democrats?  The Republicans are your enemy.  I believe there's far more unity underneath the surface than they allow you to see.  One side will attack freedom on the surface, while the other attacks underneath. 

 

There's not much we can do within normal channels to change this.  Voting locally seems to have more effect than state or federal elections.  Inertia, the Deep State, and petty corruption seems to have the most influence at higher levels.  I think the best we can do in most cases is to protect ourselves and have common sense.  Avoid altercations, avoid things that make the cops look at you (like broken tail lights or speeding), and avoid places that you don't think are friendly.  Work with the system where you can, deceive it and hide from it where you can't.  Gather friends and chosen family, as there's safety in numbers.  Whether true freedom arises out of the ashes someday, or the world just ends when God fixes it...this WILL end at some point.

[Ivy]

I don't understand why everything has to be made so extreme.  I don't understand how not persecuting trans people automatically makes one into a tankie.

But that seems to be where we are these days.

It's discouraging how much "news" is merely propaganda.  Unfortunately too many people are unwilling to look outside of their particular "bubble".

[Ivy]

Florida Dem Congresspeople To Biden: Block Trans License Ban With Real ID Act

 

https://www.erininthemorning.com/p/florida-dem-congresspeople-to-biden?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=994764&post_id=141338924&utm_campaign=email-post-title&isFreemail=true&r=k5hac&utm_medium=email

 

"In a letter released Friday, every member of Florida's Democratic congressional delegation urged the Biden administration to use his powers to block Florida's driver's license gender marker ban for transgender individuals using the federal Real ID act. "

[VickySGV]

At the minute the R party has its guns out for Secretary Mayorkas which could make this situation even smellier.  If Florida digs in on this, the fact that the Real ID act came from the R party could be met with an amendment to that act by the R's.  It will make things slimier than they are just now and bring things to a stand still.  

[KatieSC]

I find it interesting that Florida clarifies that if one is intersex, they are not covered by the rule. One could argue that anybody who is transgender could very well have an intersex brain. The conventional wisdom was that it was the appearance of the genitalia, but in a number of cases way back in the olden days when children received surgery to live as female, they in fact had the desire to be male. Hence, the brain is the driver and not the genitalia. I am sure the Rs cannot understand that because there is no chapter in the Bible covering that.

[Ivy]

7 minutes ago, KatieSC said:

there is no chapter in the Bible covering that.

Guess that does cloud the issue.

[VickySGV]

Just wait the ink in the Florida version of the B was still drying and it will be on the legislative desks tomorrow.

 

[emeraldmountain2]

6 hours ago, KatieSC said:

I find it interesting that Florida clarifies that if one is intersex, they are not covered by the rule. One could argue that anybody who is transgender could very well have an intersex brain. The conventional wisdom was that it was the appearance of the genitalia, but in a number of cases way back in the olden days when children received surgery to live as female, they in fact had the desire to be male. Hence, the brain is the driver and not the genitalia. I am sure the Rs cannot understand that because there is no chapter in the Bible covering that.

I agree with you @KatieSC

[awkward-yet-sweet]

8 hours ago, Ivy said:

"In a letter released Friday, every member of Florida's Democratic congressional delegation urged the Biden administration to use his powers to block Florida's driver's license gender marker ban for transgender individuals using the federal Real ID act. "

"Real ID" is kind of squishy.  A number of states issue two kinds of licenses now - ones approved for use in Federal places and ones that aren't.  Mine (which is actually a CDL) even says on it "not for Federal ID."  Most DMV locations here can't print a compliant ID, and most people don't want to have to wait for one to be mailed all the way from the state capital. 

 

The way I understand it, the Feds only have the power to affect driver's licenses that comply with the rules for being useful as Federal ID.  A state could completely disengage from "Real ID" and just tell folks they need a passport or federal transport worker ID now to do things like air travel or access to ports.  Where I live, the vast majority of people wouldn't care a bit if the state made that decision. 

 

7 hours ago, KatieSC said:

I find it interesting that Florida clarifies that if one is intersex, they are not covered by the rule.

 

I am sure the Rs cannot understand that because there is no chapter in the Bible covering that.

 

Unfortunately, their definition of intersex doesn't include everybody.  It focuses mostly on chromosome disorders and externally ambiguous genitalia...neither of which applies to me.  Externally, I'm relatively female....the weird stuff is all on the inside.  And I've got the typical number and type of chromosomes.  There's no real medical explanation for how I am the way I am, even though medical imaging shows clear differences.  Ugh. 

 

As for the Bible - the principle is mostly that "form follows function."  A man is a man because of the ability to do the male part in reproduction.  Similarly for a woman.  Attempting to switch functions/roles is declared inappropriate....physicality is what counts, not brain.  What the text describes is completely binary without variation, as intended at Creation.  It describes God's intent, an ideal.  The gray area shows up clearly with people like me.  Due to my internal anatomy, it would take significant medical intervention to get pregnant (and might be a bad idea.)  So...was I really a female?  And since I can't do the male function, am I really a male?  People debate how far the general principles of Scripture can be applied to situations not described in the text. 

 

Personally, I can't fault more conservative folks for their interpretation of something unclear, or extending general principles in a restrictive way.  I believe that the USA was founded on Christian ideals, and I believe that's expressed in the Founders' writings.  However, those ideals were clearly left in a generic form rather than specifics, in order to avoid sectarian violence as occurred in Europe in the 1500s through 1700s.  There's an intentional limit in the Constitution (albeit rather unclear) on how those ideals can be translated into law.   

[Susan R]

On 1/31/2024 at 12:26 PM, hormonedifficientin2ways said:

Transphobic law makers will use the dumbest things as an excuse to oppress trans people. and a suspension or outright revocation of a drivers license? that can ruin people who rely on their car to get to work or straight up do their job.

@VickySGV covered the reason they’re doing this well...”Trans issues are flashy and good fodder for the ill educated and over manipulated voters…”  This gives the public the false appearance that these law makers are accomplishing something important when, in fact, they’re slowly tearing our nation apart. These law makers are going to continue to push forward until they get some major pushback in the form of a loss at the polls or funding pulled at some level.

 

The trans population is the easiest target right now and may continue to be so for the foreseeable future. Transgender individuals are just being slowly boiled to death one law change at a time and no one is jumping out of the pot because such a relatively small portion of the population is being affected at any given time. When collectively looking at all the legislation over the last 4 years, it’s horrifying how the nation has changed. For now, I’m lucky to live in a safe area but this movement is spreading fast and I don’t know when it’s going to stop.

[Ivy]

9 hours ago, awkward-yet-sweet said:

I believe that the USA was founded on Christian ideals, and I believe that's expressed in the Founders' writings.

I think it was rather formed from a background of "European Christian Culture."  Of course, the indigenous peoples had their own religion, but we know what happened to them - unless you are being educated in certain states.

Although it isn't said in so many words, it seems that a lot of people believe that "freedom of religion" only applies to christian sects.

6 hours ago, Susan R said:

For now, I’m lucky to live in a safe area but this movement is spreading fast and I don’t know when it’s going to stop.

I don't expect it will.  It's too easy to hate what you don't understand, and most cis folks don't understand us.  What scares me is the possibility that it might soon move to the federal level.

[emeraldmountain2]

1 minute ago, Ivy said:

What scares me is the possibility that it might soon move to the federal level.

Yes, if the right wingers take the executive branch this year, expect gender affirming services at the VA to stop, NIH and CDC funding to fraudulently claim transitioning is unsafe, no ability to change gender markers on passports and with Social Security, no Medicaid and Medicare coverage for gender affirming care, and more. Vote, vote, vote.

[Vidanjali]

Hey y'all. Please take a moment to let your voice be heard on this issue. Please see this new thread: