What Have You Learnt About Being A Man?

August 6, 2010

So recently I've bin learning a lot of stereotypical man type stuff. Bin building furniture and helping my dad fix up the loft as well as learning the rules of footy/soccer from the world cup and followin the premiership (for the record i am a manchester united fan, and have bin raised that way lol) so what im trying to say is what have u learnt during ur transition about manly type things that could help out those who dont know some stuff? for instance the offside rule in footy? american football rules? rugby? best way to use a drill? erm... what ever you can think of?

August 6, 2010

Well I learned that I am not very good at being a man.

Seriously though you should just start by reading up on sports all the time in the papers and internet. ESPN is a really great source for all sports. I really got most of my knowledge by doing this. I can tell you football aka soccer over hear is the same as there just not as popular. I played for over 15 years of my life and still love it but can't play anymore due to my right ankle kept getting injured. One nasty slide tackle did it for me and never was the same after that.

Now our version of football is the most popular sport here. Truly it is hard to explain to someone that hasn't followed it before. The object of the game is to move your offense down the field and either kick a fieldgoal or go in for a touchdown. Fieldgoal = 3 points and touchdown = 6 points. If you score a touchdown you can either go for two by trying to score again from 2 yards out or kick for 1 point. The rules of the game have gotten so soft that the players really can't hit one another without a penalty anymore.

Baseball is the national past time over here. I love baseball and go Rangers. Glad to have you Nolan and Greenberg. Good bye Tom Hicks.

I am sure others will have more to share.

August 6, 2010

It seems to me that I just want to be the man I've always been-interested in whatever has always been interested in. I don't happen to be a football fan -I know other men who also aren't.

I'd be exchanging one prison for another if I forced myself to become a sports fan.

I do enjoy woodwork and building things and wish I had a mentor thee because all I have learned is from books and experience. Sometimes experience has a high price w/ power tools:P

I don't care to talk cars either.

Now fishing is another story.

I guess what I'm saying is don't try to become a man-just be the man you are!

JJ

August 6, 2010

Actually, I think I knew all of those before I started properly transitioning, but the only reason I learnt the American Football rules is because I went through a phase in which I tried to learn everything about American culture I conceivably think of before I came here. I didn't really properly understand them though until I saw a match live (which I have now done).

I was one of those kids who liked to take things apart and put them back together, so the bit about drills I already had covered. One of my uncles spent a decent amount of time teaching me things like that when I was about 9-13, and my father was rubbish at it (didn't really have the interest), so I actually did quite a bit of that sort of thing around the house as I became older and 'more responsible.'

I've never done proper furniture building though, Rhys. Constructing purchased pre-made furniture from the box I've done, but never the real thing. What are you after building now?

August 6, 2010

I've never really been interested in professional sports. I'll wander along to an equestrian event if I happen to be nearby since I've done horse riding on and off for a long time. Never had the opportunity to watch american sports beyond a few thus-themed films - Remember the Titans anyone?

Constructing purchased pre-made furniture from the box I've done, but never the real thing. What are you after building now?

This is hilarious fun!

I used to be given the job of laying underneath the partly constructed wardrobe holding the backing boards up whilst drill bits and screws appeared between my fingers!

August 6, 2010

I love professional sports, play sports, have coached multiple sports (hockey, baseball, basketball). I love when I travel getting to watch and learn other sports. Worked in the UK for a short stint & traveled to NZ. So I picked up cricket (no, it's not REALLY like baseball), and I got more advanced in following futbol and rugby (though I already knew the rules). Anything that has competition and activity and strategy becomes interesting me, even sumo wrestling in Japan! So I love getting into sports chat with people who are like me.

There are guys who like only 1 or 2 sports and that's all they know about - and they are total experts. There are guys who read SI or ESPN enough to hold a conversation (How 'bout them Yankees?) and don't care. In the US, it seems like people expect guys to know about sports, but many don't care. Like it's ok to know who is playing in the Superbowl (American Football) except not actually know the players on the teams.

I think one thing that surprises me is how many guys say they like sports or play in fantasy sports leagues and don't actually know very much about sports. And I've discovered that I don't like talking about sports with people who are doing it as small talk or who aren't as passionate. Feels like a waste of my time.

Bottom line: if you're genuinely interested in learning, people will share, people will want to talk to you. If you're doing it to present, then ok, there are some basics to know to help. But no one should 'force' or fake a deeper interest in sports to be manly. It's obvious to people who really are passionate who is and who isn't.

August 6, 2010

I've never done proper furniture building though, Rhys. Constructing purchased pre-made furniture from the box I've done, but never the real thing. What are you after building now?

lol, well said, same here. IKEA ftw!

I grew up with parents who are huge fans of baseball, so I totally get baseball and can play a bit. They weren't into football though, so I am just now learning it because I feel I should not knock something if I haven't tried it, especially something that is stereotypically masculine I am changing schools and while my old school didn't have a football team so ice hockey was like their football - got me into ice hockey as well, those games are so much fun btw - my new school has a football team and I definitely plan on learning how the game works and going to games and such My dad, while as I said isn't really into football, understands it so I am making him explain it to me. lol. I understand the basic idea but I want to understand the game WELL, like as well as I understand baseball.

Also, I like bowling. I have thought about being on a team since I was like 10 lol but never really had the chance to form one or be on one... I am planning on joining the club bowling team at my new school this fall. In fact, there is a bowling trip tonight I am going to to just get back into it (haven't played in awhile) and to hopefully meet some people because i know all of 2 people at this school right now, one from high school and one from childhood, lol. So I am a bit isolated at the moment... anyways I digress haha. I think baseball and bowling are my sports but I definitely plan on following football (American) in the near future. Also planning on buying football video games (2 masculine things in one! haha) once I can afford to buy a game console. Oh yeah, and I also like video games but again haven't had much of a chance to play them b/c I've never had a console. So I also plan on playing more video games... I think I have a natural inclination towards them... additionally, I like to work out. Plan on doing that even more when I'm on T to maximize my muscle development.

Also, I have been into action sports since I was a kid. Have wanted to learn to snowboard since I was 9 but have only been once... I am committed to learning. Right now I am learning to longboard and I like to bike. I also want to learn to mountain board, skateboard, and possibly offroading.

Also, since I was a little kid I've liked things like puzzles (now, I love those big 500-1000 piece ones) and blocks. So I'm a bit of a builder even though I've had little to no experience with actual building, outside of Linkin Logs and Tinker Toys and blocks, lol.

August 6, 2010

I love professional sports, play sports, have coached multiple sports (hockey, baseball, basketball). I love when I travel getting to watch and learn other sports. Worked in the UK for a short stint & traveled to NZ. So I picked up cricket (no, it's not REALLY like baseball), and I got more advanced in following futbol and rugby (though I already knew the rules). Anything that has competition and activity and strategy becomes interesting me, even sumo wrestling in Japan! So I love getting into sports chat with people who are like me.

There are guys who like only 1 or 2 sports and that's all they know about - and they are total experts. There are guys who read SI or ESPN enough to hold a conversation (How 'bout them Yankees?) and don't care. In the US, it seems like people expect guys to know about sports, but many don't care. Like it's ok to know who is playing in the Superbowl (American Football) except not actually know the players on the teams.

I think one thing that surprises me is how many guys say they like sports or play in fantasy sports leagues and don't actually know very much about sports. And I've discovered that I don't like talking about sports with people who are doing it as small talk or who aren't as passionate. Feels like a waste of my time.

Bottom line: if you're genuinely interested in learning, people will share, people will want to talk to you. If you're doing it to present, then ok, there are some basics to know to help. But no one should 'force' or fake a deeper interest in sports to be manly. It's obvious to people who really are passionate who is and who isn't.

Sorry for the double post, I just now read this post.... yeah, I think most guys just take up 1-2 sports that they actually participate in and maybe 1-2 more that they follow fairly well. You don't have to be a total jock to be manly. You can be balanced between brains and brawn, which is kinda where I see myself actually. You know?

August 6, 2010

Sorry for the double post, I just now read this post.... yeah, I think most guys just take up 1-2 sports that they actually participate in and maybe 1-2 more that they follow fairly well. You don't have to be a total jock to be manly. You can be balanced between brains and brawn, which is kinda where I see myself actually. You know?

Word. I am both geek and jock.

Ice hockey is awesome (I play, so I am biased). You need to go to a live game to really get it. I take people all the time to games and they figure out what they've been missing! Now HD is helping convert new people to it on tv, at least.

Football is different from baseball in learning the strategy just by watching. You can never play baseball and learn the rules and nuances, and maybe they don't show cut-off positioning of players and maybe you don't appreciate the spin of different pitches, but you can basically GET it. Football on tv focuses the cameras only on where the play goes (or is supposed to - love it when a fake is so good it fools a cameraman). If you never played football, you don't pick up what coverages are or running vs. passing plays, etc., or how smart O-linemen have to be. Video games actually DO help teach that, to be honest. It can also help to watch high school level football or not crowded college games (e.g., D-III) to see the flow of how a team works together to set up a play and whether the execution works or not. Sitting in nosebleeds at Big Conference College or NFL doesn't give that same view either. Tv certainly doesn't, though HD & better replays have helped.

My building expertise is IKEA furtniture and LEGOs. Stupid home depot and lowe's don't carry building materials like that. Hehe. What I know is that most guys who build don't know what they are doing. You learn by doing. You have to be willing for things to not come out right and tinker with it. I hesitate at DIY projects & I have to ask - is it more important to have professional grade work done (e.g., structural integrity, not electrocuting myself, etc.) or to get experience and learn. Too often, I cop out, just cause I don't have TIME for as much DIY experimenting as I wish I could. Then, I look at an older family member who is a bricklayer and built his own house from scratch and it is so reinforced and overly designed that it would survice the nuclear holocaust. It is hard to remember that he didn't START that way, though! Like anything - sports, music, careers, you have to put in the time to get the results. Stupid hard work.

Oh, and I snowboard. Happy to teach/help a newbie on that. Riding in the mountains rules.

August 6, 2010

Word. I am both geek and jock.

Ice hockey is awesome (I play, so I am biased). You need to go to a live game to really get it. I take people all the time to games and they figure out what they've been missing! Now HD is helping convert new people to it on tv, at least.

Football is different from baseball in learning the strategy just by watching. You can never play baseball and learn the rules and nuances, and maybe they don't show cut-off positioning of players and maybe you don't appreciate the spin of different pitches, but you can basically GET it. Football on tv focuses the cameras only on where the play goes (or is supposed to - love it when a fake is so good it fools a cameraman). If you never played football, you don't pick up what coverages are or running vs. passing plays, etc., or how smart O-linemen have to be. Video games actually DO help teach that, to be honest. It can also help to watch high school level football or not crowded college games (e.g., D-III) to see the flow of how a team works together to set up a play and whether the execution works or not. Sitting in nosebleeds at Big Conference College or NFL doesn't give that same view either. Tv certainly doesn't, though HD & better replays have helped.

My building expertise is IKEA furtniture and LEGOs. Stupid home depot and lowe's don't carry building materials like that. Hehe. What I know is that most guys who build don't know what they are doing. You learn by doing. You have to be willing for things to not come out right and tinker with it. I hesitate at DIY projects & I have to ask - is it more important to have professional grade work done (e.g., structural integrity, not electrocuting myself, etc.) or to get experience and learn. Too often, I cop out, just cause I don't have TIME for as much DIY experimenting as I wish I could. Then, I look at an older family member who is a bricklayer and built his own house from scratch and it is so reinforced and overly designed that it would survice the nuclear holocaust. It is hard to remember that he didn't START that way, though! Like anything - sports, music, careers, you have to put in the time to get the results. Stupid hard work.

Oh, and I snowboard. Happy to teach/help a newbie on that. Riding in the mountains rules.

Oh yeah! I totally forgot about Legos. I loved playing with those. Still do (guess I still have a bit of kid in me.)

Yeah, it's hard to remember you have to learn by doing. It's like, guys weren't just born understanding these things better than we do because they were born male.... they just coulda been socialized differently and thus had more actual experience with these things. And not even all guys are raised equally anyways. It's a nature vs nurture thing - I posted a thread with that title several months back in which I basically said I was insecure about my masculinity because I feel that these things I haven't had exposure to make me "less male" than other guys who know more about it just because they were born that way. I try to remind myself it's not all biologically-based. So yup, gotta remember guys didn't start that way, and that we gotta work towards it. It's pretty much like we have to work towards being male! But in a way every guy has and we are just behind because of the fact we have grown up female (most of us ftm's)

August 6, 2010

lol, well said, same here. IKEA ftw!

I heard when the IKEA opened in Ballymun my parents spent like €600 or something like that, drove all the way home, and then realised that they didn't know how to put any of it together. My grandda had to go over and help them. I still laugh thinking about it

I like watching ice hockey on the telly. I think if I'd grown up with it I'd have liked to play, but it's not really a popular sport.

August 6, 2010

What I have learnt about men

Men often keep painful secrets close to their hearts. They may share little bits with a good friend on occasion maybe over a drink or two and to perhaps that one special woman/man they may let the tears show as they speak about it. Men keep a close watch over their own hearts.

When a man loves someone it is not to be taken lightly. When a man TRULY loves he REALLY does love with every inch of his heart, people see men as more distant to the romantic idea of love. But actually it's all about what I said above. We're keeping watch over our hearts. For when a man loves there is no turning back, and when a man loves and that love breaks it can change a man and the story no matter how bad will stick with him forever. He'll talk about it to his special person and always he will shed a tear. By no means does this mean he loves his current special person any less, just that they remember when they loved someone possibly as much possibly even more and they remember their mistakes and the pain still feels raw to them when they so much as just think about it or get a whiff of that same perfume. So women I warn you now, if you're gonna break a gentleman's heart do it quick but kind. For you will always stay in a man's heart and mind.

People think being a man is about sports. No. That is an outer thing of interest. Being a man is inside. It's a state of mind. It's a man's heart.

I've learnt that being a man you feel like you want to be a hero especially to any woman we may fall for. Even when they're long from our lives the remain a shadow that follows the man and sometimes he'll turn around and imagine endless possibilities. Some of them good some of them bad. And he'll want to save her from the bad no matter how much she may have hurt him. But he'll also accept that he can no longer do that for that person.

Men hunt, men fight. Sometimes we're hunting for food, as most people imagine. But also metaphorically we're all hunting for truth on earth, all animals sniffing out anything we can find sometimes just to comfort us for a time. We fight. We wage wars within ourselves, we wage wars with other men without even realising it. And by this I don't mean we all kill each other, although sometimes that would seem less painful....I mean we're hunting for many things and often competing with ourselves and other men for the same things.

August 6, 2010

I don't care to talk cars either.

Now fishing is another story.

I guess what I'm saying is don't try to become a man-just be the man you are!

JJ

I'd love to know bout fishing! my dad and uncles took me deep sea fishing and i got really into it but dont know a lot about bait and fish lol

I've never done proper furniture building though, Rhys. Constructing purchased pre-made furniture from the box I've done, but never the real thing. What are you after building now?

Once the loft is finished, me and my dad are gonna build my sister a desk. its gonna be a challenge because each piece can only be 60cm wide and my sister is an art student and works with all sorts of materials and A1 pieces of paper for her design work, and u cant get anything like what she needs flatpacked so me n my dad are gonna construct it. iv got an idea on where to start but im just a diy enthusiast so my skills are limited lol

My building expertise is IKEA furtniture and LEGOs.

Lego is amazing! and ikea has made my lift a little easier while iv been building my bedroom lol built a dvd tower myself and my own desk that is built into a built in wardrobe that i gutted first. but obviously beds and wardrobes are a bit more advanced for me

I;m into soccer and fishing and i dont mind watching the occasional rugby match. Im a big manchester united fan and queen of the south (scottish team). I kinda went off it during high school cos in primary school i got bullied a lot for being the only female who played so i gave it up wen i got to high school cos the guys bullied me in primary went to my high school and i couldnt really take it ... anywayyy...

erm i know being a man is a state of mind, but iv found that making guy friends and moving from just having female friends, getting into the same stuff as them, which can be typical sports and other stuff. iv found this place is the easiest way to meet people with similar interests and found it hard in the real world, i would have to admit out all the guys i know, only one of em is someone i would consider a friend that i have a lot in common with.

Also, i like to be informed about things and learn about stuff i never knew about, like snowboarding, or baseball. always good to learn something new

August 6, 2010

I'd love to know bout fishing! my dad and uncles took me deep sea fishing and i got really into it but dont know a lot about bait and fish lol

Im a big manchester united fan

Manchester united are the greatest!

I'd like to see what it's like to go fishing. Not sure what I'd do with the fish after though. I'm... weird about eating fish. But it looks really relaxing. I'd be mocked within family for saying that. But meh. See it does look like they're doing nothing and that it looks like you're just sat there. But that to me sounds great.

August 6, 2010

Once the loft is finished, me and my dad are gonna build my sister a desk. its gonna be a challenge because each piece can only be 60cm wide and my sister is an art student and works with all sorts of materials and A1 pieces of paper for her design work, and u cant get anything like what she needs flatpacked so me n my dad are gonna construct it. iv got an idea on where to start but im just a diy enthusiast so my skills are limited lol

Lego is amazing! and ikea has made my lift a little easier while iv been building my bedroom lol built a dvd tower myself and my own desk that is built into a built in wardrobe that i gutted first. but obviously beds and wardrobes are a bit more advanced for me

Build your sister this:

http://www.ericharshbarger.org/lego/desk.html

August 6, 2010

erm i know being a man is a state of mind, but iv found that making guy friends and moving from just having female friends, getting into the same stuff as them, which can be typical sports and other stuff. iv found this place is the easiest way to meet people with similar interests and found it hard in the real world, i would have to admit out all the guys i know, only one of em is someone i would consider a friend that i have a lot in common with.

Also, i like to be informed about things and learn about stuff i never knew about, like snowboarding, or baseball. always good to learn something new

yeah, I also wanna make more guy friends and find people with similar interests in the "real world" vs. just trans people or here on LP (don't get me wrong, i love LP, but I gotta be a part of society IRL too!) You do have to establish some sort of a baseline of commonalities in order to make friends. Which is kinda what I am trying to develop - things that I would have in common with other guys. I've had a hard time making friends pretty much since puberty age - like once girls were about 9-10 years old I began to feel isolated b/c the girls would hang out amongst themselves and I didn't really fit in, and then the guys also began to hang out amongst themselves and I didn't fit in there either b/c I always felt like it was this club I couldn't be a part of, and that I had to interact as female - which I really couldn't (still can't) do.

August 6, 2010

Manchester united are the greatest!

I'd like to see what it's like to go fishing. Not sure what I'd do with the fish after though. I'm... weird about eating fish. But it looks really relaxing. I'd be mocked within family for saying that. But meh. See it does look like they're doing nothing and that it looks like you're just sat there. But that to me sounds great.

GLORY GLORY MAN UNITED!! GLORY GLORY MAN UNITED!!

haha

i found it very relaxing tbh. i wasnt sure about eating em after cos id seen the living thing before it, but it was tasty! its fun fishing for mackerel cos u do have to move the feathers up and down through the water. it all depends on what your fishing for. thats all i know.. when we wer fishing for cod, you just put the bait on and left it. it was very male bonding cos there was some time to laugh and joke and chat about jobs n uni etc and then there was the gutting which felt kinda stoneage lol! although i wish someone had warned me when u hook a fish and try n unhook, it tends too poo on u lol and no one warns u of the smell of it wen u gut them lol that does take ur breath away.

the best fish we gutted was the dog fish but the explanation i was gonna give why is a bit graphic lol!

August 6, 2010

I'd love to know bout fishing! my dad and uncles took me deep sea fishing and i got really into it but dont know a lot about bait and fish lol

I basically taught myself fishing. My grndad was a master fly fisherman but wouldn't teach a girl-especially one with ADHD. But I watched what he used and where and when Basically it's about observation and practice.

I have only gone sea fishing twice so what I know is all fresh water.

I've qualified for Master Angler in Largemouth Bass, Smallmouth Bass, Bluegill, Crappie, Carp, Northern Pike and Flathead Catfish in different states.

There are tons of good books and cheap on eBay to give you the basics. From there it's practice and experience. Lots of observation. I'd say rule number one in not making a fool of yourself is not showing up with a lot of flashy doodad tackle. Just because it looks awesome doesn't mean it works and I've had many a snicker at some city dude with a couple of thousand dollars in tackle flailing around while I caught fish after fish. I really loved the sizzle and increasing flush as they throw out increasingly flashy and ridiculous lures only to come up empty.

My very favorite way to fish is top water-having a monster bass smash up through the surface to grab your lure is like nothing else on earth. Taking really big Northern Pike is also a thrill you never get used to.

The ironic thing is that I really hate fish -even fresh wild trout so I just catch and release unless someone who can't fish asks for some.

JJ

August 6, 2010

For me, making friends with guys comes pretty easy. If I am in a room with 10 strangers - 5 male, 5 female, I am far more likely to get along with one or more of the guys and start building a friendship. I think age is part of it though (given who I encounter, I'm befriending adult men, not teenagers). I switched schools at age 10, which was horrible, because I slowly lost touch with all the guy friends I already had, right when it gets awkward for everyone, so I know what you guys are saying. I think I wound up with more gay guys as friends as part of that - we were going through similar things.

People my age of all genders and orientations complain that making new friends is hard in general. You don't have college or university to meet people, hang out, etc. You find less and less in common with old friends, as you each move through different life stages.

What I see happening in my life is that I make friends by doing the stuff I like. I have my friends I snowboard with. Friends I play hockey with. Guys I get to know at the gym or doing MMA training. I used to keep to myself and not tell anyone anything personal about me, but I realized that I was short-changing myself and underestimating guys around me. I have a friend who went through a painful divorce and he could not have gotten through it without his teammates. I have friends who find friends in LGBTQ-friendly sports leagues, which actually gets all types of people. If you're into music, that can mean finding bandmates or people to go to shows or venues with. Etc. If you're still in schoool, check out the clubs and hobbies for people who naturally have stuff in common with you.

I don't think anyone should try to get interested in stuff they don't like. But I think it's good to focus on the stuff you like and find other guys who like the same stuff. If it is gender-stereotypical male, it should be easy, because there are actually a lot of guys out there to meet. Some will be cool. Some will not. Be careful, be smart, and you can find people. If it is gender-stereotypically female, it's actually a good chance to meet people too. Guys who like things that most guys don't like (e.g., let's say sewing or opera or whatever) also have to develop thick-skin about doing what they like and what's important to them, and they may be receptive to meeting other guys into the same stuff. You'll meet them as "my cooking/sewing/whatever friend" not as "a trans person."