When You Have Fully Transitioned...are You Still A 'transsexual?

[Guest Zenda]

Kia Ora,

Any old excuse to use those lovely emoticons

Well, it's an age old forum debate, it's a personal choice, so there shouldn't be any ...Just your reasons behind why you feel or the way you do about the 'trans' label...

Is it just a 'medical' condition that when treated[transitioned]is resolved or something more????

Metta Zenda

[Guest Elizabeth K]

I feel I have transitioned, 'cause I am a woman like I have always been, and now people see me that way. There is more to do but hey, there are no pantie checks after you transition... grin.

And if people don't agree, I don't care. I am what I am...

Lizzzzzzzy

[JenniferB]

After physical transition I will probably still say I'm a transsexual because there is a part of me I can't hide. But after SRS I would give up the transsexual label and be the woman I am.

Jenny

[Guest Zenda]

Kia Ora...

OK,so a little 'light' is OK,[questioning the whys and why nots] just so long as we all remain one big family ...

For example Jenny, are you saying that 'transsexual' is more about 'who' you are and not so much about it being a medical 'condition'[congenital condition]like a birth defect that can be corrected?

I ask this because many sufferers fully 'transition' and begin to live full time 24/7/365, but for whatever reasons can't/don't have 'surgery'!

Metta Zenda

[Guest Robin Winter]

Mmmmm....I'm gonna have to go with yes. Being transsexual, to me, is a physical descriptor, and medical science hasn't yet reached the point where we can *fully* transition. For MtF, things like the prostate stay, we don't get ovaries and a uterus, we don't self-lubricate (or so I understand). I strongly believe complete physical transition will someday be possible, but we're not there yet.

[Guest Zenda]

Kia Ora Shilo,

I guess age and sexual desires[age being more important] would also play a part in ones decision especially as far as the things you feel are lacking goes ...

However as for myself, I'm what one would call a 'neo-asexual' that is my sexual orientation[or lack of one]blossomed along with my metamorphosis [gradual change], it was always there and when I transitioned it came out of the closet too.

Also I'm fortunate to already have children so those internal[hidden] things are not an issue-that is, the general public are none the wiser what lies under the flesh, and personally I don't give it much thought after all, some natal women have these things removed ...

The surgery I had came with a 'self-lubricating' vagina=colonvaginoplasty-not that it's really of any great importance to me ...

Metta Zenda

[Guest Donna Jean]

.

I'm a woman.....

Transsexualism is the condition that I've suffered from....

My opinion is that I'll never be fully transitioned..

But, I'm far enough...,,,

What does the world see and react to now?

Me.....just 'lil 'ole me....

Donna Jean

[Guest Elizabeth K]

.

I'm a woman.....

Transsexualism is the condition that I've suffered from....

My opinion is that I'll never be fully transitioned..

But, I'm far enough...,,,

What does the world see and react to now?

Me.....just 'lil 'ole me....

Donna Jean

HEY! You stole my reply!

Lizzy

[Guest Robin Winter]

Kia Ora Shilo,

I guess age and sexual desires[age being more important] would also play a part in ones decision especially as far as the things you feel are lacking goes ...

However as for myself, I'm what one would call a 'neo-asexual' that is my sexual orientation[or lack of one]blossomed along with my metamorphosis [gradual change], it was always there and when I transitioned it came out of the closet too.

Also I'm fortunate to already have children so those internal[hidden] things are not an issue-that is, the general public are none the wiser what lies under the flesh, and personally I don't give it much thought after all, some natal women have these things removed ...

The surgery I had came with a 'self-lubricating' vagina=colonvaginoplasty-not that it's really of any great importance to me ...

Metta Zenda

I'm so glad you shared that with me. I was going to say something about that particular procedure, but I wasn't sure if what I'd heard about it was true. Do you know if that surgery is much more expensive than the standard version? I only usually hear people talk about the normal method and related costs. It sort of is important to me, though not for the obvious reasons.

[Guest N. Jane]

"Trans" is a label I left behind 37 years ago and it played no part in my life thereafter. Aside from sticking my nose it at these forums, it is irrelevant in my own life.

[Guest Zenda]

Kia Ora Shilo,

Self-lubrication is meant to be one of the benefits of a Colonvaginoplasty, however this kind of procedure is more intrusive and prone to complications more so than the popular penal –inversion technique…

Here in Aotearoa [NZ] the cost was around $30.000 nz, however this was around 5 years ago, no doubt it would have gone up by now…

My surgery was 'government' funded - ‘Colonvaginoplasty’ was the only option on offer…We only have one Gender Identity Clinic in Aotearoa and it’s situated in Christchurch South Island. You are assessed by psycho-surgical team at the clinic, and the surgery is carried out by the three surgeons- a colon-rectal specialist a urologist and a plastic surgeon…I should point out that my surgery was over 5 years ago and I've not had any problems so I'm

http://www.plasticsurgery.co.nz/

I hope this is of some help...

Metta Zenda

[Guest Orva26]

I haven't really done any transitioning physically yet but I think I won't be dropping the Trans label, for a different reason. I have no current plans for surgery but desire HRT and social transition. And if that is my end point the descriptor of being a transgendered person would fit me best. Even if I did go for GRS/SRS I would still keep the label. TS/TG might be a medical condition but it would be one I had and I would recognize that in the same token as people who are proud to have conquered more classical illnesses.

In regards to colonvaginoplasty pretty much everything I was going to say has been mentioned. There is a higher risk of complication but also I've heard that the self lubricating can be a double edged sword. Occasionally it becomes uncontrollable and permanent leakage results. Don't mean to gross anyone out just thought it was a fact that should be mentioned.

-Orva

[Paula ult]

I have fully transitioned, all except GCS which is in a few months, I consider myself to be a women, i have always been a women even though i never looked much like one on the outside, for those that knew me before i will always be that person who transitioned from a man to a women, to those that do not know of my past i am a women, i consider this a medical condition which does have a cure.

Paula

[Sally]

Kia Ora, Zenda

that is kind of hard for me, not the question - that's easy but calling you anything besides Jendar is what's hard for me.

But on this subject I have said from the very beginning that I dislike labels so I do not consider myself to be a transsexual as that is a label that I do not care for very much, I have always felt more female than male and now that I have been on HRT for 17 months I feel that I have been losing those uncomfortable feelings about not belonging in this body - as it changes so does my attitude toward living in it.

OK, I do not really consider myself to still be trans when I am in female mode but I do in male mode - I hope that makes sense but I see myself as female completely now without any surgery, someday i would hope to have it but if I can never afford it or I am told that it would kill me I could live the rest of my life happily just as I am - me not trans me, just me.

Love ya,

Sally

[Guest Jenni_S]

Hi Zenda,

After a few years experience now, I'm saying "Yes." The transitional period was a unique experience, and is truly a transsexual experience. Just like the life I lived before, I don't want to forget it or hide it; those experiences are what made me the person I am today. It's been rough, it's a trying, trying experience, but now having done what I have, I'm glad I did. And that's a transsexual life, I don't think it goes away.

Then, of course, there's everyone else. No matter what you do, you will ALWAYS be "the girl that had the sex change." It won't matter that you've done everything you should, or how long it's been. Someone will come along and use the incorrect pronoun. Or your old name shows up in the mail again. No matter how much you feel you've fit your "new role," there's always going to be something that happens to bring back your origins. It may happen less and less frequently, but it'll happen!

Now am I going to run around wearing a sign saying "transsexual?" No. I'm not going to trumpet this fact to everyone. I won't hide it either, though, if someone asks. I just don't think it "goes away."

[Guest NatashaJade]

I don't see the word "transsexual" as a noun, but an adjective. Will it describe me once I've shed the last outward vestige of my male life? I'll say right now, from where I am, that it will not. It is a condition that we can cure ourselves of and potentially move on. I will not deny what my life has been, but I see no need to wear a T around my neck either.

xoxo

Tasha

[Guest Elizabeth K]

"Trans" is a label I left behind 37 years ago and it played no part in my life thereafter. Aside from sticking my nose it at these forums, it is irrelevant in my own life.

I think that is also my default setting. It seems natural to let go of all this and just be me. I am not exactly ashamed to have been gender dysphoric and to have transitioned, and if someone asked I would probably explain, but I am never going to voluntarily bring up my old life.

At age 63 I WISH I was 37 years past. BUT I am shooting for maybe 20 to 30 years - when I will die myself, Elizabeth Anne Jenkins on my headstone - woman born, woman lived, woman died.

Lizzy

[Drea]

If you asked me 10 years or so ago while I was still in that post transition phase I would have said something like "I am simply a woman, like any other woman and always had been a woman in mind if not body. Being trans was simply a medical issue which is now corrected.".

I tend to view it a bit different these days. After so many years living as a woman I have learned that there are more subtlties and depth among genetic women. Many which are a result from shared life experiences and socialization from being very young right through teen years. Experiences which I will never have. Socialization which as an adult which will never be the same.

While I have shared many of the experiences other woman experience as an adjult and learned much socialization through the years, its just not the same. I knew of many things intellectually even in the early days, but that is very different from direct experience and the emotional impact. I feel I have evolved significantly yet have missed out on things good and bad.

Over the years I came to find that early self delcaration to be misplaced. That now I am much more the woman I wished to be and that person I was right after transition was immature and unevolved. That those self declarations, while working for me at the time, had actually inhibited me from being open to growth and development. I also feel now that such self declarations were a product of my therapy talking and had some roots in self esteem and insecurity issues.

So thest days, while I don't like to view myself as transsexual or a transsexual woman because I just don't define myself that way, I do recognize that if someone were to know my past, that they would view me that way. That doesn't bother me, it is just a product of my past. So these days I don't worry about too much about labels. I tend to think of myself as a woman with a unique past which leaves me with a slightly different view. Not better, not worse, but slightly different.

[Guest jamiejcmo]

After a few months full-time the rest of the world is seeing me as female all the time and I feel female with the exception of that birth defect down there. Someday it will be gone! I can't say I am a woman yet because I have so much to learn still. Socially I am learning faster than I can keep up with but I am learning. 99% of the world doesn't know that I used to live as male and I can live with that.

[Guest Donna Jean]

Now am I going to run around wearing a sign saying "transsexual?" No. I'm not going to trumpet this fact to everyone. I won't hide it either, though, if someone asks. I just don't think it "goes away."

Yup!

I'm 60.....

I've lived...can't be denied...

We all have different life experiences, rates of maturity, depth of acceptance and level of comfort....

Live your life........period!

Donna Jean

[Guest Elizabeth K]

Over the years I came to find that early self declaration to be misplaced. That now I am much more the woman I wished to be and that person I was right after transition was immature and unevolved. That those self declarations, while working for me at the time, had actually inhibited me from being open to growth and development. I also feel now that such self declarations were a product of my therapy talking and had some roots in self esteem and insecurity issues.

I think this might be too narrow a view of what women are. What you believe happened might be somewhat unique and it could be a determent to how you view yourself.

First I suggest there are women who don't have socialization opportunities. I have a natal female cousin who grew up on a dairy. Her mother left when she was very young. Her one sister was way to much younger to socialize with, and she was surrounded by boys and men. It this case, she has had to find her own way, and I suspect many natal women have to do that. Socialization is as difficult for the non-trans sometimes, as it is with us

And then in my case. I was deeply socialized in a woman's world. My mother, two aunts, both grandmothers were all 'alpha' and ran their families. The few men I was around were rather shy and rarely aggressive. AND I would play with my sisters, and the girls in the neighborhood, until forced by threats feom my father to seek male friends. I never had those male friends in the numbers I had my girl friends. My sisters and I grew up very much female. And in high school and college, neither male or female socialization was for me. So I just married people I identified with... grin.

And then consider this: Women - all women have a desire to be something more: prettier, taller, smarter wealthier, more feminine... just like all men do with their perceived male ideal. There is no typical woman.

So an MTF can only say she is a woman - it may not be a typical woman (whatever that is) but it 'is' a woman.

I relate to women, socialize with women, and interact with women as one of them. When mainly male bodied, it was somewhat tenuous for a while, and then I would be accepted. But I was always accepted. I have a woman's mindset, always have, always will. Now my body matches what I am to a greater degree, I can usually just skip a step or two and fit in.

I guess the point is, be careful not to think of yourself as being less than a 'real woman.' It will make you unhappy.

What IS a real woman?' Why simple... look in the mirror.

Just me...

Lizzy

[Drea]

Over the years I came to find that early self declaration to be misplaced. That now I am much more the woman I wished to be and that person I was right after transition was immature and unevolved. That those self declarations, while working for me at the time, had actually inhibited me from being open to growth and development. I also feel now that such self declarations were a product of my therapy talking and had some roots in self esteem and insecurity issues.

I think this might be too narrow a view of what women are. What you believe happened might be somewhat unique and it could be a determent to how you view yourself.

I appreciate the concern however I see it as growth and learning. Going from one belief "transitioned and just a woman" to how much more I can developed. Recognizing traits and abilities I admired and wished to make part of myself. And a sign of my maturing and not feeling the need to make such a claim to be who I am.

I hope all are able to draw from their experience over time and continue to develop as a person. As I have mentioned before, I think there is a great deal of maturing that goes on after "transition". The standards talk of one year of RLE/RLT, which is a time of great development, but a year is just the tip of the iceberg.

I guess the point is, be careful not to think of yourself as being less than a 'real woman.' It will make you unhappy.

I dont' know if that is your take on what I said because that wasn't what I was saying. I would say that MTF are far more likely to fall into the trap of thinking they are better than genetic women. Or to think they know what womanhood is all about and unwhittingly act in ways that are more offensive to women than not.

I can think of example after example of direct statements of MTF saying how they are better than genetic women. Not to mention the indirect statements or expressions of the same. Or sometimes makeing a statement which suggest they have a low opinion of the capability of women. I have seen it extent of being so focused on their own self promotion and validation as women using the advantages of their birth to displace women who didn't have those advantage.

As a woman, I tend to find myself somewhat disturbed at times when I see that sort of thing happen.

Regardless, if one thinks they have developed as much as they can, know it all, they will stop learning. And that was the theme of what I was saying. What I recognized as being wrong with my self declaration of being a woman.

There is so much more out there to learn after all.

[Guest KimberlyF]

This is one of those questions I only really think about here or in therapy. And in therapy it's more about how I'd live if I fully transitioned-in the open or stealth or somewhere in the middle? Other than that it's really just one more label to put on people I guess.

This is just my view and of course, YMMV (and prob will). I will always be a transsexual women. It is not the type of thing I would lead with at parties. "Kim F. Transsexual woman. Gosh darned glad to meet you." It is a medical diagnosis. I don't ever envision a point in my life where my MD does not know about my past. Since I will be on drugs for this condition the rest of my life, I have not been cured even if I've found peace. I mean if hypothetically my current doctor leaves the practice and I have to find a new one 20 years down the road after I'm finished with everything I could ever do on this journey I wouldn't be sitting around the office on day one at the new doctors office thinking, hmmm I was born in a male body and now I'm sitting here with breasts and a vagina living full time as a woman for decades but I still need a script or two for my condition and I wish there was a way I could explain this to her without going on and on about my life again. Oh wait, I'm a post-op transsexual woman.

I am a woman. I am a transsexual woman. Who I tell is my business. There is no cure. There is a treatment that seems to be effective. It's like most women with Turner Syndrome. They have underdeveloped ovaries and a missing or misshapen X chromosome. If caught early enough changes can be made hormonally so that they will look more 'female' by societies standards with the breasts and curves even though they're female anyway of course, but if it isn't caught some of the effects lock in and the hormone treatment is a bit less effective, but either way most are on a lifetime of hormone treatment and are infertile. Hmmm...change 'most' to all in that bolded part and who else does that whole sentence sound like? They will have Turner Syndrome their whole life. That misshapen X chromosome isn't gonna fix itself.

But this is all years away and it sounds wonderful to get to a point where my biggest concern in dealing with this crap is what am I gonna call myself now that I'm not up all night like last night just thinking about this crap.

I can think of example after example of direct statements of MTF saying how they are better than genetic women.

I've noticed a couple of posts over the months here where an SO or two has actually posted that they're offended by something a MtF has stated.

Kim

[Guest Elizabeth K]

I can think of example after example of direct statements of MTF saying how they are better than genetic women. Not to mention the indirect statements or expressions of the same. Or sometimes makeing a statement which suggest they have a low opinion of the capability of women. I have seen it extent of being so focused on their own self promotion and validation as women using the advantages of their birth to displace women who didn't have those advantage.

I suppose there are all types of people in the world. Personally, in the gender variant community here in New Orleans, of which we trans are a part, I have not heard anyone MTF build themselves up by degrading women. The same goes with the FTM talking of men.

I suppose it could be happening, but if so its not common. BUT, I do get some feedback from the more militant Lesbian Community, saying we TGirls are not real women because we are not born with a vagina. This is fading somewhat as the Lesbian Community slowly begins to understand Gender Dysphoria.

And the Gay male Community does not 'get it' either. I suppose if they knew that a MTF is really a woman, those who hate women might react. Usually we TGirls are just an oddity to them.

Yet - my experience - across the board, those who degrade women are some of the genetic men, those who feel that they can be superior by discounting the female.

I have not heard of a MTF ever saying we are better than natal women. But there are crazies out there in the transworld, those with many-many unsettled issues.

Lizzy

[Guest Donna Jean]

I can think of example after example of direct statements of MTF saying how they are better than genetic women. Not to mention the indirect statements or expressions of the same. Or sometimes makeing a statement which suggest they have a low opinion of the capability of women. I have seen it extent of being so focused on their own self promotion and validation as women using the advantages of their birth to displace women who didn't have those advantage.

As a woman, I tend to find myself somewhat disturbed at times when I see that sort of thing happen.

As would I.....but, I don't ever recall hearing anyone (MTF) relate to it in that way.

While I've seen many Trans people talk on the point of having walked both sides of the gender fence, I cannot think of knowing of any MTF saying that they were better than a natal woman...

My experience only

Donna Jean