How to start

[K-pop]

Hey everyone!

 

So I’ve been reading up on vocal feminization for awhile now, but honestly there’s a lot of information out there and a lot of people seem to have different ideas on how best to start. I was just wondering what other people’s experiences were, if anyone knows how best to start out or which programs/trainers  they’d recommend. If it helps, I have a pretty deep voice naturally. I’d greatly appreciate any advice anyone can offer!

 

Thanks,

Kate

[Jackie C.]

I went with the Female Voice Club. It took about eighteen months, but it was well worth the effort I put into it. I'd also recommend an app that lets you track your pitch. It's not all about pitch, but it's nice that you can see it improving. An average woman speaks at about 220Hz. I speak at 210Hz (after training), though I can drop my voice when I need to. Training has really improved my range.

 

Hugs!

[SheenaT]

On 10/12/2020 at 8:28 AM, Jackie C. said:

I went with the Female Voice Club. It took about eighteen months, but it was well worth the effort I put into it. I'd also recommend an app that lets you track your pitch. It's not all about pitch, but it's nice that you can see it improving. An average woman speaks at about 220Hz. I speak at 210Hz (after training), though I can drop my voice when I need to. Training has really improved my range.

 

Hugs!

What is the app name?

[Jackie C.]

The app I use to check my range is Voice Pitch Analyzer from the Google Apps store. I've also got Voice Tools and Trans Tracks, but I don't use them as frequently.

 

Hugs!

[SheenaT]

1 hour ago, Jackie C. said:

The app I use to check my range is Voice Pitch Analyzer from the Google Apps store. I've also got Voice Tools and Trans Tracks, but I don't use them as frequently.

 

Hugs!

Thanks ?

[SheenaT]

2 hours ago, Jackie C. said:

The app I use to check my range is Voice Pitch Analyzer from the Google Apps store. I've also got Voice Tools and Trans Tracks, but I don't use them as frequently.

 

Hugs!

Got it thanks! Wow I need ALOT of practice.

[Jackie C.]

That's why I used it to track my progress through Female Voice Club. It's really hard to change your pitch by itself and there's a TON of feminine habits and markers to use. It's not just pitch and resonance. They're important, but not the whole show.

 

Some of the habits you might already have (varying my pitch for example, I'm surprised anybody EVER took me for a cis-man), some you might not (training myself not to go down at the end of every sentence was brutal), but there's a lot to learn and there's always plenty of room for improvement (I'm still working on enunciating my words with more precision).

 

It's a lot of work, but it really pays off. I had a hilarious conversation with someone pre name-change who could not deal with the idea that somebody that sounded like I do was attached to a very obviously male gendered name. I probably could have dropped into male register for him, but I really didn't want to.

 

Hugs!

[SheenaT]

1 hour ago, Jackie C. said:

That's why I used it to track my progress through Female Voice Club. It's really hard to change your pitch by itself and there's a TON of feminine habits and markers to use. It's not just pitch and resonance. They're important, but not the whole show.

 

Some of the habits you might already have (varying my pitch for example, I'm surprised anybody EVER took me for a cis-man), some you might not (training myself not to go down at the end of every sentence was brutal), but there's a lot to learn and there's always plenty of room for improvement (I'm still working on enunciating my words with more precision).

 

It's a lot of work, but it really pays off. I had a hilarious conversation with someone pre name-change who could not deal with the idea that somebody that sounded like I do was attached to a very obviously male gendered name. I probably could have dropped into male register for him, but I really didn't want to.

 

Hugs!

Money is one of my biggest hurdles. I just can't afford all of this.

[Jackie C.]

Really? I must be grossly informed on what executives make. I just keep remembering my (absolutely useless) manager in the 90's bemoaning that Clinton's tax-plan for people making less than $100K a year wouldn't help him. He nearly didn't leave the office alive that day.

 

Female voice club is from about $25 to $100 a month. I took the middle program. Eighteen months at about $50 a month. Lessons are all pre-recorded and you can send Nina samples of your voice and she'll send you feedback. You need to be something of a self-starter, but I just made it part of my routine.

 

All the apps I cited are free though. I'm not made of money either.

 

Hugs!

[Natalie99]

I recommend watching youtube videos about the topic. I'll send you some links.

 

She is really good at it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BW8X2nXexQs

 

They are good too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dO_4Pbbq6XY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ch5gBKsvSwo

 

She says that she only used youtube videos, and talks about an exercise at the end.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyUTAqvSTjM

[SheenaT]

4 hours ago, Natalie99 said:

I recommend watching youtube videos about the topic. I'll send you some links.

 

She is really good at it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BW8X2nXexQs

 

They are good too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dO_4Pbbq6XY

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ch5gBKsvSwo

 

She says that she only used youtube videos, and talks about an exercise at the end.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tyUTAqvSTjM

Thank you for these links.

[SheenaT]

21 hours ago, Jackie C. said:

Really? I must be grossly informed on what executives make. I just keep remembering my (absolutely useless) manager in the 90's bemoaning that Clinton's tax-plan for people making less than $100K a year wouldn't help him. He nearly didn't leave the office alive that day.

 

Female voice club is from about $25 to $100 a month. I took the middle program. Eighteen months at about $50 a month. Lessons are all pre-recorded and you can send Nina samples of your voice and she'll send you feedback. You need to be something of a self-starter, but I just made it part of my routine.

 

All the apps I cited are free though. I'm not made of money either.

 

Hugs!

?

[Natalie99]

20 hours ago, SheenaT said:

Thank you for these links.

You're welcome! ?

[PheonyxJayde]

On 2/21/2021 at 11:58 AM, SheenaT said:

Got it thanks! Wow I need ALOT of practice.

Me too! That tool is a wake up call indeed!

[swallow]

Thanks for starting this Thread K-Pop!?

 

I have a MAJOR Psychological hurdle with my voice.?

 

I feel like this is one area I need to find someone (preferably like me) for honest feed back.

 

My therapist had encouraged me to try my female voice on her but when it came to show time, no go.?

 

My go to safety in too many socio-business situations is to go deeper and deeper with my voice...don't know if its bc I think I will be taken more seriously or just nerves...I have ALWAYS hated? my low male voice (even if my Partner found it sexy)?...I blame this on my favorite Grandma (Bless her)☺️ who conspired with my mother to give me some special herbs (She was a 'Doctor of Eastern Medicine') to give me a deeper more manly voice at puberty (since likely I was too effeminate looking)?

 

I have the Voice Tools App (as she/Therapist recommended). I can hit the range and the pitch pretty well but have to work on sustaining it. I ditto on tailing downwards which I have to frequently watch out for.

 

The other issue of course is volume. One thing pracitising wee hours at night ?(when kids are gone to bed...hopefully?) and another in real world context trying to be loud enough to get heard without compromise to pitch etc...

 

One issue I have is whether to start slightly higher or more neutral.

 

Neutral of course is easier to sustain but then opens the door for 'bad habits' and lazy dropping off of voice back into male range the longer I go.

 

Higher pitch makes me work harder therefore avoid the trap of sub-conciously dropping off on voice but of course is harder to sustain so for Chatty Cathy like me is a whole different ball game to learn to be more selective and short with my responses etc...I'm like a different person.?

 

That's one reason prob why I don't quite yet feel 'myself' when employing feminine voice.

 

One thing I have resolve to try is to practise with Supermarket check outs/store clerks (Since invariably they are strangers and often times a different person, usually reasonably courteous as well since its customer service first). I've yet to do it successfully...I just keep freezing when comes time.?.

 

AND of course like today, as soon as I start to speak... (complaining about the price of a bag of cherries I wanted cancelled)....I forget to use 'the voice'.?...although at least in lower voice, I kept it classy and feminine if panicky?

 

Nominally for me to be effective (I kid you not) I 'fake' a Thai female greeting... 'Sawadee-Ka' (as feminine as possible complete with palms together and slight bow).? I don't know why since I am neither Thai (not that I know of anyway) nor conversant beyond the greeting (talk about cultural appropriation)...but somehow it automatically slots me into (start) 'position'. I mean I had great holidays in Thailand, had some excellent food there?...but that's it.

 

(Perhaps its a soft language? I quite like it)?

 

I also try to push my voice forward into my chest/front of throat. The Larynx exercise (keeping it up into the top of the throat also has double incentive of improving the jawline).? This seems to work well on many levels.

 

Anyway work in progress... I'm as lost (and likely nervous) as anyone-else of you trying to sound right.

 

But I'm also still trying?

 

 

[VickySGV]

Hint to help and practice -- get hold of some generic  singing lessons if you have not had them.  If you have had them go back and review them on pitch and volume control, and while you are at it, the way in which words are pronounced while singing. since that is going to be a more feminine sounding voice for the M2F voices.  I can give examples via the keyboard here, but the best way it just to do it.  I have almost bored people to tears telling them about my involvement with a Trans Chorus where I live and singing does, especially a feminine part makes you practice tonality which is, a big part of female voices.  A male voice says the word "HELLO" on only a single note or two notes of the same pitch.  A woman will use three notes for the word, with the final note two above the first one.  Sing, learn how and have fun.

[Jackie C.]

2 hours ago, swallow said:

I also try to push my voice forward into my chest/front of throat. The Larynx exercise (keeping it up into the top of the throat also has double incentive of improving the jawline).? This seems to work well on many levels.

 

Close! You want to move your voice out of your chest entirely. Try and speak out of your face/nose. That'll help you with your resonance. The larynx exercise is a good one, especially once you figure out how to breathe when you're doing it. ?

 

So yeah, female voice is your head-voice. The rest of it is just practice, practice, practice. The problem with those darn apps is that they never show resonance, just pitch. I sound lovely (ask Bri) at 210 Mhz by modifying my resonance. I CAN sound like a teamster (briefly, my muscles have changed to the point that sounding manly is difficult now), but my female voice is much more natural to me anymore.

 

Hugs!

[Jackie C.]

1 hour ago, VickySGV said:

get hold of some generic  singing lessons if you have not had them.

 

OOH, singing is GOOD. I practiced with intoning instead, but the principle is the same: Building endurance keeping your pitch where you want it.

 

Hugs!

[swallow]

Ooooo...the choir sure sounds tempting!?

 

Although I need to build up my nerve first, and I'm not yet on hormones or anything.

 

I'm trying to incorporate more singing in the shower...although we are having an issue with the consistency of the  hot water at the moment so I have to be mindful not to be in there for too long...?

 

I still don't really understand what resonance is...I need to watch those vids recommended again.

 

It will be great if I could get to the fabled land of my very own male vocal muscle dementia...?

 

 

[TJ]

Good info.  I have been kind of confused by the various advice given on YouTube videos.  Mostly what I have done is using voice pitch analyzer like others have recommended....and I sing on my way to work and home in the car in a high register and work on keeping my voice box up.  I have been doing this for a few months and it seems to be working at least to the point that I can keep my voice box up fairly easily now and I can reach a female pitch.  I also have been working with my therapist, trying to use my female voice in appointments with her.  She lets me know if I start to drop or whatever.

 

What I would like to know is "where do I go from here?"  To me at least my voice just sounds like a guy talking high...and doesn't have those "tonal"? qualities that make a person identify a voice as female.  I don't know how to practice those things I'm missing.  I also don't have the money right now to use services like "female voice club".  Any suggestions?

[Jackie C.]

Oh, those fiddly bits are tricky. Especially training yourself to not drop at the end of every sentence. That one almost broke me. Good on keeping your voice box up though, that's a great first step.

 

I think the trick is to break it up into smaller, more manageable chunks. First work on something like expanding your range (women speak in a much wider range of tones than men do, it's not dissimilar to singing). Once you've mastered that and you're doing it without thinking about it, move on to the next bit.

 

What are you working on right now?

 

Hugs!

[ValerieRun]

31 minutes ago, Jackie C. said:

expanding your range

I am still having hard time understanding this. What is the metric that corresponds to measuring the range? Is it just a fluctuation of pitch? And how wide is wide? Are there any acceptable/baseline widths?

[Jackie C.]

So I just hunted through my notes and found jack-all for a quick and dirty graphic (that wasn't copyrighted), but generally you want to average (around) 220 Hz (I'm averaging 210 Hz, I know cis-women who are lower. Maybe 100 Hz on either side of that. Here's a good exercise: Sing what you're trying to say for practice. It'll sound goofy, but it'll give you an idea of how women talk.

 

From what you're telling me, you might also be having resonance problems. Can you tell me where your voice is coming from when you talk? A woman talks through her face. You should be able to feel the vibration under your fingers if your put them to either side of your nose.

 

A man speaks from the chest. Again, singing. People who sing know the difference between chest-voice and head-voice. Women, with their smaller voice boxes, don't speak from the chest.

 

Hugs!

[Billie75B]

Thats great info Jackie thank you for your incite 

[TJ]

1 hour ago, Jackie C. said:

Oh, those fiddly bits are tricky. Especially training yourself to not drop at the end of every sentence. That one almost broke me. Good on keeping your voice box up though, that's a great first step.

 

I think the trick is to break it up into smaller, more manageable chunks. First work on something like expanding your range (women speak in a much wider range of tones than men do, it's not dissimilar to singing). Once you've mastered that and you're doing it without thinking about it, move on to the next bit.

 

What are you working on right now?

 

Hugs!

Thanks Jackie for your help.  Currently I am still working on keeping pitch up, resonance down and voicebox high...mostly because I wasn't sue what to do next.  Expanding my range sounds like a good thing to work on, but I'm not sure how to go about practicing it.  I think it may be happening a little bit by itself as I practice the other things, but I wish I had some examples to practice repeating or something like that.