Hatred towards transsexualism

[serpentil1]

Seems like there is a lot of hatred from the transgenders against the transsexuals. This is just from my experience of course. Being banned from any transgender forum just because you mention that you have the diagnosis transsexualism... and I've tried several places. I don't understand. What harm is it that we do to you guys just by existing? I don't know exactly what transgender means - fair enough, but considering that transsexual means needing to change ones sex, I assume that transgender means needing to change ones gender, or in simpler words change ones brain. If this is correct, then even though they could be considered opposites, they could also be considered the same - since the brain is also a part of the body. So shouldn't we be able to find common ground in the whole trans aspect?

[Carolyn Marie]

I'm sorry to hear that you've had those experiences in other forums.  Maybe it's a European thing.  In this forum we really don't differentiate between the two.  We consider transgender an umbrella term that covers just about everything.  In the U.S., transsexual is usually considered an out of date term that isn't used, or heard, much.  But for me, and most here, it is not a cause for derision or negativity. 

 

I've actually not heard that explanation for transsexual vs. transgender.  To me, changing one's sex is the same as changing one's gender.  It requires the same medical procedure(s), whether HRT or surgery.  It is a distinction without a difference.  Bottom line is that whatever you call yourself, you are welcome here as long as you abide by the Community Rules.  😄

 

Carolyn Marie

[serpentil1]

Hi, 

Thanks Carolyn for your answer. Funny if it's a European thing, can they ever stop lol??? I still don't fully understand why transgender is a more positive term than transsexual. As I read, transgender is supposed to be an umbrella term that includes even transsexuals, however this rarely seems to be the case. I think the term transgender in order to describe me would be derogatory since it implies that I need to change my gender even though it's always been correct when it's just my body that's been wrong. Whenever I mention that I'm a transsexual in the transgenders forums it fuels people into all sorts of anger. It's like they can consider me and my diagnosis to be derogatory but they stole our word and repurposed it for a wider audience and block any of us who the word came from. Off topic but blessings to all our forefathers/mothers who have made sure that we still are alive and can sort of live until this day. You are my everything. 

[VickySGV]

34 minutes ago, Carolyn Marie said:

I've actually not heard that explanation for transsexual vs. transgender.

 

@serpentil1 I can give one explanation for the difference.  The term Transsexual over here on the American continent was grabbed and held hostage by a group of Trans people who insisted that they were the only ones to whom "Trans" itself could be applied, they HAD TO HAVE been diagnosed specifically for the condition, and many also referred to it as Harry Benjamin Syndrome, for which BOTH hard core injectable hormones and the most complicated (at the time) SEX CHANGE surgery were mandates to be part of their following, now days called TRUSCUM.  They also required their adherents to NEVER let any person know you were anything other than your desired gender. It had to be, life long total stealth living with those who could out you and deny you were born fully a female being the vilest enemies and people who did not go the ultimate total surgical routes to be sexual perverts imperiling the lives of  "True Transsexuals"

 

On the other side of issues, with American Continents Cis people being real touchy about the word "Sex" being a horror driven realm of imagination, using the term Transsexual was interpreted to mean it was ALL about the worst type of depraved sexual urges involving men who wanted to have sex with men as a woman who would and steal a man's sacred bodily secretion from use by Cis women.  This is something that is still with us today, and why those who are Non-Surgical, and in some cases, non-Hormone, rejecting the Transsexual label and instead making it about your life in a total gender body using Transgender. that was not what the doctor or midwife at your birth guess that you were.

 

The hatred you are shown from some of the Transgender Labeled folks is that they were denied their place by the old TRUSCUM groups who could be vicious and brutal to those who would not live their ideal of life.  Here, You can BE YOU, we do understand and keep it friendly for others.  The old sticky group has not been here since before I got here, and their stuff was lost long ago in a server crash.

 

[serpentil1]

Just want to explain the situation, I don't want a fight, I just want people to show each other respect. No hatred, just love and if capability is there, understanding. But love is the one thing that everyone who is alive has, I believe, whether you're in a coma, have severe dementia or not. I'm asking questions so that I can be more understanding and maybe say the right words so that I don't get banned wherever I go for uttering the word transsexual. I want to be a transgender. Maybe I'm transtransgender? Although I just want to be a cisman mostly so transcisman would be more correct. Regardless I'm tired with being alone with all this and would like to make friends who are similar or different, I don't care, honesty is all that matters.

[serpentil1]

Didn't read your last post before posting sorry. You're funny and the explanation makes sense and your post is very good. I understand things much better now I will tell you. You're way better than wikipedia 🤗

 

I still believe that the term transsexual is relevant and that those who belong to this group should be treated with equal respect. Sex = genitals. If you're transsexual you need to change your sex. Transgender I don't know and don't feel comfortable being labled as such. And also, to have this wide variety of people who need so much medical help in order to survive compared to those who need none and to put them all together into one single term, it's a bit strange to me but more importantly is telling people off who need actual help. I'm beyond saving but I'm pretty sure I'm not the only transsexual in the world. The people who are left need a safe place to speak. What's making matters bad is that the transgenders have different goals that they are striving for, make use of the word trans, and making sure that their little agendas are being served like for example; having their special pronouns being depicted in their passports, when transsexuals want to maybe lets say raise the question of developing better genital surgery or lets say put more money into research into transsexuals so that the poor bastard who come after us maybe will get treatment before they have to suffer through childhood and teenage years without it. 

[Sally Stone]

Interestingly, I joined this forum because the previous one I belonged to, as a longtime member, I might add, chastised me and censured a post of mine when I used the word transsexual.  The post was about labels and how they can be helpful when we are struggling to describe ourselves.  I intended no malice nor was I being biased while using the term, yet I was told I couldn't use it and if I did again, I would be banned from the website.

 

I was flabbergasted and decided immediately, I didn't want to belong to a site that openly practiced overreaching censorship.  I believe the site in question was an American website.  

[serpentil1]

Thanks Sally, 

It's strange why it is like that. We're the core of the community but we're being burnt like we're the -crap- that hasn't been properly flushed out of the toilet yet. This is exactly the response that I've been getting. Sad to find out I'm not alone. But also thankful that I'm not alone.

[serpentil1]

Have no friends in "real life" maybe there's a reason for that. I just want to make friends. Trying to find a place where I will be accepted. Not very easy apparently. When I'm not even accepted because of what I am then how could I even possibly get to the stage of being accepted due to my moral standing or god forbid my personality.

[serpentil1]

it must be way off

[AllieJ]

Language and terminology evolves over time, and will continue to do so. People will weaponise both as it seems to be a regrettable human trait. While I personally don't subscribe to any description, I realise that there is a practical need for various reasons.

 

My medical charts have Transgender marked on them, as doctors need to know I have different needs to cis people. When I need to quickly describe myself I use the term Transwoman so the recipient has some idea who I am, and I don't need to give long winded explanations.

 

While I know people will misuse them, I believe the terminology we use needs refinement. Transgender infers crossing between genders, but many of us aren't. Our Gender Identity was born in us, and we are just trying to become congruent. We can't change our Gender Identity, so some of us alter our genitals, or sex organs. So Transsexual seems more appropriate. 

 

As an umbrella term, I prefer the term Gender Diverse. It doesn't imply one or the other, or transiting between the two. It doesn't imply a binary at all, but a diversity which encompasses all. From there, we could break it down into groups who are questioning, fascinated, expressive, closeted, socially transitioning, or medically transitioning (their secondary sex). This may help many have better understanding, and could improve our treatment in society, but, could also be used against us.

 

It is sad that people with similar interests to our own engage in tribalism and hate, but this seems to be part of human nature. It is why I don't like flags, and shy away from terms, but I can see an overall benefit in better understanding across the whole community. 

 

@Sally Stone I am a member of that forum you mentioned, and have been moderated many times for trying to help others, to the point that I have drifted away like many others. This forum seems to manage the balance between respect and free thought quite well, with the benefit to members being the priority, not to enforce personal beliefs. 

 

Hugs,

 

Allie

[VickySGV]

9 hours ago, serpentil1 said:

still believe that the term transsexual is relevant and that those who belong to this group should be treated with equal respect.

Stay here and @Carolyn Marie , myself @MaryEllen, @Petra Jane as Administrators and all the Moderators will see that that happens, since our rules here call for the RESPECT of all other members.  Edit your profile's signature line like I have done to mine, and tell us there what your Label is, and what your pronouns and titles should be and all of us will honor that information.  I do not always fit one particular label, but that is me and I will get grumpy if that is not honored, but I try to respect the dignity of every other person here which prevents me from deliberately misusing what dignifies another person.

[awkward-yet-sweet]

12 hours ago, Carolyn Marie said:

We consider transgender an umbrella term that covers just about everything.  In the U.S., transsexual is usually considered an out of date term that isn't used, or heard, much.  But for me, and most here, it is not a cause for derision or negativity. 

 

I've actually not heard that explanation for transsexual vs. transgender.  To me, changing one's sex is the same as changing one's gender.  It requires the same medical procedure(s), whether HRT or surgery.  It is a distinction without a difference.  Bottom line is that whatever you call yourself, you are welcome here as long as you abide by the Community Rules.  😄

 

I'll echo this ^^^😊 

 

I've seen that transgender is the preferred term, although some folks still use the other word.  I guess they are kind of interchangeable?  I don't think anybody here will have an issue with what word is used.  Its more about tone and context which reveal intent.  And while English is the standard language here, there's people from around the world from different cultures.  I certainly don't expect everybody to use the same words that I do, and I understand that people may not always read what I write exactly how I meant it.  We work it out and try to be polite. 

 

To me, there is a nuance between transsexual and transgender.  Can you change your sex?  Well, I guess that's what surgeries do.  I mean, sometimes they're called "sex reassignment surgery."  Surgeries and hormones change physical function and appearance.  Gender is intimately linked to sex, but goes beyond the physical to encompass feelings, mental health, social role, etc.  Sex reassignment is a component of gender transition, but it isn't the whole.  And there's folks like me who adjust role and appearance, but without significantly changing hormones or undergoing medical procedures.  So, am I transsexual?  The way I see it, I guess not.  As my body has been  anatomically between sexes since birth, the term "intersex" is a better fit for me.  Am I transgender?  As I started life identified as female but I'm now more aligned with male appearance, that term is probably a better fit (although not 100%). 

 

Words are complicated!  Patience and goodwill can succeed where language falters.

 

 

 

[Louise B]

I like "gender diverse" as the umbrella term.  The problem with TG being an umbrella term is a bit like saying New York:  Do you mean a city or a state?  

 

When a person has a brain/soul/identity in conflict with their assigned gender, we call them transgender.  Simple enough.  But then we also call transgender the people who are anywhere from erotic crossdressers to men who want forced feminization as a means of being humiliated.  And these people generally have no interest in becoming a woman.  In fact, many are repulsed by such a thought.

 

I really have nothing against any of those people.  That is their thing.  OK.  But if TG is an umbrella term, then what term expresses who I am clearly enough that I am express the difference between me and these other people?

[Marieh]

On 12/9/2023 at 3:38 PM, serpentil1 said:

Seems like there is a lot of hatred from the transgenders against the transsexuals. This is just from my experience of course. Being banned from any transgender forum just because you mention that you have the diagnosis transsexualism... 

I think it might be that  word 'transsexualism' as in 'ism'. 

 

I'm  not  sure why this hasn't been noticed  before. It's not a European  thing. 'Ism' implies it's political or extrem'ism'. 

 

Right now there's a religious  bigot in prison in Ireland. He is happy there  because he sees himself as a marytr because of his objection to Transgenderism. He's a fool because he's in prison for something entirely different. 

 

Transgenderism implies some sort of political agenda like  racism or activism. 

 

I'm  not sure if the  OP understands  this? 

 

This and no other  website that I  know of involving trans people are actively politicising being  trans. 

 

I should point out that that transgenderism is a false misrepresentation of who we are. 

 

I seen it described as 'militant transexuals'. A bizarre  idea.

 

Terminology is important.

 

 

[Ashley0616]

You have been born a certain way and CAN change how you are perceived on the outside straight from Merriam-Webster:

 

Gender Identity: a person's internal sense of being male, female, some combination of male and female, or neither male nor female

 

Sex: either of the two major forms of individuals that occur in many species and that are distinguished respectively as female or male especially on the basis of their reproductive organs and structures

 

You aren't able to change your sex. This however doesn't mention intersex but a medical professional will look at your genes and then determine which is wrong on so many levels.